Earthing Problem
You might have lost the ground within the pre- or power amps or the receiver. Look to see whether the ground wire in each unit is still attached at the power supply section. In the U.S. the ground wire is typically "Green". Is there a broken or loose solder joint, etc.
Also check your wall outlet with a wiring checker. Here in the U.S. you can buy a little 3 pronged plug-in device (neon indicator lights) that tells you whether the wall power outlet is properly wired - meaning whether the "hot", "neutral" and "ground" are properly connected within the outlet. Your local hardware or home improvement store will have them in the electrical department. Over here they're $5-7 a piece.
You might also simply have a loose ground wire within the immediate wall outlet, or even at the fuse/breaker box. You can try running a 3- conductor extension cord from a wall outlet elsewhere in the room - or from and other room, and see if you get the same result. Again, it could come down to a bad ground in the wiring system.
If you have any doubts about poking around the electrical supply - especially 240volt! - call in an electrician to check the grounding and wiring system(s).
You might have lost the ground within the pre- or power amps or the receiver. Look to see whether the ground wire in each unit is still attached at the power supply section. In the U.S. the ground wire is typically "Green". Is there a broken or loose solder joint, etc.
Also check your wall outlet with a wiring checker. Here in the U.S. you can buy a little 3 pronged plug-in device (neon indicator lights) that tells you whether the wall power outlet is properly wired - meaning whether the "hot", "neutral" and "ground" are properly connected within the outlet. Your local hardware or home improvement store will have them in the electrical department. Over here they're $5-7 a piece.
You might also simply have a loose ground wire within the immediate wall outlet, or even at the fuse/breaker box. You can try running a 3- conductor extension cord from a wall outlet elsewhere in the room - or from and other room, and see if you get the same result. Again, it could come down to a bad ground in the wiring system.
If you have any doubts about poking around the electrical supply - especially 240volt! - call in an electrician to check the grounding and wiring system(s).
Jeez,you guys are really getting me worried.If it is something to do with the house 240v earthing system that could be dangerous if the earth is not working correctly.Scary.I've had a lot of electrical wiring work done throughout the house in the last few years, so its possible something is not right.
What is setting off alarm bells in me now is that i also just remembered that sometimes when i unplug my pre-amps separate power supply (it has no switch) to turn off my system, i have to reach behind it with my hand resting on top of the stainless steel case,and i then sometimes get a mild tingle through my skin as i pull the 240v plug out.
Might have to have that checked out too.You and Kevin may be right!
I picked my tonearm back up today and the shop owner kindly checked the earth circuit on the cartridge through to the arm pillar and then on to the earths on the RCA's. All AOK there.He suggested that a better upgrade path for the arm might be the Origin counterweight mods,reckons it really transforms the arm into another class.Mabye something for later.The more i go into this, the more things i'm finding i can do to improve my system.
I'm really more of a listener than a modifier,but if it breathes new life into my LP's it will all be worth it i suppose.
Still waiting and waiting for all the bits to arrive.
What is setting off alarm bells in me now is that i also just remembered that sometimes when i unplug my pre-amps separate power supply (it has no switch) to turn off my system, i have to reach behind it with my hand resting on top of the stainless steel case,and i then sometimes get a mild tingle through my skin as i pull the 240v plug out.
Might have to have that checked out too.You and Kevin may be right!
I picked my tonearm back up today and the shop owner kindly checked the earth circuit on the cartridge through to the arm pillar and then on to the earths on the RCA's. All AOK there.He suggested that a better upgrade path for the arm might be the Origin counterweight mods,reckons it really transforms the arm into another class.Mabye something for later.The more i go into this, the more things i'm finding i can do to improve my system.
I'm really more of a listener than a modifier,but if it breathes new life into my LP's it will all be worth it i suppose.
Still waiting and waiting for all the bits to arrive.
atavid said:
Not very likely to be the household wiring, (not impossible though) after all for this to happen you have to have a good safety ground on the turntable, and something that is not properly grounded - if they all plug into the same outlet bad house wiring is precluded.. Provided you used a good licensed electrician and the work was properly inspected upon completion I would focus on the other equipment in your system. (Like the pre-amp and power amp - that chassis should not be electrically hot which it is from your description.) Once it is all eliminated as the culprit then you look at the ac wiring in the house as a possible cause. As you indicated in a previous post unplug and test each component individually.
Well i have finally received all my parts and have reassembled my turntable(twice).
The list of mods i've done is fairly extensive.
I also ordered one of those Hercules11 power supplies,but while i was waiting for it i wanted to hear what all my other mods would do to the quality of the audio.
I have to tell you i was blown away by the difference they made.
Its like i have a different turntable.
