I remember as a kid, building a bunch of pipes for mortars for a local display. I got put on 'circle duty' cutting out the bottoms for the tubes to be welded on. Thankfully dad had a motorized circle cutting attachment for the cutting torch.
building subs is easier work.
Jim; Aw yes the good old days of reloading and hand firring out of steel. We now use HDEP plastic and wood plugs pressed and screwed in. Then we rack them up 10,8,6 or 4 in a rack depending on pipe size.
Yes I am hoping the speakers are more fun.
Andy
Yes I am hoping the speakers are more fun.
Andy
True, but I also feel that new designs brings us all forward, new ways of solving problem, new thinking, and more inspiration.
People have asked me several times "why don't you charge for the design?" and to me the answer is simple, what made me do it and the how I got there is a result of others sharing their knowledge and offering their help.
I see it like this, if my design can help you accomplish something, and that also goes for all the others out there using it, then by all means, it's my way of paying back a bit of what I gain here.
Sorry for drifting slightly of topic here, I just think that what we do is a great thing, and this thread somehow sort of sums it up in a nice way.
Ok So let me ask some more specific questions. First off has anyone seen a chart or table comparing subwoofer cabinet designs? IE a tapped horn will give you a 6db gain over a FLH but it is bigger. Thare should be a paper on basic speaker design theory someware. Andy
Martinsson, Thank you for a great design and not having too big of an ego. I have read many of your post on several forums and you are always quite humble about your designs. Guys like you are what makes DIY fun.
OK, I have boosted you ego enough. Now get back to work.
The problem is there are no "apples to apples" comparisons, because a driver that works well in tapped horn, doesn't necessarily work well in a front loaded horn, that may not work well in.....
However, as a general rule, a front loaded horn may be as much as 12db down from low to high frequency of it's pass band. As a front loaded horn goes from a 1/4 wave to 1/2 wave, it's efficiency really gains. You have to work REALLY hard in designing a FLH to flatten out the response. As an overly simplistic analogy, a tapped horn "can, but doesn't necessarily have to" split that passband, hack off the gains in the upper half, and add it to the lower half. Meaning that a TH (same driver same overall cabinet volume) can have a flat response, while a front loaded can have a rising response. This is oversimplifying, and only for single cabinets... As you stack horns of each type, things change. Both "can" achieve many db over a ported or sealed cabinet, in the order of 6-9db or so. However even that is subject to how good the design is.
so, the reason you haven't got an answer to this question... is that generalities just don't cut it on FLH vs TH vs whatever else... you have to take design A and compare it directly to design B, and decide which one best suits the needs that you have.
Here is a comparison on a dual mcm cabinet. Now the mcm driver is a better FLH driver than a TH driver (my opinion) however in the exact same size (209 liters) I can approximate similar response. If I'd played with the sims a little more, I could have gotten them to almost exactly overlap.
so... My personal opinion is that an answer to this question really isn't possible.
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OK Jim that makes sense. I guess I was thinking it cuold be simplified the way antenna gain can. So realy thare is no "best" it all depends!
OK back to reading. Thanks again for your thoughts. Andy
OK back to reading. Thanks again for your thoughts. Andy
4Pyros : two are currently being built by SlatitH, a forum contact here in sweden, a comparison session have been voiced, I'm grateful to him for giving them a go and I doubt he will be disapointed.
In the light of that the refector equipped MKII still only remains an idea, with no proven advantages over the origninal, if i where to recomend a proven concept it would be the original.
The reflectors was initially and idea put forward by William Cowan in order to combat a notch cancelation in the 180Hz region (hardly noticable when in real use) , but seeing as they are rather easy to incorporate I thought i'd put it out threre as a thought on paper.
In the light of that the refector equipped MKII still only remains an idea, with no proven advantages over the origninal, if i where to recomend a proven concept it would be the original.
