You are not totally wrong
But i'm doubting that the US army gives so much money every year for the tinnitus sequels just by empathy.
IMHO they have judged severely.
The US VA probably has one of the largest audiology studies in the world, considering they are treating almost 1million patients with service connected hearing loss. A lot of their research is done in conjunction with local colleges.
absolutely agreed !
A lot of people are thinking that the veterans disabilities are connected to PTSD (psycologic problems).
No... it's neuronal physical damages.
Yes, the figure doesn't have any references so could easily be a politician's statement and ......
Yes, we're also going thru a National Election but our embarrassing circus only last a month or so!
That HSR&D study is quite confusing - it reads like a study of how effective the application of a treatment method has been applied to veterans - no mention of the benefits or actual effectiveness of any treatments themselves - an auditing of some institutional program rather than an evaluation of any actual medical/patient benefit.
"VHA and the QUERI recognize the need to assess determinants of gaps in delivery of Progressive Tinnitus Management (PTM) and support the proposed study".
The last sentence is a bit clearer .....
"This work will inform best approaches to implementation of PTM to meet the needs of all Veterans who suffer from tinnitus".
So it seems like they've got some protocol or other in mind to alleviate the tinnitus throughout VA but don't know how to put it into effect - I wonder what this PTM is, and how it's supposed to work? I wonder if we have anything similar?
Yes, we're also going thru a National Election but our embarrassing circus only last a month or so!
That HSR&D study is quite confusing - it reads like a study of how effective the application of a treatment method has been applied to veterans - no mention of the benefits or actual effectiveness of any treatments themselves - an auditing of some institutional program rather than an evaluation of any actual medical/patient benefit.
"VHA and the QUERI recognize the need to assess determinants of gaps in delivery of Progressive Tinnitus Management (PTM) and support the proposed study".
The last sentence is a bit clearer .....
"This work will inform best approaches to implementation of PTM to meet the needs of all Veterans who suffer from tinnitus".
So it seems like they've got some protocol or other in mind to alleviate the tinnitus throughout VA but don't know how to put it into effect - I wonder what this PTM is, and how it's supposed to work? I wonder if we have anything similar?
A lot of things have been tried since the Vietnam war to cure the tinnitus.
The last chance was the experience that i've described in my prevoious post... it works on the rat, but not really on the humain.
This reason is called "saliency" by the neurologists, a cruel side effect of our human nature.
Now all patients are treated individually, there is no protocol and no standardized procedure but IMHO the saliency is the key of the problem.
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My 2-cents
I live a few blocks from the HQ of the Canadian Hearing Society. Testing is free (in Ontario and other civilized jurisdictions) and bears no comparison to the crude (and biased) testing at hearing stores. Even if you aren't covered, might be well worth a trip to Toronto (cheap Canadian dollar, eh). For sure, a person should get tested if only to establish a baseline.
There are quite a variety of causes to symptoms called tinnitus. Some such as cramped jaw muscles (TMJ, I think it is called) in your cheeks are treatable. But mostly, a matter of behavioural treatment.
As far as I can tell, the safety standards for noise are not based on good evidence. I know we've been hearing those numbers for years, but just isn't real. For sure, I am not saying to expose yourself to loud noise - do not - but the standards are loosey-goosey.
Some interesting research on the hearing of motorcycle cops in different countries that tries to "drill down" on hearing loss and bike exposure. Big interest of mine.
Apropos our audio world, don't forget the El Greco fallacy. Worth reading the wiki. In short, whatever your hearing shortcomings, you can still strive to make sound at home that compares to sound your hear in concerts.
Ben
I live a few blocks from the HQ of the Canadian Hearing Society. Testing is free (in Ontario and other civilized jurisdictions) and bears no comparison to the crude (and biased) testing at hearing stores. Even if you aren't covered, might be well worth a trip to Toronto (cheap Canadian dollar, eh). For sure, a person should get tested if only to establish a baseline.
There are quite a variety of causes to symptoms called tinnitus. Some such as cramped jaw muscles (TMJ, I think it is called) in your cheeks are treatable. But mostly, a matter of behavioural treatment.
As far as I can tell, the safety standards for noise are not based on good evidence. I know we've been hearing those numbers for years, but just isn't real. For sure, I am not saying to expose yourself to loud noise - do not - but the standards are loosey-goosey.
Some interesting research on the hearing of motorcycle cops in different countries that tries to "drill down" on hearing loss and bike exposure. Big interest of mine.
