...- preformer is in the room with you instead of polished 3D soundstage behind the speakers
Interesting comment. Except it is exactly the opposite of what I expected based on many other reviews of this OB speaker. Generally most people have talked about the very large 3D sound stage behind the speakers. And that is what they really like about these speakers.
I will measure them tommorow and see whats going on. Recordings are fine, bass is fantastic, soundstage is there, i just cant get enough of top end detail from vifas which resilts in flat image without any perception of depth. So far my manzanitas can barely differentiate FM from DAC, so there must be something going on. Im pretty sure that is not how they are supposed to sound.
When first put together my Ultras were a bit muffled and closed in at upper frequencies. Turns out I'd not done a good job of opening up the back of the baffle for the tc9 to breath. So I took the time to chisel out some of the baffle material and the results were excellent.
I also replaced some mellow sounding caps with the one's in the BOM. Funny, it's a cheaper cap.
The two changes really opened the sound up. Up until that point I'd been playing with different value resistors (which didn't quite open up the sound correctly). Allowing the tweeter some breathing room and a change of caps did the trick. I don't mess with the resistors anymore.
I also replaced some mellow sounding caps with the one's in the BOM. Funny, it's a cheaper cap.
The two changes really opened the sound up. Up until that point I'd been playing with different value resistors (which didn't quite open up the sound correctly). Allowing the tweeter some breathing room and a change of caps did the trick. I don't mess with the resistors anymore.
jogunast... Great that you found a path! One interesting aspect of the Manzanita is its love for class A amplifiers and or good class A/B tube amplifiers. The speaker really reveals switching distortion common in A/B class solid state amplifiers. Don't know why. Hope you enjoy your Manzanita's for many years! J
Interesting.. I will test it with few other AB class 8ohm amps and see what happens.
This JVC is "SuperA" class.. Hybrid class A from late 70s, one of best mass produced amps I've listened to.. somehow completely forgotten.
Manzanitas are keepers, thats for certain. Most "fun" sounding speaker in my collection, hands down. Sure, there are some more revealing ones I still prefer for more serious listening, but this bass combined with huge open soundstage is just too addictive!
Can't stop listening 😂
This JVC is "SuperA" class.. Hybrid class A from late 70s, one of best mass produced amps I've listened to.. somehow completely forgotten.
Manzanitas are keepers, thats for certain. Most "fun" sounding speaker in my collection, hands down. Sure, there are some more revealing ones I still prefer for more serious listening, but this bass combined with huge open soundstage is just too addictive!
Can't stop listening 😂
John, how bad is the switching distortion with an A/B solid state amp. Manzanita is on my short list for future projects, but the amp issue has me concerned since that's the only type of amp I have right now.
My switching distortion comment yesterday deals more with my personal experience with the revealing possibilities of the Manzanita than whether it can be enjoyed with other amplifier classes other than "A". I would venture that the vast majority of Manzanita builders are using non-class "A" amplification and are very happy with the results. As always, YMMV.
A Post Script to my previous post. I have demonstrated various Manzanita designs with Class "A", A/B and Class "D" amplifiers. Every thing from a Dayton Audio $100 Class "D", Musical Fidelity A 308 A/B solid state integrated and various tube amplifiers of A/B, Triode A and SET designs. All sounded great, just some a bit better than others. Again, YMMV.
I’ve been cycling through my amplifier collection with the Manzanitas and am continually surprised and impressed with these speakers. If I absolutely had to rank my preference from memory of the amps I’ve used with them, it could look like this:
First (tie): F5, DH-220C (Hafler DH-200/220 Mods)
Second (tie): Vfet SE lottery amp, TubSuMo
Third: drMordor TPA3255 all-in-one
The margins between these are super thin for preference. It’s difficult to choose.
Regardless, they work well with a variety of amplifier topologies and power levels. Room placement is much more of an influence on how they sound than the amplifier.
They are definitely worth moving to the front of the project list if you haven’t played with OB speakers before.
First (tie): F5, DH-220C (Hafler DH-200/220 Mods)
Second (tie): Vfet SE lottery amp, TubSuMo
Third: drMordor TPA3255 all-in-one
The margins between these are super thin for preference. It’s difficult to choose.
Regardless, they work well with a variety of amplifier topologies and power levels. Room placement is much more of an influence on how they sound than the amplifier.
They are definitely worth moving to the front of the project list if you haven’t played with OB speakers before.
I'm trying to decide between starting with something easier that I can throw together in a hurry like a simple full range with no crossover requirement to just see if I like OB at all. Or to go immediately to the Manzanita.
The cost is not as big an issue as just the time to do the building.
The cost is not as big an issue as just the time to do the building.
I started my OB journey with foam board and four drivers I had on hand. I was shocked by the performance per simplicity.
Ultimate Open Baffle Gallery
With active crossover
Suspended
The Manzies are of course much more refined and sound a lot better, but I still have those foam board OBs in my bedroom, now with MiniDSP 2x4HD crossover.
That probably doesn’t help your decision, but I’d say try Manzanita-like speakers on foam board or XPS panels, possibly with a simplified crossover to see if OBs generally work for you. Then go for the proven build.
Ultimate Open Baffle Gallery
With active crossover
Suspended
The Manzies are of course much more refined and sound a lot better, but I still have those foam board OBs in my bedroom, now with MiniDSP 2x4HD crossover.
That probably doesn’t help your decision, but I’d say try Manzanita-like speakers on foam board or XPS panels, possibly with a simplified crossover to see if OBs generally work for you. Then go for the proven build.
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Off the top of my head the Manzi or Ultra will likely trounce a full range driver in an open baffle in the bass. In my opinion.
Full range drivers are often augmented with a big bass driver (that gets driven by a plate amp). It works. It may or may not be less work to build or less expense compared to John's designs.
The only single driver speakers that I've heard that had great bass without resorting to an additional bass driver were the transmission line designs by Bob Brines. Those were not open baffles.
Full range drivers are often augmented with a big bass driver (that gets driven by a plate amp). It works. It may or may not be less work to build or less expense compared to John's designs.
The only single driver speakers that I've heard that had great bass without resorting to an additional bass driver were the transmission line designs by Bob Brines. Those were not open baffles.