With all my mods,but without the Hercules, the sound from the Ariston, is to my ears at least, vastly superior to its previous state.
I'm hoping people might be interested in the results of all this modifying but I'm not good at expressing in Hi-Fi speak the differences i can detect,but here goes.Please excuse any incorrect use of terminology.
The most immediate thing i noticed was that various instruments seemed to emanate from quite discernible places in the soundstage.This soundstage seemed to take on what i would call a "three dimensionality".Voices are in distinctly different spaces to instruments.
The second thing i noticed was that the bass and mid bass seems to be much more tightly controlled.Lots of "slam" too, on the right albums dare i say.
The various bass frequencies are quite discernible,and without any 'looseness' or 'woolyness'. and reach down much deeper without losing control.
What also seems to have gone is what i would call the warm midrange. At first i felt the TT had lost something i liked,but after further listening i realised that the midrange now seemed 'more realistic or accurate'.Its hard for me to describe this one.I need to listen more to try and articulate what i'm hearing here.
Then this morning the specially modified switch for the Hercules power supply i had received a few days earlier arrived and i eagerly assembled it on to the deck.
This was reasonably straight forward,but did need a few modifications to fit. I must say i am mightily impressed with Gordon and Edmund from Stamford Audio where i bought the Hercules from.As you know the Hercules was originally designed for the Linn,but as the Ariston is almost identical except for an opposite switch position ,its a small matter to make it work on the Ariston.
The only major problem was getting the length of the cable from the switch to the Hercules board the correct length.The first cable they sent was a fraction too short and strained the connections.Quick as a flash they fabricated up another longer one and dispatched it to me in a matter of a few days.It was great service.Its an impressively built device.Ooses quality.
How does it sound with the Hercules11?.
I thought the mods i did were good,but the Hercules mod is spectacular.Together they have totally transformed my turntable to a whole new level.
The most obvious thing i noticed with the fitting of the Hercules is the quieter background noise.Sure i still gets the clicks and pops on some of my more 'partied' albums,but the absence of noise generally is most apparent.I suppose as a result of this,music now appears to have better dynamic range.I know it probably doesnt in reality,but the effect is there none the less.
Another thing i'm picking up is that the timing or rhythm of the music seems to somehow be better,easier to follow. Sades' voice for example seems to follow the tempo of the song better.The tone of her voice is strong and solid and crystal clear.I know that probably sounds a bit wacky but i'm sorry i cant explain this one well yet either.
After a while i also became aware that i'm now getting lots more detail and information from the groove.I played the track "Mysterious Thing" by Ice house on an album i used to play regularly,and honestly i didn't recognise the start of the track,so much more was i hearing than previously.
The Hercules seems to have taken all the effects i heard earlier and improved them yet again.
The very first track i played when i first assembled the deck was the Police' "Spirits in a Material World".I was in such a hurry to sit down and listen i forgot to turn on one of my two subs.When the track began it actually startled me,it was so clear,so shimmery.The bass was so good i didnt even miss the absent sub.
I cheerfully listened away to the album until my wife came in and pointed out that i had only one sub turned on.
Overall i'm extremely happy with the result of all the mods.If you own an Ariston these mods clearly can make a huge difference to your listening.I used to prefer my CD player because it had detail,bass and definition,but the Ariston now is clearly the better source.I'm enjoying my albums as if it is the first time i'm hearing them.
I'll tell you about my grounding problem next time.I'm off to listen to some more music.
The list of mods i've done is fairly extensive.
I also ordered one of those Hercules11 power supplies,but while i was waiting for it i wanted to hear what all my other mods would do to the quality of the audio.
I have to tell you i was blown away by the difference they made.
Its like i have a different turntable.
With all my mods,but without the Hercules, the sound from the Ariston, is to my ears at least, vastly superior to its previous state.
I'm hoping people might be interested in the results of all this modifying but I'm not good at expressing in Hi-Fi speak the differences i can detect,but here goes.Please excuse any incorrect use of terminology.
The most immediate thing i noticed was that various instruments seemed to emanate from quite discernible places in the soundstage.This soundstage seemed to take on what i would call a "three dimensionality".Voices are in distinctly different spaces to instruments.
The second thing i noticed was that the bass and mid bass seems to be much more tightly controlled.Lots of "slam" too, on the right albums dare i say.
The various bass frequencies are quite discernible,and without any 'looseness' or 'woolyness'. and reach down much deeper without losing control.
What also seems to have gone is what i would call the warm midrange. At first i felt the TT had lost something i liked,but after further listening i realised that the midrange now seemed 'more realistic or accurate'.Its hard for me to describe this one.I need to listen more to try and articulate what i'm hearing here.