Apropos our audio world, don't forget the El Greco fallacy. Worth reading the wiki. In short, whatever your hearing shortcomings, you can still strive to make sound at home that compares to sound your hear in concerts.
Ben
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(i don't believe in chemistery, drugs and meditation)
I prefer to eat cholcolate !
Just avoid salts. Salt depletes aldoserone which then causes hearing loss.
Rewire or reprogram?
Silverprout- can you offer any links that address the factor of saliency as it pertains to the issue of tinnitus? Words can often be very context related. I've had raging pulsating / almost intermodulating ring in my head for over a decade - like a 70dB noise floor, and with HF that probably starts dropping off between 12-14kHz. Local annual occupational (WCB) hearing tests don't go much higher than 10k (?) with suitable degree of resolution.
One of the 3 legs in my belief chair on the subject is that HF loss from whatever source is a major factor in the development and endurance of tinnitus i. e. the brain's auditory processing software is expecting a broad bandwidth input datasream, and in the absence of higher frequencies synthesises some to fill in the gaps. This is most likely pure poppycock - but the world is populated by many who believe in far stranger postulations with little empirical evidence.
Silverprout- can you offer any links that address the factor of saliency as it pertains to the issue of tinnitus? Words can often be very context related. I've had raging pulsating / almost intermodulating ring in my head for over a decade - like a 70dB noise floor, and with HF that probably starts dropping off between 12-14kHz. Local annual occupational (WCB) hearing tests don't go much higher than 10k (?) with suitable degree of resolution.
One of the 3 legs in my belief chair on the subject is that HF loss from whatever source is a major factor in the development and endurance of tinnitus i. e. the brain's auditory processing software is expecting a broad bandwidth input datasream, and in the absence of higher frequencies synthesises some to fill in the gaps. This is most likely pure poppycock - but the world is populated by many who believe in far stranger postulations with little empirical evidence.
The Tomatis Method is mostly applied to ADAH-disabled kids. Strictly an "alternative medicine"* with no good research support for anything except helping hyperactive kids calm down for an expensive hour or two.
Behavioural approaches do help many with tinnitus (or even everybody to some degree), and methods akin to meditation and calming can be helpful. But no need to buy-into the unsupported beliefs of an old cult for those benefits.
Ben
*for some people, "alternative medicine" is a euphemism for "imaginative speculation" or maybe "baloney"
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The Tomatis method is useful for any problem associated with the 8th nerve, not just ADAH, etc and it's been around for over 70 years, originating in Europe - it's particularly successful for relieving tinnitus and CPS and the quite economical 'self help' version was actually developed in Canada
From your comment (paraphrased here) "alternative medicine" is a euphemism for ... "baloney", what conventional treatment do you use, and how successful is it?
All the conventional treatments I've tried over the years have been based on some drug or another and the side effects are worse than the tinnitus itself. Perhaps you've discovered something that functions better?
From your comment (paraphrased here) "alternative medicine" is a euphemism for ... "baloney", what conventional treatment do you use, and how successful is it?
All the conventional treatments I've tried over the years have been based on some drug or another and the side effects are worse than the tinnitus itself. Perhaps you've discovered something that functions better?
Various causes and various treatments, as I previously posted. But better learning to better carry on the behaviour of your life despite tinnitus always helps.
If you can find some reputable published research showing Tomatis helps tinnitus despite seven decades of promotion, we'd all be very grateful to see it. Otherwise, stop plugging it here.
Lots of training-like experiences, possibly including Tomatis, are helpful for music listening and other skills of hearing. And as I said apropos ADAH, in so far as it gets you out of the house and into contact with your hearing, a good thing. No question.
Just because there aren't good treatments for some of the most distressing kinds of tinnitus doesn't mean you should endorse unsubstantiated alternative methods.
Ben
If you can find some reputable published research showing Tomatis helps tinnitus despite seven decades of promotion, we'd all be very grateful to see it. Otherwise, stop plugging it here.
Lots of training-like experiences, possibly including Tomatis, are helpful for music listening and other skills of hearing. And as I said apropos ADAH, in so far as it gets you out of the house and into contact with your hearing, a good thing. No question.
Just because there aren't good treatments for some of the most distressing kinds of tinnitus doesn't mean you should endorse unsubstantiated alternative methods.
