Build Thread K-Slot Rear Loaded Horn for Tangband W8-1772

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#62
Bill Woods of Acoustichorn is backlogged on commercial design and doesn't have any time to participate. One thing in my opinion is to sort out is how well 1772 is playing (by means of graphs) in Bill's K-slot rear-horn vs the Lowther and Fostex drivers he tested. Maybe Scottmoose is the man to ask for new K/Fulmer blh design. (being unfamiliar with fine points of blh design and out of curiosity and honor to the past, I would try regular Karlson coupler for 1772, etc. - the old "Karlsonette"/K12 seems friendly to 8" fullrange)
 
#66
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#67
zobsky said:
Agreed

I found my measuring gear last night and will take some FR measurements tonight

After that , it's going to be FM radio for a few days with drivers out of cabinet
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You can leave them in the cabinets, face them at each other and connect them out of phase. This works extremely well and keeps noise levels quite low. Pink noise would be a bit better, and if you have a pc you can download arta and run it in demo mode using the arta generator to produce continuous pink noise. (Audiotester.de another option, but as I have the licensed version I am not sure what the capabilities of the demo version would be.)

I have been running my FE-167 based HCC at around 1Wrms per driver - facing each other and out of phase, the noise if you line things up carefully is low enough that it should not be obtrusive.
 
#68
Late last night, we (kenpeter and I0 decided upon animpromptu listening / tweaking sesion.

1. Stuffing a pillow into the top part of the horn seemed to round out teh sound a bit (reduce a bit of a hollow ring)
2. We also tried stuffing a piece of cardboard in the same position after the pillow to forom a sort of 45 degree deflector. This may or may not have helped or made things worse. Okay, .. it made no significant difference 🙂
3. Hooked up my smal tube 1 watt 12AT7-12B4 single ended amp. The lower damping really made a difference compared to the mass market 100W class D panasonic home theater reciever I used previously for testing, bass now bloomed, though I feel improvements can still be made.
4. Freddy has been bugging me to try out one of the 1772 in a Karlson slit vent K-12 that I have. I rigged up a suitable drive adapter plate out of scrap and we somehow managed to clamp the plate in.
a. Compared to the k-slot horn, the K12 doesn't go as low and isn't as efficient (tranditional karlsons are bandpasses and don't have gain above the midbass).
b. The K12 has a bit more solid midbass. Drum and bass are more solid, though the K-slot horn goes much lower.
c. The K12 doesn't have any upward tilt in the sound, and dispersion may be more even. Hard to say for sure fro casual listening, since the tangband has decent dispersion to start with.

Which one is better, kenpeter prefered the K12 for it's more solid midbass, I prefered the K-slot horn for its more effortless sound.

More experiments to come.
 

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#70
nice to know 1772 was acceptable in the slit-vent K12 - did you guys muck with taping any of the slits? I like the single vent K12 better in ways than later slit vent (which I have probably at least 7 of the things - lol) - did you get good vocals from the little Karlson? my 206 and 1772 seem happy with 25 watt solid state (SM70 and AlpehJ clone) - IIRC the total external bulk of all K12 is ~3.3 cubic feet - I like the Fostex in the old one and will try to get 1772 into a slit vent type.
 
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#71
freddi said:
nice to know 1772 was acceptable in the slit-vent K12 - did you guys muck with taping any of the slits? I like the single vent K12 better in ways than later slit vent (which I have probably at least 7 of the things - lol) - did you get good vocals from the little Karlson? my 206 and 1772 seem happy with 25 watt solid state (SM70 and AlpehJ clone) - IIRC the total external bulk of all K12 is ~3.3 cubic feet - I like the Fostex in the old one and will try to get 1772 into a slit vent type.
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Thanks. Vocals were acceptable,recessed in the K-12 as opposed to forward in the K-slot, relatively speaking.

I'm more interested in hearing how the 1772 and the fostex compare in the SAME enclosure.
 
#72
I've gotta find a (non existent) scrap - or rasp out ~0.2" of donut - might be able to get the ragged undersized donut w. 1772 which is "on" BK20 into the early K12 - then putty leaks - maybe can record both (?) BetsyK's highs were too weak to sound as good as FE206EN in K-ette. 1772 has excellent extension. Can you think of any kind of music track for comparison? (I've almost no rock)
 
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#75
I put a few snips together from a test cd for comparisons but having static problem on Audacity - 1772 and FE206EN aren't are as good on the sax as a good coax in K15 - single driver may have weaker power response - might put up a comparison between 1772 in BK20 and 8K vs FE206En tonite if things go better -- -no room to pull out K18 - if my batteries hold out I'll put 1772 in K12 tomorrow. Speaker placement near corner may not be helping things but my room is cluttered to the max.
 
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#76
1772 is in the early (1954 debut) Karlson 12 (aka "Karlsonette") sitting on the floor - my 1st take is that its more mellow (and "conventional hifi" than FE206EN -Bass overall is good - on some tracks I note more excursion from W8-1772 partly due to its lower input impedance below Fb and cutoff. I would guess FE206EN's Z-in with Karlsonette or later K12 is high enough to operate off some tube amp 16 ohm taps. My other 1772 is in the tiny 1955 8K and at ear level its very nice. There should be a coupler possible smaller than K12 which would be nice for 1772 - if one likes the couplers. It may be useful to tune K12s a bit lower (?) For Karlsonette I'd probably pick FE206EN to save a bit of money and get a livelier presentation - I'm running solid state so tube amp or just moving speaker location might change matters.

Karlsonette Z-in: FE206EN vs W8-1772
An externally hosted image should be here but it was not working when we last tested it.
 
#78
in the little Karlson - bass impact was good on both 1772 and FE206EN - their balance was different and difficult for me to remember from 206EN and too much time to take it out and put in 1772. I "just" recorded 1772/Karlsonette vs Super10 in a 70l/41Hz tuned reflex with an oriental song (the reflex box was leaned back a bit) - Super10's hot directive high end made for a bright flute - when I examined the wavs, 1772/K12 could only be amplified 10.2dB on the opening flute vs 13dB for Super10 so according to Audacity, Super 10 had 2.8dB less on that passage - but I think it sounded "louder" 😛 - this speaker hobby is crazy stuff - lol - I'd like to see ~ how much amp power is used on the flute and drum passages
 
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#79
Azurahorn with W8-1772

I thought you guys would like a look at my front loaded Ahurahorn ( Azurahorn -Le Cleac'h Acoustic Horn Loudspeakers ) sitting on top of a H baffle 12" woofer. The horn cutoff is 160Hz and is crossed over at 200Hz to the woofer. It's all open baffle of course.

I will soon be moving overseas and can't fit them in my luggage, but might bring the drivers with me and build your K slot design. Did you ever publish all the dimensions?
 

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