Then this morning the specially modified switch for the Hercules power supply i had received a few days earlier arrived and i eagerly assembled it on to the deck.
This was reasonably straight forward,but did need a few modifications to fit. I must say i am mightily impressed with Gordon and Edmund from Stamford Audio where i bought the Hercules from.As you know the Hercules was originally designed for the Linn,but as the Ariston is almost identical except for an opposite switch position ,its a small matter to make it work on the Ariston.
The only major problem was getting the length of the cable from the switch to the Hercules board the correct length.The first cable they sent was a fraction too short and strained the connections.Quick as a flash they fabricated up another longer one and dispatched it to me in a matter of a few days.It was great service.Its an impressively built device.Ooses quality.
How does it sound with the Hercules11?.
I thought the mods i did were good,but the Hercules mod is spectacular.Together they have totally transformed my turntable to a whole new level.
The most obvious thing i noticed with the fitting of the Hercules is the quieter background noise.Sure i still gets the clicks and pops on some of my more 'partied' albums,but the absence of noise generally is most apparent.I suppose as a result of this,music now appears to have better dynamic range.I know it probably doesnt in reality,but the effect is there none the less.
Another thing i'm picking up is that the timing or rhythm of the music seems to somehow be better,easier to follow. Sades' voice for example seems to follow the tempo of the song better.The tone of her voice is strong and solid and crystal clear.I know that probably sounds a bit wacky but i'm sorry i cant explain this one well yet either.
After a while i also became aware that i'm now getting lots more detail and information from the groove.I played the track "Mysterious Thing" by Ice house on an album i used to play regularly,and honestly i didn't recognise the start of the track,so much more was i hearing than previously.
The Hercules seems to have taken all the effects i heard earlier and improved them yet again.
The very first track i played when i first assembled the deck was the Police' "Spirits in a Material World".I was in such a hurry to sit down and listen i forgot to turn on one of my two subs.When the track began it actually startled me,it was so clear,so shimmery.The bass was so good i didnt even miss the absent sub.
I cheerfully listened away to the album until my wife came in and pointed out that i had only one sub turned on.
Overall i'm extremely happy with the result of all the mods.If you own an Ariston these mods clearly can make a huge difference to your listening.I used to prefer my CD player because it had detail,bass and definition,but the Ariston now is clearly the better source.I'm enjoying my albums as if it is the first time i'm hearing them.
I'll tell you about my grounding problem next time.I'm off to listen to some more music.
Atavid,
Congratulations on completing your revival project. Sounds like you did great work on your table. It is surprising how much performance you can get from these babies.
Yes, the mods finally make the Ariston do the 3-D thing, but as you found, more importantly, bass becomed defined. There's a wealth of information in the bass register. Getting it right is well worth the effort.
Congratulations on completing your revival project. Sounds like you did great work on your table. It is surprising how much performance you can get from these babies.
Yes, the mods finally make the Ariston do the 3-D thing, but as you found, more importantly, bass becomed defined. There's a wealth of information in the bass register. Getting it right is well worth the effort.
Ironic isnt it.I waited so long to get all my mods finished and now i've got little time available to listen to my system.
However i did make time to put my 3 cones under the TT and have a quick listen.
To my surprise it seems to me that i suddenly lost something in the music.
It wasnt jumping out at me like it did before i used the cones when i first listened after all the mods .
I'm sure before my mods the cones actually helped.
Whats the consensus of opinion about cones and suspended chassis turntables these days? Are they generally considered to enhance the performance ?
As one of my mods, i removed the old thin masonite baseboard and had a 10mm acrylic baseboard made up.Could this have changed how the TT reacts with the cones?
Hopefully i will have a chance to listen to some albums tomorrow and play around with and without the cones,but i would be very interested in peoples experience and opinion on this.
However i did make time to put my 3 cones under the TT and have a quick listen.
To my surprise it seems to me that i suddenly lost something in the music.
It wasnt jumping out at me like it did before i used the cones when i first listened after all the mods .
I'm sure before my mods the cones actually helped.
Whats the consensus of opinion about cones and suspended chassis turntables these days? Are they generally considered to enhance the performance ?
As one of my mods, i removed the old thin masonite baseboard and had a 10mm acrylic baseboard made up.Could this have changed how the TT reacts with the cones?
Hopefully i will have a chance to listen to some albums tomorrow and play around with and without the cones,but i would be very interested in peoples experience and opinion on this.
I've talked a friend with a Linn LP12 Lingo into bringing his deck over in the Xmas holidays for an A/B with the Ariston.
Should be an interesting comparison now with all the mods,especially the Hercules power supply.