Ben
... dunno about unsubstantiated or not, but the system worked for me when nothing else came close and since then, a number of people here, mainly in the music business have received substantial reduction, if not complete elimination, of tinnitus - can't say it much plainer than that, can I -
This is why I mentioned the possible positive results others may get using this, or one of the similar methods - open minds, non-institutional approach and all that, eh!
Anyway, this 'delusional self' has other things to do ....
This is why I mentioned the possible positive results others may get using this, or one of the similar methods - open minds, non-institutional approach and all that, eh!
Anyway, this 'delusional self' has other things to do ....
I d'ont publish my medical data on the web and my readings are in french (and i d'ont know where i've put them right now
), i can't illustrate.But the method is simple :
I make an audioscan to localize the notches, the tinnitus is in that notches.
Then redefine more precisely the notch zone to find the tinnitus and weigh its relative level to the whole octave of the audioscan zone level.
Be sure that this method can reveal some hidden tinnitus, so experiment it only on the already audible
Dsaliency : why we don't have data)Accuracy is good IMHO.
- and exactly how do these processes lead to "treatment / cure" for tinnitus, which as noted above can have any of a number of factors in play for a given individual at the same time .
Ben - by the time stamp of my previous post, I can recall that was during a late evening hot soak in the tub, after one half a Farmacy gummy bear* and 2 glasses of house made white - we save the store bought stuff for Friday dinner sushi on the deck - in other words, an average week night.
My son has long held that some of his most elaborate thinking & guitar playing , some of which he might even be able to remember or repeat, can be attributed to the herb. We laughed that off when he was a punk kid, but now - hmm, he might have a point.
Ben - by the time stamp of my previous post, I can recall that was during a late evening hot soak in the tub, after one half a Farmacy gummy bear* and 2 glasses of house made white - we save the store bought stuff for Friday dinner sushi on the deck - in other words, an average week night.
My son has long held that some of his most elaborate thinking & guitar playing , some of which he might even be able to remember or repeat, can be attributed to the herb. We laughed that off when he was a punk kid, but now - hmm, he might have a point.
Hearing Loss
I never studied hearing loss and health, although I have studied health for several decades. Certainly one of the most competent nutritionist of our time is Gary Null. Gary did a study to show that male pattern baldness can be reversed, which he did by substituting much healthier food and supplements for a conventional American diet. Men who were significantly bald did regrow hair in their bald spots.
I eat a raw food diet, and my hair is not receding, although it has thinned somewhat (I am 58), while many of my friends of similar age do have receding hairlines.
I believe that the statement about blood flow is correct. A poor diet is associated with atherosclerosis which reduces blood flow, and leads to osteo arthritis and dementia. I suspect that this contributes to hearing loss as well. What causes the atherosclerosis, primarily, is oxidized cholesterol and blood sugar swings. A good way to avoid both these things is eating a raw food diet, made up of raw fruits and vegetables, nuts and sprouted grains. This diet will reverse atherosclerosis and could improve hearing (theoretically), although it does cause the regrowth of hair.
Macular degeneration is a progressive disease. I am studying this because my mother has had it for years and has poor eyesight. An eye doctor has development a treatment of improved diet and microcurrent, and 70% of the patients that he has treated experience improved eyesight. Maybe microcrurrent can help to reverse hearing loss?
Retsel
I never studied hearing loss and health, although I have studied health for several decades. Certainly one of the most competent nutritionist of our time is Gary Null. Gary did a study to show that male pattern baldness can be reversed, which he did by substituting much healthier food and supplements for a conventional American diet. Men who were significantly bald did regrow hair in their bald spots.
I eat a raw food diet, and my hair is not receding, although it has thinned somewhat (I am 58), while many of my friends of similar age do have receding hairlines.
I believe that the statement about blood flow is correct. A poor diet is associated with atherosclerosis which reduces blood flow, and leads to osteo arthritis and dementia. I suspect that this contributes to hearing loss as well. What causes the atherosclerosis, primarily, is oxidized cholesterol and blood sugar swings. A good way to avoid both these things is eating a raw food diet, made up of raw fruits and vegetables, nuts and sprouted grains. This diet will reverse atherosclerosis and could improve hearing (theoretically), although it does cause the regrowth of hair.
Macular degeneration is a progressive disease. I am studying this because my mother has had it for years and has poor eyesight. An eye doctor has development a treatment of improved diet and microcurrent, and 70% of the patients that he has treated experience improved eyesight. Maybe microcrurrent can help to reverse hearing loss?
Retsel