Re: hi slicemaster
And in the case of the DC300 and brethern, defining the bleeding edge.
dave
mikek said:
And in the case of the DC300 and brethern, defining the bleeding edge.
dave
Ron,
No pink noise but I do have some reference recordings ( take them sound with me to listen to the markets latest overpriced toys too). I do adjust with how the room is involved. Glad you have been around the block, makes it easier to exchange ideas or to at least understand how someone has arrived where they are.
David
No pink noise but I do have some reference recordings ( take them sound with me to listen to the markets latest overpriced toys too). I do adjust with how the room is involved. Glad you have been around the block, makes it easier to exchange ideas or to at least understand how someone has arrived where they are.
David
I kind of hope slice is embarrased for blowing up at me, I was trying to be friendly to him. I am sorry for any insult I have given you, slice, I meant none. Plus, You've really got a lot of guts calling me a piece of **** all the way from CA... or wait, no you don't. There were many times I had to restrain myself from calling you a bad word and whatnot...but I didn't. I think what ticked him off is when I called him ignorant. **** slice, ignorant doesn't mean stupid, it means not knowing. If you don't know something, you are ignorant in that respect. Don't jump down my throat dude.
and here
??!!
look back to the beginning. That's all i gave! I wasn't worried about the amps, I don't know much about amps! I thought the crowns would be fine. In truth, I am IGNORANT to most things about amps.
still pissed, but saddened,
andy
and here
??!!
look back to the beginning. That's all i gave! I wasn't worried about the amps, I don't know much about amps! I thought the crowns would be fine. In truth, I am IGNORANT to most things about amps.
still pissed, but saddened,
andy
i am still here....
Bostarob and every one else I was agitated with…
I am truly sorry! I really am I hope you can find it in your harts to forgive me but if you don’t I truly understand… you guys were not the ***** I was.
I even feel remorseful for biting off mrfeedback. He probably had lots of information to offer but I never gave him the chance. I was short with all for you here and I hope we can patch this up. I know I made a lousy first impression…I am really not usually like that.
Well I could write pages on how sorry I am but I figure I should get to the good news.
First, I HAVE NOT GIVEN UP….heheh…. aren’t you excited….
Second, as I have realized and you guys have pointed out countless times is that I bit off more then I can handle… so I am going to take all your guys’ advice and keep it simple.
Last, I have some thing you can help me with immediately if you would like to…
Here’s the deal.
My brother has been away in another country for 2 years…
He loves music…
He is coming home in 3 months and I figured I would give him a real nice set of tower speakers as a welcome home gift…
This project has limited funds so lets keep it cheap and of course simple.
I was thinking maybe they would be 2-ways?
Now here is where I would love help…
I would like to hear what you guys think…
Do you guys think I can do it?
Or do you think I have bit off more then I can chew again?
Thanks all,
Slice
Bostarob and every one else I was agitated with…
I am truly sorry! I really am I hope you can find it in your harts to forgive me but if you don’t I truly understand… you guys were not the ***** I was.
I even feel remorseful for biting off mrfeedback. He probably had lots of information to offer but I never gave him the chance. I was short with all for you here and I hope we can patch this up. I know I made a lousy first impression…I am really not usually like that.
Well I could write pages on how sorry I am but I figure I should get to the good news.
First, I HAVE NOT GIVEN UP….heheh…. aren’t you excited….
Second, as I have realized and you guys have pointed out countless times is that I bit off more then I can handle… so I am going to take all your guys’ advice and keep it simple.
Last, I have some thing you can help me with immediately if you would like to…
Here’s the deal.
My brother has been away in another country for 2 years…
He loves music…
He is coming home in 3 months and I figured I would give him a real nice set of tower speakers as a welcome home gift…
This project has limited funds so lets keep it cheap and of course simple.
I was thinking maybe they would be 2-ways?
Now here is where I would love help…
I would like to hear what you guys think…
Do you guys think I can do it?
Or do you think I have bit off more then I can chew again?
Thanks all,
Slice
I forgive you man. You remind me of me when I first started.
the kit I am sure will be a good idea. Another is one that I have built, Hi-Vi F8 (60$) in 1.6 ft3 tuned to 33 Hz. Tweeter is Vifa d25ag(30$). It will get pretty low bass, and mids are awesome. I have it in a .75 ft3 box right now, don't ask why, It is way too small. If you like I will give you xover design. It will work in a box as small as 1 ft 3. I reccomend a tall box 10" wide with a 10" diameter Sonotube in the back, with the rear chamber filled with sand (ie Vance Dickason). ooooooo, that is my future project. Cheap too! I think you could do the whole thing for 300.
-andy
the kit I am sure will be a good idea. Another is one that I have built, Hi-Vi F8 (60$) in 1.6 ft3 tuned to 33 Hz. Tweeter is Vifa d25ag(30$). It will get pretty low bass, and mids are awesome. I have it in a .75 ft3 box right now, don't ask why, It is way too small. If you like I will give you xover design. It will work in a box as small as 1 ft 3. I reccomend a tall box 10" wide with a 10" diameter Sonotube in the back, with the rear chamber filled with sand (ie Vance Dickason). ooooooo, that is my future project. Cheap too! I think you could do the whole thing for 300.