I'll have to do some work on the clutch mechanism on the Ariston first though.It slips if i dont use the deck for a few days.The clutch now wont grip enough to start the platter moving.If i help it spin up manually it was fine after that,but recently i've noticed significant 'wow' even when its 'up to speed'.
If a new felt washer fails to improve things i might have to consider fixing the pulley permanently to the motor shaft.
The small felt washer in the clutch is quite worn,so i'm hoping i can locate the spare one originally supplied with the deck.
Does anyone forsee any problems if i do decide to' fix' the pulley, and do away with the clutch mechanism?
Should be an interesting comparison now with all the mods,especially the Hercules power supply.
I'll have to do some work on the clutch mechanism on the Ariston first though.It slips if i dont use the deck for a few days.The clutch now wont grip enough to start the platter moving.If i help it spin up manually it was fine after that,but recently i've noticed significant 'wow' even when its 'up to speed'.
If a new felt washer fails to improve things i might have to consider fixing the pulley permanently to the motor shaft.
The small felt washer in the clutch is quite worn,so i'm hoping i can locate the spare one originally supplied with the deck.
Does anyone forsee any problems if i do decide to' fix' the pulley, and do away with the clutch mechanism?
Motor gone
OK,now i'm really depressed.
The clutch is not the problem.Its the motor i think.
When i switch on the motor it hasnt got enough torque to start the platter rolling,in fact even without the platter on, the motor wont begin to spin without me turning it a little first.
As well as that,if i hold the pulley while it is running the motor shaft stops and wont start turning again by itself.
It reminds me of a problem we used to experience with slot car motors back in the 60's.Sometimes we had to remove the armature and do a procedure called undercutting the commutator.
I've got no idea what this Premotec motor looks like inside, or if this procedure is even possible.Or if it is the actual problem.
Seems strange if the motor is worn out.Even though the deck is 25 years old, it wasnt used that much.
I suppose most people would just recommend a new motor.
But the DIY'er in me always wants to at least have a go at fixing the problem first before throwing in the towel.
The big question is, if i do have to replace the motor,where do i get one?
Before that though i would be grateful if anyone has some ideas on whats wrong with the motor,or if its possible to dismantle it in such a way that it can be put back together again.
OK,now i'm really depressed.
The clutch is not the problem.Its the motor i think.
When i switch on the motor it hasnt got enough torque to start the platter rolling,in fact even without the platter on, the motor wont begin to spin without me turning it a little first.
As well as that,if i hold the pulley while it is running the motor shaft stops and wont start turning again by itself.
It reminds me of a problem we used to experience with slot car motors back in the 60's.Sometimes we had to remove the armature and do a procedure called undercutting the commutator.
I've got no idea what this Premotec motor looks like inside, or if this procedure is even possible.Or if it is the actual problem.
Seems strange if the motor is worn out.Even though the deck is 25 years old, it wasnt used that much.
I suppose most people would just recommend a new motor.
But the DIY'er in me always wants to at least have a go at fixing the problem first before throwing in the towel.
The big question is, if i do have to replace the motor,where do i get one?
Before that though i would be grateful if anyone has some ideas on whats wrong with the motor,or if its possible to dismantle it in such a way that it can be put back together again.
carefully disassemble, clean every last bit of old oil and gunk out, and re-oil with a really lightweight oil (turbine oil or sewing machine oil) lightly, if it's a brushed motor, clean the commutator and make sure you have enough brush length, reassemble and I bet the problem is solved.
erie
erie
the motor in my 11Superieur is different, I'm pretty sure. I havent' had mine apart (yet) and when it reaches that point, I'll be scouring the motor vendor catalogs to find something a little different. Now if I can just finish all the little mods to the acoustats over the long weekend, I might actually be able to listen to my table again (been a few years...)
erie
erie
I've already checked out who sells replacement motors,trouble is i emailed them (US)when i was modding my deck a month or so ago and they never bothered to reply.
Might have to try and go through the UK supplier.Could try the Dutch manufacturers i suppose but they probably wont sell direct,let alone ship overseas to me.
Just not sure which motor to order...so many options.On the Premotec site they list a motor model SY32 which appears from its spec sheet to be the right one.Somewhere along the line the model numbers change when they pass on to their dealers and start with 9904 designation.
There is the 9904***31813
then the supposedly better/later 9904***31304,
and i also read somewhere there is a 9904***31302
suitable for the Aristons,something about a "white bearing" ????
My feeling is that as the Linn and the RD11S are so similiar then whatever model fits the Linn should suit the RD11S.
I was going to say "correct me if i'm wrong",but i dont reckon too many members have done a motor change to their Aristons!
