Although they are not great speakers, Markw4 may still have a pair of M2s, and lives fairly close to Flaxxer.
Or at least he can give Flaxxer an informed opinion of them.
Where would the lobes come from without the dips 😉
The Viawave ribbon drivers were mentioned before. They are somewhat unique in having the gap blocked making them sealed. This means they are usable to a lower frequency with less distortion which is often where ribbons fall down.
They are available with and without waveguides. They could be paired with other high efficiency drivers.
Joachim Gerhard has a speaker using one with a waveguide and a Purifi woofer, Troels has the Atiri without the waveguide. The raw drivers are expensive though.
ATiRi
Viawave GRT-145
Viawave SRT-7 ribbon tweeter | HiFiCompass
The information krivium gave you is correct but you need to remember that 220 to 250 Hz is in the transition / modal region where the room is becoming more of a factor than the speaker. Without EQ, room treatment or cardioid like directivity the difference in baffle step will be swamped out.
I think what I got from what Krivium said, is 45 degree angles of 19mm thick material will be fine ....
It is better than straight edge.
The optimal? It'll depend from a lot of other things including width, depth, height, driver location,... to be sure only simulation can give clues imo.
Have you read the post i linked ( and the ones following) from Patrick Bateman? In my view it summarise well the situation.
Flaxxer, do you mind if i come back a little bit on amp power (i would like to comment on the Harbeth video Fluid linked)?
If you don't want just say no.
The optimal? It'll depend from a lot of other things including width, depth, height, driver location,... to be sure only simulation can give clues imo.
Have you read the post i linked ( and the ones following) from Patrick Bateman? In my view it summarise well the situation.
Flaxxer, do you mind if i come back a little bit on amp power (i would like to comment on the Harbeth video Fluid linked)?
If you don't want just say no.
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By all means, go ahead Krivium. This thread has been all over the place since I started it, lol.
You may have misunderstood one thing however ... the added 45 beveled edge sides would be added to an EXISTING speaker. So there would be zero ability to change anything in the xover. I'd just be adding an extra 19mm layer of plywood to the sides, but with the 45 degree bevels.
You may have misunderstood one thing however ... the added 45 beveled edge sides would be added to an EXISTING speaker. So there would be zero ability to change anything in the xover. I'd just be adding an extra 19mm layer of plywood to the sides, but with the 45 degree bevels.
Could you give the width of the loudspeaker in question ( Asathor?)?
As pointed by Fluid with a loudspeaker of this size the bsc should be in the vicinity of schroeder frequency and thus the room will start to dominate the behavior, so lowering this frequency ( by adding the sides) should not change a lot in fine.
That said if you have the drawing of cabinet you can simul under 'the edge' to have an idea. It won't tell you exactly what will happen but'll give you a trend.
As pointed by Fluid with a loudspeaker of this size the bsc should be in the vicinity of schroeder frequency and thus the room will start to dominate the behavior, so lowering this frequency ( by adding the sides) should not change a lot in fine.
That said if you have the drawing of cabinet you can simul under 'the edge' to have an idea. It won't tell you exactly what will happen but'll give you a trend.
Yes, it would be on the Asathor. It measures 440mm wide. But would be 478mm wide with the added side walls. But not flat on the baffle edges, but 45 degrees.
Thanks
Thanks
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Ok so the regular width ask for something around 348hz.
With your side added it should be around 304hz.
If your musician it is a drop from an E to a D.
It shouldn't change many things but i thought the cabinet was wider.
I'll see if i can find the edge on one of my old pc and simulate it.
With your side added it should be around 304hz.
If your musician it is a drop from an E to a D.
It shouldn't change many things but i thought the cabinet was wider.
I'll see if i can find the edge on one of my old pc and simulate it.
I'll save you the trouble
Difference between a 440mm baffle with no edge radius and a 478mm baffle with a 19mm edge radius, so little that I had to double check I did it right as I could hardly tell without the gif 🙂
Attachments
Remember the Behringer is quite noisy. There is a t.amp with 4 channels and DSP which should be less noisy.
I read that Linkwitz liked the M2 as well .... but he stated that he wished the enclosure wasn't ported. Anybody know what he may have meant by this?
speculating... but he (like me) had a strong preference for sealed box designs over vented box designs. Obviously he liked dipole pattern bass systems the best. But among monopole systems, he seems to have been a strong advocate of sealed box designs combined with thoughtful EQ (the Linkwitz Transform).
What I do not understand is how the original crossover can work while removing one of the two tweeters!?
If you are open for DSP, I would consider to buy a pair of Fusion 253 or 503 as suggested before. As you are handy with wood this will give you a lot flexibily to swap units over time in case they are not satisfactory. And they will make the response flattening and fine tuning to taste much easier...
I use a Fusion 253 in a dipole design with Heil AMT, 6" 18 sounds 6ND430 mid and a long excursion 15" woofer, very happy with it.
If you are open for DSP, I would consider to buy a pair of Fusion 253 or 503 as suggested before. As you are handy with wood this will give you a lot flexibily to swap units over time in case they are not satisfactory. And they will make the response flattening and fine tuning to taste much easier...
I use a Fusion 253 in a dipole design with Heil AMT, 6" 18 sounds 6ND430 mid and a long excursion 15" woofer, very happy with it.
You do not remove any tweeters. Supertweeters are added to the speakers existing binding posts. They have level and slope adjustments, and can be turned off as well. Unless you engineer this into the xover.
I'm pointing mine backwards and up, via a flush mount board, just over the size of the tweeter flange, which is hinged to angle upwards at any angle you choose or be flush when folded flat. A wooden hinge of course.
I'm pointing mine backwards and up, via a flush mount board, just over the size of the tweeter flange, which is hinged to angle upwards at any angle you choose or be flush when folded flat. A wooden hinge of course.
Yeah designing a waveguide for a ribbon, or finding one with a waveguide isn't easy. I can't really see finding a ribbon with a waveguide already as something that will happen. You'll have to design your own and one of the right size to match the woofer you would intend to use. None of this is impossible but it's definitely a headache to overcome.
No thank you. I'd prefer not making my own.
I wonder of the TPL-150H can sound better with a rear facing super
tweeter? To my ears, "air" was what it lacked when I heard them.
I'm still VERY stuck on using a G1 ribbon in the future. Maybe with 6" MTM design. Pro mids ... maybe
Eighteen Sound - Professional loudspeakers
or maybe ...
Faital Pro 6PR150 6.5" Speakers - Faital Pro 6PR150 midrange speaker that has a lightweight neodymium magnet - Faital Pro 6PR150 300 watt 6.5" has an efficiency of 97dB SPL woofer for all high quality midrange applications. Faital Pro 6PR150
I wonder of the TPL-150H can sound better with a rear facing super
tweeter? To my ears, "air" was what it lacked when I heard them.
I'm still VERY stuck on using a G1 ribbon in the future. Maybe with 6" MTM design. Pro mids ... maybe
Eighteen Sound - Professional loudspeakers
or maybe ...
Faital Pro 6PR150 6.5" Speakers - Faital Pro 6PR150 midrange speaker that has a lightweight neodymium magnet - Faital Pro 6PR150 300 watt 6.5" has an efficiency of 97dB SPL woofer for all high quality midrange applications. Faital Pro 6PR150
Did you already look at the original large Heils?
Original Great ESS Heil Air Motion Transformer™ I - LARGE
– ESS Speakers USA
Original Great ESS Heil Air Motion Transformer™ I - LARGE
– ESS Speakers USA