Balanced crossovers ??
That's interesting.
If all audio chain is balanced and his power amp indeed is a balanced circuit,
then unwanted noise are canceled and finally at the end, we get single speaker outputs
(one stereo channel with 2 pairs of (-) (+) terminals)
Logically one crossover stereo boards is perfect between the amplifier outputs and the speakers.
Or not..? Please explain
That's interesting.
If all audio chain is balanced and his power amp indeed is a balanced circuit,
then unwanted noise are canceled and finally at the end, we get single speaker outputs
(one stereo channel with 2 pairs of (-) (+) terminals)
Logically one crossover stereo boards is perfect between the amplifier outputs and the speakers.
Or not..? Please explain
These are active crossovers so they go between a balanced DAC output and balanced input amplifiers. So in my case I have a DAC xlr output connected to the crossover board which outputs 2 channels of balanced signals to my stereo amp module. The amp and crossover board will be in the speaker stands. I will be replacing the passive crossover in my speaker.
Ok is small size class D amp ?
But why not connect DAC xlr output to xlr amp ( integrated amplifier with balanced preamp included ? )
then filter signal after amplification..with one stereo board in the stand..
the important question is better to filter & equalize
audio signal before amplification or after amplification..?
But why not connect DAC xlr output to xlr amp ( integrated amplifier with balanced preamp included ? )
then filter signal after amplification..with one stereo board in the stand..
the important question is better to filter & equalize
audio signal before amplification or after amplification..?
Yes, class D amps.
There is not right answer to before or after amplification. Before is active and requires more amps. After is passive and only requires one amp channel per speaker (The way of most of the world does it).
If you are doing the crossover after the amplification you don't need the crossover board discussed in this thread.
There is not right answer to before or after amplification. Before is active and requires more amps. After is passive and only requires one amp channel per speaker (The way of most of the world does it).
If you are doing the crossover after the amplification you don't need the crossover board discussed in this thread.
@ Wcwc
Not doing crossover after or before with 12" full (wide) range speaker drivers they don't need it any.
I am expert of not crossovers use ha-ha
It's a different story for my new compression drivers with his horns (medium highs)
use of active crossovers with all flexibility and bi-amplification, another dedicated amplifier for large woofer
can be enjoyable musically this is what I need for more complex another style audio system. Entertainement
Audio + the art of technical compromises
Not doing crossover after or before with 12" full (wide) range speaker drivers they don't need it any.
I am expert of not crossovers use ha-ha
It's a different story for my new compression drivers with his horns (medium highs)
use of active crossovers with all flexibility and bi-amplification, another dedicated amplifier for large woofer
can be enjoyable musically this is what I need for more complex another style audio system. Entertainement
Audio + the art of technical compromises
I just ordered two
Sorry about that! The listing has been updated with the included parts - PCB, 24 matched JFETs and paired biasing resistors.
@ Wcwc
Not doing crossover after or before with 12" full (wide) range speaker drivers they don't need it any.
I am expert of not crossovers use ha-ha
It's a different story for my new compression drivers with his horns (medium highs)
use of active crossovers with all flexibility and bi-amplification, another dedicated amplifier for large woofer
can be enjoyable musically this is what I need for more complex another style audio system. Entertainement
Audio + the art of technical compromises
and one thing not to forget is the time alignement between HORN and Bass Driver it is very important as the crossover frequency will be in the sensible zone and you want they all play in the same time
Thanks a lot, just ordered the rest of the components over digikey. I had the bom but I just wanted to make sure.
Crossover RC values
In the 24 db/octave crossover section of the 6-24 documentation it says:
"The only point to note is that the classic L-R alignment will result from the P2 potentiometers to be at around 1/2 the resistance of the other pots" To clarify, this ONLY applies to P2 pots of the High Pass sections.
Given the number of pots to adjust, it might be easier to use an inexpensive crossover or miniDSP to predetermine your crossover points. I used a dbx 223xs.
Then, you can calculate the needed R values using an online calculator or program. I used this one for Windows found at Elliott Sound Products: https://sound-au.com/software/esp-lr13.exe
With the R values in hand, you can then preset the pots or just use fixed resistors. Since I don't like having 16 pots in circuit, I'm planning to use fixed resistors.
Thanks Nelson for another great project !
In the 24 db/octave crossover section of the 6-24 documentation it says:
"The only point to note is that the classic L-R alignment will result from the P2 potentiometers to be at around 1/2 the resistance of the other pots" To clarify, this ONLY applies to P2 pots of the High Pass sections.
Given the number of pots to adjust, it might be easier to use an inexpensive crossover or miniDSP to predetermine your crossover points. I used a dbx 223xs.
Then, you can calculate the needed R values using an online calculator or program. I used this one for Windows found at Elliott Sound Products: https://sound-au.com/software/esp-lr13.exe
With the R values in hand, you can then preset the pots or just use fixed resistors. Since I don't like having 16 pots in circuit, I'm planning to use fixed resistors.
Thanks Nelson for another great project !
Hi, I am having a pair of Divas rebuilt and I too intend to bi-amp or even tri-amp them using Nelson’s xover. Are you open to comparing filter settings etc via PM or email?
Sure, but I am going to stay close to the original shallower in-phase slopes. Changing phase on different higher order slopes to maintain level ruins transient behavior
It’s quite a different story if you play at high volumes and need the protection to the ribbons
however
Keeping a tight pulse is what I want
Regards
David
It’s quite a different story if you play at high volumes and need the protection to the ribbons
however
Keeping a tight pulse is what I want
Regards
David
and one thing not to forget is the time alignement between HORN and Bass Driver it is very important as the crossover frequency will be in the sensible zone and you want they all play in the same time
Yes and with not so perfect room acoustic
Always something new to tryJust ordered 2 boards.