The reflectors was initially and idea put forward by William Cowan in order to combat a notch cancelation in the 180Hz region (hardly noticable when in real use) , but seeing as they are rather easy to incorporate I thought i'd put it out threre as a thought on paper.
All right then Anders. Please let me know how SlatitH makes out. I am now looking at the CB-18 Cyclops, any thoughts on this one? Andy
Beware the one eyed monster! - Speakerplans.com Forums - Page 1
are you thinking about trying to use your eminence 18's in this? (I wouldn't...)
This is a 45hz TH just like the SS15.
Lots of respect from me to stipe.....
Jim; Sorry you lost me on
Looking at the CB-18, the path lengths seem to short. I could not find any good sims or readings for this box, but thay are trying to cross it at 38MHz. I am not really looking for a box for the 18s that I have, just looking. I would still like to see something between your two boxs. Do you know of any that have been built? I am not trying to be a pain just trying to learn all the designs that have been made out thare. I still have alot of time untill I get to make sawdust and I get throne off on tangents here and thare. It would be nice if thare was a guild to all the boxs. Andy
I was trying to say I respect staiper's design's posted on speakerplans. He's provided several designs to the public.
Kinda funny that he and I both settled on a design 'just short' of flat to 40hz.
The fact that I found a way to get it built out of a single sheet of ply... well that is a design goal that most people would never think about, and is actually what pushed me to design 'just short' of 40hz. Now that I did it, I'm glad. I'm absolutely a flat-to-40 person, but where this gets me that goal in pairs, well it gives me the best of all worlds. (well, not for dub or d&b at 32hz.... but that's a different thread.)
Here's link to the 'reverse engineered' hornresp inputs for the cb-18.
Beware the one eyed monster! - Speakerplans.com Forums - Page 6
just for giggles, I ran a quick sim of the void18 in the cp18 cabinet vs a pair of the ss15's, equal power. A pair of ss15's is 20% larger in pack space volume.
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WOW Jim; Thanks again for your insights. The sim you did answers all the questions. Your SS15 is still on the top of my list. Thanks for the link but even that sim seems to be in question. Andy
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Hello mates, 🙂
..I have googled older cb-18 topic and emerged here.
Just for note , Void V18-1000 is not ideal driver for CB-18 but still works (in real test peaks and dips are not such pronounced as on simulation).
Smoother response in CB-18 you will get with B&C 18TBX100 , 18SW100, or 18Sound 18NLW9400 , even little Eminence 15" KappaLite 3015LF will do for extra light or "budget" version.
There is also 2 extended versions of CB-18 (CBe-18 and CBX-18) ..
CBX-18 is 24% larger than original CB-18 and with 18Sound 18NLW9400 promises really nice response.
I'll post HR sim tomorrow .. now wanna get some sleep 🙂 (1.23AM now here )
Best wishes.
..I have googled older cb-18 topic and emerged here.
Just for note , Void V18-1000 is not ideal driver for CB-18 but still works (in real test peaks and dips are not such pronounced as on simulation).
Smoother response in CB-18 you will get with B&C 18TBX100 , 18SW100, or 18Sound 18NLW9400 , even little Eminence 15" KappaLite 3015LF will do for extra light or "budget" version.
There is also 2 extended versions of CB-18 (CBe-18 and CBX-18) ..
CBX-18 is 24% larger than original CB-18 and with 18Sound 18NLW9400 promises really nice response.
I'll post HR sim tomorrow .. now wanna get some sleep 🙂 (1.23AM now here )
Best wishes.
OK guys I need to order the QSC amps for this project. The origanal intent was to use two amp racks and 4 sets of speakers. One rack would be wired between two sets of speakers 50' to 100' apart. I dont know if this is the best way. most setups I have seen have a set of amps for each set of speakers. Any thoughts? Andy
OK I have gotten the go ahead to make tapped horns, but I need to try and use the speakers we have. Could someone sim a Kappa Pro-15A in a SS15 box for me so I can see how good it mite be? thanks Andy
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