After some thought i've decided i've got nothing to lose by trying to pull the motor apart and repair it. Its not much good to me the way it is at the moment,and its not going to fix itself,so its back to the workbench after Xmas for some more fun and games.
Might have to try and go through the UK supplier.Could try the Dutch manufacturers i suppose but they probably wont sell direct,let alone ship overseas to me.
Just not sure which motor to order...so many options.On the Premotec site they list a motor model SY32 which appears from its spec sheet to be the right one.Somewhere along the line the model numbers change when they pass on to their dealers and start with 9904 designation.
There is the 9904***31813
then the supposedly better/later 9904***31304,
and i also read somewhere there is a 9904***31302
suitable for the Aristons,something about a "white bearing" ????
My feeling is that as the Linn and the RD11S are so similiar then whatever model fits the Linn should suit the RD11S.
I was going to say "correct me if i'm wrong",but i dont reckon too many members have done a motor change to their Aristons!
After some thought i've decided i've got nothing to lose by trying to pull the motor apart and repair it. Its not much good to me the way it is at the moment,and its not going to fix itself,so its back to the workbench after Xmas for some more fun and games.
I'm not familiar with this motor, but does it have a phase shift cap (synchronous motor) and if so have you checked it by substitution?
It's possibly a long shot, but I had an AR that would not start by itself and the problem turned out to be the cap.
Just because you emailed someone unfortunately doesn't always mean they actually got the message - hopefully you have emailed them at least twice before giving up..
It's possibly a long shot, but I had an AR that would not start by itself and the problem turned out to be the cap.
Just because you emailed someone unfortunately doesn't always mean they actually got the message - hopefully you have emailed them at least twice before giving up..
Hello again Kevin,Merry Xmas....its Xmas morning here.
I couldnt stand waiting till after Xmas to check out the problem further,so i pulled the motor apart yesterday.
There does not appear to be anything wrong or worn with it.Its a very simple motor in its construction.
I believe it is a synchronous motor type.
It's a Premotec 9904 -111- 31302,almost exactly the same construction as the Linn 31819 and 31304.
By the way i wrote to the UK suppliers of Premotec and they responded quickly,but the price is pretty outrageous ,250 of your US dollars,and almost 300 of our Australian dollars.This turntable only fetches about $300-$400 on Ebay,so its another big investment that would never see a return in financial terms like one would if it were a Linn LP12.I know we don't do what we do to these components for financial gain,but it gets to a point where you have to think how many dollars you're willing to blow on some item that wouldnt give you even half the money back if you had to sell it.Remember i spent over $400 on the Hercules power supply.
I dont know what you mean by "phase shift cap" (capacitor??)There are no components other than the central rotor and the two end cap magnets??
I cleaned the end thrust sleeve bearing and re lubricated it with grease and put it back together----no difference.I was getting really worried.
So i started to look at other things i had changed .
First i noticed that the new belt i bought from "the old country" was significantly thicker in its square section than the original belt.Changed it back to the old belt but still no difference.
Then i noticed that when i spun the subplatter it didnt spin very long on its own,mabye two turns at best.I thought this cant be right.
I checked the small ceramic disc i had also bought to drop down the bearing spindle shaft.This also seemed ok,but clearly there was too much friction happening.I checked the oil level(oil supplied with the ceramic disc) it was fine.
I then tried to pop the disc out but couldnt without turning the TT upside down which i didnt want to do as it was in situ but i did end up flipping the little ceramic disc over.
In shear desperation i put the TT back together again and tried a record.
To my surprise even though it was slow to start up,it eventually reached correct speed after about 30 seconds on its own steam.What did i do that made the difference??,surely the ceramic disc is the same composition on both sides.I cant explain it yet.
I'm going to investigate further later today after the Xmas morning madness settles down.
I couldnt stand waiting till after Xmas to check out the problem further,so i pulled the motor apart yesterday.
There does not appear to be anything wrong or worn with it.Its a very simple motor in its construction.
I believe it is a synchronous motor type.
It's a Premotec 9904 -111- 31302,almost exactly the same construction as the Linn 31819 and 31304.
By the way i wrote to the UK suppliers of Premotec and they responded quickly,but the price is pretty outrageous ,250 of your US dollars,and almost 300 of our Australian dollars.This turntable only fetches about $300-$400 on Ebay,so its another big investment that would never see a return in financial terms like one would if it were a Linn LP12.I know we don't do what we do to these components for financial gain,but it gets to a point where you have to think how many dollars you're willing to blow on some item that wouldnt give you even half the money back if you had to sell it.Remember i spent over $400 on the Hercules power supply.
I dont know what you mean by "phase shift cap" (capacitor??)There are no components other than the central rotor and the two end cap magnets??