Thanks Nelson for getting this out to us.
This is something I have been wanting to try for a very long time.
One thing that never made sense to me is spending real hard cash on a very good DAC, then tossing a mini-DSP or some such into the signal path and redoing the whole ADC/DAC routine just for tri-amping. I expect digital crossovers are probably the best thing, but I can't afford 3 good DAC's (really can't afford the one I own).
-Josh
Thanks Nelson for getting this out to us.
This is something I have been wanting to try for a very long time.
One thing that never made sense to me is spending real hard cash on a very good DAC, then tossing a mini-DSP or some such into the signal path and redoing the whole ADC/DAC routine just for tri-amping. I expect digital crossovers are probably the best thing, but I can't afford 3 good DAC's (really can't afford the one I own).
-Josh
Hi Josh,
I agree the ends has to justify the means. But in retail hifi it not the way it works!
Another take on this is the vinyl user who has a very expensive cartridge. It’s unlikely this user will want AD then DA conversion in the signal path.
In use the real problem with a hi end digital crossover processor is audible mechanical noise from the cooling fans.
I agree the ends has to justify the means. But in retail hifi it not the way it works!
Another take on this is the vinyl user who has a very expensive cartridge. It’s unlikely this user will want AD then DA conversion in the signal path.
In use the real problem with a hi end digital crossover processor is audible mechanical noise from the cooling fans.
Hi Pa
I read through the manual a few times. I’m still wrapping my head around it all, but have some kits on the way.
I’m looking for information concerning the footprint of the WIMA FKP “C” and “C/2” caps. Also, what is the voltage rating they should be?
I’m trying to order cap values that would allow some flexibility. I’d like to try to mimic examples given of 6 and 24dB/octave slopes in the manual and finally set up a 3 way system. Not sure I want to worry about phase issues with the 12 and 18dB/octave filters.
I am currently using a B5. I was hoping the easiest way to create a band and high pass filter would be to feed the high pass of the B5 into a Bi Amp board.
I think the B5 crossover can have its center frequency adjusted from 100-300Hz if I remember correctly?
I have the B5 set to about 150Hz to manage things between my Oris horns with Lowther DX3 and the SLOB bass units I built. I’ve got a subwoofer fudged in at the very bottom as the bass panels are a little small and come up short.
I will be using a new Dipole Acoustic Elegance solution for all bass requirements.
I want to try some Edgar horns I have with my F2J clones. I have 2” Radian and Dynaudio drivers to use with them. I believe the lowest recommended crossover point would be around 800Hz for either...but it may need to be higher.
I’m going to need a solution for in between the Dipoles and Edgars. My hope is to make an adapter for an extra set of Oris horns I have to allow me to use them with B&C 8pe21 drivers in the approximate 200-800Hz range.
The values discussed in your article for “C” and “C/2” of 10nF and 4.7nF seem like they would give me the range I need for the crossover point between the two horns...260Hz-1.6KHz for 6dB/octave...380Hz-1.2KHz for 24dB/octave. I’d probably want more adjustability with the 4 pole filter if its to be had by replacing P2 with a 25K and the 10K resistors with 4.7K in the high pass section.
I’m open to suggestions with this...sort of flying by the seat of my pants. I’ve taken the easier route of fullrange drivers up until now.
I read through the manual a few times. I’m still wrapping my head around it all, but have some kits on the way.
I’m looking for information concerning the footprint of the WIMA FKP “C” and “C/2” caps. Also, what is the voltage rating they should be?
I’m trying to order cap values that would allow some flexibility. I’d like to try to mimic examples given of 6 and 24dB/octave slopes in the manual and finally set up a 3 way system. Not sure I want to worry about phase issues with the 12 and 18dB/octave filters.
I am currently using a B5. I was hoping the easiest way to create a band and high pass filter would be to feed the high pass of the B5 into a Bi Amp board.
I think the B5 crossover can have its center frequency adjusted from 100-300Hz if I remember correctly?
I have the B5 set to about 150Hz to manage things between my Oris horns with Lowther DX3 and the SLOB bass units I built. I’ve got a subwoofer fudged in at the very bottom as the bass panels are a little small and come up short.
I will be using a new Dipole Acoustic Elegance solution for all bass requirements.
I want to try some Edgar horns I have with my F2J clones. I have 2” Radian and Dynaudio drivers to use with them. I believe the lowest recommended crossover point would be around 800Hz for either...but it may need to be higher.
I’m going to need a solution for in between the Dipoles and Edgars. My hope is to make an adapter for an extra set of Oris horns I have to allow me to use them with B&C 8pe21 drivers in the approximate 200-800Hz range.
The values discussed in your article for “C” and “C/2” of 10nF and 4.7nF seem like they would give me the range I need for the crossover point between the two horns...260Hz-1.6KHz for 6dB/octave...380Hz-1.2KHz for 24dB/octave. I’d probably want more adjustability with the 4 pole filter if its to be had by replacing P2 with a 25K and the 10K resistors with 4.7K in the high pass section.
I’m open to suggestions with this...sort of flying by the seat of my pants. I’ve taken the easier route of fullrange drivers up until now.
Another question I thought of...
If running 2 or 3 boards in the same case for a 3 or 4 way system what are the power supply requirements?
If I wanted to try using one of the 24V 500mA wallworts to start will it supply enough current to run them all?...or do I have come up with another solution?
If running 2 or 3 boards in the same case for a 3 or 4 way system what are the power supply requirements?
If I wanted to try using one of the 24V 500mA wallworts to start will it supply enough current to run them all?...or do I have come up with another solution?