I cleaned the end thrust sleeve bearing and re lubricated it with grease and put it back together----no difference.I was getting really worried.
So i started to look at other things i had changed .
First i noticed that the new belt i bought from "the old country" was significantly thicker in its square section than the original belt.Changed it back to the old belt but still no difference.
Then i noticed that when i spun the subplatter it didnt spin very long on its own,mabye two turns at best.I thought this cant be right.
I checked the small ceramic disc i had also bought to drop down the bearing spindle shaft.This also seemed ok,but clearly there was too much friction happening.I checked the oil level(oil supplied with the ceramic disc) it was fine.
I then tried to pop the disc out but couldnt without turning the TT upside down which i didnt want to do as it was in situ but i did end up flipping the little ceramic disc over.
In shear desperation i put the TT back together again and tried a record.
To my surprise even though it was slow to start up,it eventually reached correct speed after about 30 seconds on its own steam.What did i do that made the difference??,surely the ceramic disc is the same composition on both sides.I cant explain it yet.
I'm going to investigate further later today after the Xmas morning madness settles down.
Well,
after all this talk about the RD11, I finally fired mine up last night after several years of "someday". After changing the oil, cleaning the belt, platter and pulley, removing the transit screw, releveling and setting up the suspension, some VTA adjustments, and finally resoldering a couple of wires on the DIN connector, I sat and listened to quite a few albums last night. I definately need to clean the contacts on the step up transformer, as the loading switch is noisy, but after a dozen or so cycles, it quieted down.
I remember why I kept the table, and the 800 or so albums. It just sounds so right and good....
Also, the 11Superieur uses a DC motor that has a pc board attached, power is 24VAC and I will need to do some better motor decoupling from the plinth, probably retune the suspension as well.
erie
after all this talk about the RD11, I finally fired mine up last night after several years of "someday". After changing the oil, cleaning the belt, platter and pulley, removing the transit screw, releveling and setting up the suspension, some VTA adjustments, and finally resoldering a couple of wires on the DIN connector, I sat and listened to quite a few albums last night. I definately need to clean the contacts on the step up transformer, as the loading switch is noisy, but after a dozen or so cycles, it quieted down.
I remember why I kept the table, and the 800 or so albums. It just sounds so right and good....
Also, the 11Superieur uses a DC motor that has a pc board attached, power is 24VAC and I will need to do some better motor decoupling from the plinth, probably retune the suspension as well.
erie
Well i am not really any closer to solving the drive problem.
I've changed the drive belt back to the original one ,the new replacement square section belt being slightly bigger in its cross section.I've also changed back to light sewing machine oil from the 'black' oil supplied with the ceramic disc.
At the moment it seems to be working OK again.
I say at the moment because some days the problem resurfaces.This leads me to think that it has something to do with the mains voltage being a tad low at times in my house(suburb),or, that the Hercules power supply circuitry is not supplying quite enough juice at times(though this seems highly unlikely)to start the platter rotating and maintain correct speed.
After all the messing around with the undersides of the TT i had to reset the suspension up again.I must have fluked it the first time because it was such a PITA to get right this time round.
I also decided to try and get the platter to sit as close to the top plate as possible as the ceramic disc i added to the 'main bearing well' lifted the platter up about 3mm when the arm board was set up level with the top plate as it is supposed to be.
Now the arm board sits a few mm below the top plate,and the platter rim sits just a few mm above the top plate.
Previously i have always concentrated on making the armboard sit level and set equidistant in its cutout.
This time i spent more effort getting the platter to sit perfectly level at every point in its rotation,and then trying to get the "suspension bounce" right.
I'm not sure if i have achieved the right bounce because in the past the arm would bob up and down quite a few times before settling if i pushed down on the platter.With the new Linn black springs fitted i'm not sure how stiff the bounce should be.????
At the moment i'm running the deck without the bottom cover plate on so i can slide the TT over the edge of the cabinet to get at the springs for adjustment, because everytime i turn the deck over to refit the bottom cover, the suspension goes out of kilter.
It seems to be very touchy.Reminded me why i went off playing records 10 years ago.
I've changed the drive belt back to the original one ,the new replacement square section belt being slightly bigger in its cross section.I've also changed back to light sewing machine oil from the 'black' oil supplied with the ceramic disc.
At the moment it seems to be working OK again.
I say at the moment because some days the problem resurfaces.This leads me to think that it has something to do with the mains voltage being a tad low at times in my house(suburb),or, that the Hercules power supply circuitry is not supplying quite enough juice at times(though this seems highly unlikely)to start the platter rotating and maintain correct speed.
After all the messing around with the undersides of the TT i had to reset the suspension up again.I must have fluked it the first time because it was such a PITA to get right this time round.
I also decided to try and get the platter to sit as close to the top plate as possible as the ceramic disc i added to the 'main bearing well' lifted the platter up about 3mm when the arm board was set up level with the top plate as it is supposed to be.
Now the arm board sits a few mm below the top plate,and the platter rim sits just a few mm above the top plate.
Previously i have always concentrated on making the armboard sit level and set equidistant in its cutout.
This time i spent more effort getting the platter to sit perfectly level at every point in its rotation,and then trying to get the "suspension bounce" right.
I'm not sure if i have achieved the right bounce because in the past the arm would bob up and down quite a few times before settling if i pushed down on the platter.With the new Linn black springs fitted i'm not sure how stiff the bounce should be.????
At the moment i'm running the deck without the bottom cover plate on so i can slide the TT over the edge of the cabinet to get at the springs for adjustment, because everytime i turn the deck over to refit the bottom cover, the suspension goes out of kilter.
It seems to be very touchy.Reminded me why i went off playing records 10 years ago.
Hi Atavid,
Happy New Year.. Yeah analog TT are pretty tweaky in the extreme. I have noticed some of the same sorts of problems with my Thorens, although I don't have any of the motor issues you mention.. The others , however are quite familiar, and like you I'm not totally convinced I've got things set up just right.. It sounds very good though, better probably than any other TT I've owned - which on the face of it isn't saying much, because other than the truly awful PT I owned for a short while I haven't had anything that was more than moderately respected..
I'm sure the mega-rich audiophile/dealer would probably look at my current set up with disdain. (I know I've met a few.. ) It simply doesn't have toy boy status.. And it all looks suspiciously homebrew as well... I'm pretty happy with it overall though..
Another thought is the Hercules power supply, I'm quite ignorant of it, and had missed its presence in earlier discussions. Can you provide some details? It could be that this unit is the culprit and needs some work. Is your motor actually AC or DC, and have you measured the output voltage present at the motor terminals? It isn't unusual to run a TT motor at reduced voltage to reduce vibration, which also greatly reduces torque, it may be that the Hercules does this, and if it is as old as the table you might need to replace some power supply capacitors, etc. This is a guess - more detail needed.
I'm currently enthralled with my new sacd player so I haven't been listening to much vinyl lately..
Regards, Kevin
Happy New Year.. Yeah analog TT are pretty tweaky in the extreme. I have noticed some of the same sorts of problems with my Thorens, although I don't have any of the motor issues you mention.. The others , however are quite familiar, and like you I'm not totally convinced I've got things set up just right.. It sounds very good though, better probably than any other TT I've owned - which on the face of it isn't saying much, because other than the truly awful PT I owned for a short while I haven't had anything that was more than moderately respected..
I'm sure the mega-rich audiophile/dealer would probably look at my current set up with disdain. (I know I've met a few.. ) It simply doesn't have toy boy status..
And it all looks suspiciously homebrew as well... I'm pretty happy with it overall though..Another thought is the Hercules power supply, I'm quite ignorant of it, and had missed its presence in earlier discussions. Can you provide some details? It could be that this unit is the culprit and needs some work. Is your motor actually AC or DC, and have you measured the output voltage present at the motor terminals? It isn't unusual to run a TT motor at reduced voltage to reduce vibration, which also greatly reduces torque, it may be that the Hercules does this, and if it is as old as the table you might need to replace some power supply capacitors, etc. This is a guess - more detail needed.
I'm currently enthralled with my new sacd player so I haven't been listening to much vinyl lately..
Regards, Kevin
Yes Kevin,its a bit of a problem to know when to stop fiddling with the supension.Sometimes the audio plays tricks on you(me) and i think it sounded bettter before i did the last fiddle to the springs or VTA or something else.At the moment my gut tells me the set up is good but my ears keep saying "it sounded better before".
This time round when i set up the tonearm i decided to test the cartridge makers (Audioquest) claim that the VTA should be such that the cartridge sits slightly lower than level, at the rear end.The cartridge has a boron cantilever and a microtracer stylus profile, and according to them,suits this VTA better.To my ears it doesnt,but i'll bear with it for a while and see if i can detect an improvement, rather than just detecting a difference.
I know what you mean about the attitude you can get from some dealers about the equipment you own.Some of them are just kids with no experience with past equipment, and even less respect for the quality of sound many of these old pieces can still produce.The dealer i have most contact with now has been around forever,his father started the business in the fifties,now he and his son run it, and its really gratifying to talk to them when they acknowledge that such and such a piece of equipment(despite being old) is still just as capable of producing audiophile quality music as the latest hot (and very expensive)piece of bling sitting on the shelves.
The Hercules power supply is brand new and is a design commissioned by Stanford Audio in the UK and built by a guy in Hong Kong.It uses very high quality components and is also finished to a very professional standard.
It was originally built as a better option than the Valhalla PS for the Linn Sondek LP12 and in fact, is said in some circles,to be better than the Lingo as well.
I had them adapt it to fit my Ariston RD11S as the Linn and RD11S use virtually the same Premotec AC synchronous motor.
I havn't measured the output voltage as i am not sure exactly what it should be.Nor do i know which wires to measure it across.
I assume it would be across one of the grey wires and either the blue or red wire.
Unfortunately we dont seem to get SACD's here in Aus so i havnt had the joy of experiencing higher fidelity CD recordings.I dont think i've even seen any SACD capable players for sale here in Aus.I wish there were.
I did a little experiment the other day.I got a music gift voucher as a Xmas present and bought a CD copy of one of my favourite vinyl albums,then played them both simultaneously through my system flicking between the phono and CD inputs.It was abundantly clear, even to my wife and kids, that the vinyl sounded much better.I was a bit surprised just how big a difference there really was.
The way vinyl albums are remastered for digital CD is disgusting,especially considering how much potential there is on CD's for better dynamic range.
Needless to say this started some dissatisfaction in me about the quality of my CD player, and i started looking for a way to enhance/mod my Sony CD player.
My CDP X555ES player was a very good unit in its day,very very heavy and completely shielded in a copper inner case,and supposedly with a reasonable quality power supply and quality phillips drive mechanism,but by todays audiophile standards its obviously lacking.
I found an Australian company called Burson Audio who make a device called an 'audio buffer' that connects between the preamp inputs and the CD outputs.They claim it makes a significant improvement to the sound quality and have offered me a trial of the unit.
http://www.bursonaudio.com/Products.htm
I'm going to take up the offer and see if it helps cure this lack of interest i've suddenly developed in my CD collection.Let you know.
This time round when i set up the tonearm i decided to test the cartridge makers (Audioquest) claim that the VTA should be such that the cartridge sits slightly lower than level, at the rear end.The cartridge has a boron cantilever and a microtracer stylus profile, and according to them,suits this VTA better.To my ears it doesnt,but i'll bear with it for a while and see if i can detect an improvement, rather than just detecting a difference.
I know what you mean about the attitude you can get from some dealers about the equipment you own.Some of them are just kids with no experience with past equipment, and even less respect for the quality of sound many of these old pieces can still produce.The dealer i have most contact with now has been around forever,his father started the business in the fifties,now he and his son run it, and its really gratifying to talk to them when they acknowledge that such and such a piece of equipment(despite being old) is still just as capable of producing audiophile quality music as the latest hot (and very expensive)piece of bling sitting on the shelves.
The Hercules power supply is brand new and is a design commissioned by Stanford Audio in the UK and built by a guy in Hong Kong.It uses very high quality components and is also finished to a very professional standard.
It was originally built as a better option than the Valhalla PS for the Linn Sondek LP12 and in fact, is said in some circles,to be better than the Lingo as well.
I had them adapt it to fit my Ariston RD11S as the Linn and RD11S use virtually the same Premotec AC synchronous motor.
I havn't measured the output voltage as i am not sure exactly what it should be.Nor do i know which wires to measure it across.
I assume it would be across one of the grey wires and either the blue or red wire.
Unfortunately we dont seem to get SACD's here in Aus so i havnt had the joy of experiencing higher fidelity CD recordings.I dont think i've even seen any SACD capable players for sale here in Aus.I wish there were.
I did a little experiment the other day.I got a music gift voucher as a Xmas present and bought a CD copy of one of my favourite vinyl albums,then played them both simultaneously through my system flicking between the phono and CD inputs.It was abundantly clear, even to my wife and kids, that the vinyl sounded much better.I was a bit surprised just how big a difference there really was.
The way vinyl albums are remastered for digital CD is disgusting,especially considering how much potential there is on CD's for better dynamic range.
Needless to say this started some dissatisfaction in me about the quality of my CD player, and i started looking for a way to enhance/mod my Sony CD player.
My CDP X555ES player was a very good unit in its day,very very heavy and completely shielded in a copper inner case,and supposedly with a reasonable quality power supply and quality phillips drive mechanism,but by todays audiophile standards its obviously lacking.
I found an Australian company called Burson Audio who make a device called an 'audio buffer' that connects between the preamp inputs and the CD outputs.They claim it makes a significant improvement to the sound quality and have offered me a trial of the unit.
http://www.bursonaudio.com/Products.htm
I'm going to take up the offer and see if it helps cure this lack of interest i've suddenly developed in my CD collection.Let you know.
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