-andy
Has anyone here checked out the Voigt Pipe? I was thinking about doing one. You would need woodworking skills to build the cabinets but it has no crossover and madisound sells the Fostex 208 Sigma drivers for 139.00 each. I saw a site where people rave about them and you can make them look really nice. Do you have any woodworking skills Slice?😱
If anybodys interested I will fetch the link and post it in this thread.😉
The speaker has the spl of the driver, which for the fostex208 is 95.6 db. This makes them ideal for inefficient amps
I decided not to be lazy so here is the link http://indigo.ie/~walton/voigt.html let me know what you think😎
If anybodys interested I will fetch the link and post it in this thread.😉
The speaker has the spl of the driver, which for the fostex208 is 95.6 db. This makes them ideal for inefficient amps
I decided not to be lazy so here is the link http://indigo.ie/~walton/voigt.html let me know what you think😎
PassFan said:
I am running a set of Voigt pipes -- Bert Doppenberg Bi-polar ML-TQWTs (BD-Pipes ) to be specific. They use two 4" Fostex FE-103s (or variants -- i use RS 40-1197s at the moment). Their musicallity is stunning. There cost is unbelievably cheap (particularily if you can find 4 clear-out 40-1197s -- <$20 USD). I don't think they would have enuff bass to keep slice happy (i use an additional woofer box with mine)
Like TLs (TLs & TQWTs are a subset of the same family of speakers) there are both Classic designs and designs built using Martin King's or George Augspurger's TL modeling software.
You can build a 2 or 3-way voigt pipe (aka TQWT/TQWP) it doesn't need to be a FR.
This is true until you design in some baffle-step compensation (generally held to give more than it takes away). You loose 3-6 dB depending on your room. A bipolar design like the one's i have has no bafflestep.
You probably mean small amps not inefficient ones (althou the single-ended amps often used are inefficient).
I have more to say on this subject (and some more realistic examples to post for slice) but today i gotta go work on more reno's to the lab -- i gotta get it settled down so i can get some stuff built)
dave
I like all your ideas...
My wood working skills are great...not to brag or any thing...
And my dad also has great skills as far as wood working goes...
I own all my own power tools...i.e.: they are my dads...
I can build pretty any enclosure you can through at me given the proper amount of time...
I believe that working with you guys here would be beneficial in the long run by getting me learned with the concepts of crossovers... note: my mom is queen of the soldering iron...
You guys suggested keep it simple so I have been looking around and found some cheap vifa P17WJ-00-08 woofers.... only $36 each...
And I also found a peerless 812978 tweeter...only $20 each...
What you think of these drivers...
I was thinking maybe design a 2-way speaker featuring 2 vifa P17WJ-00-08 woofers and 1 peerless 812978 tweeter...
Like some of you have suggested in a tower speaker configuration
We could talk about what type of enclosure would be best fitted for this and possible you guys could help me design the crossover...
What ya think?
Too much?
Well this is not set in stone so please tell me what you think...
This being a first time project in having to work with crossovers and such...
Thanks,
Slice
My wood working skills are great...not to brag or any thing...
And my dad also has great skills as far as wood working goes...
I own all my own power tools...i.e.: they are my dads...
I can build pretty any enclosure you can through at me given the proper amount of time...
I believe that working with you guys here would be beneficial in the long run by getting me learned with the concepts of crossovers... note: my mom is queen of the soldering iron...
You guys suggested keep it simple so I have been looking around and found some cheap vifa P17WJ-00-08 woofers.... only $36 each...
And I also found a peerless 812978 tweeter...only $20 each...
What you think of these drivers...
I was thinking maybe design a 2-way speaker featuring 2 vifa P17WJ-00-08 woofers and 1 peerless 812978 tweeter...
Like some of you have suggested in a tower speaker configuration
We could talk about what type of enclosure would be best fitted for this and possible you guys could help me design the crossover...
What ya think?
Too much?
Well this is not set in stone so please tell me what you think...
This being a first time project in having to work with crossovers and such...
Thanks,
Slice
Slice,
All's well that ends well...even if it's just beginning...glad to have you back around.
Good luck with your project.
Grey
(the moderator guy...but only when he can't avoid it)
All's well that ends well...even if it's just beginning...glad to have you back around.
Good luck with your project.
Grey
(the moderator guy...but only when he can't avoid it)
Hey Slice,
Here is a company that has lots of kits. The kits include the drivers and crossover designs and cabinet plans.
So you could order one of their kits and make cabinets with your woodworking skills. Then asemble the crossovers with parts from them or others such as Parts Express.
A lot of people use their designs because it is very hard to design a crossover yourself even if you know a lot. Some of the people giving you advice couldn't do it and would be happy to admit as much.
Now I'm sure people here would quibble with one design or another of theirs, (actually I would) but If you get a speaker from then it will at least be listenable and no doubt a whole lot better than that.
Go here
http://www.zalytron.com/
Then select "Kits"
They have some very reasonable Home theater models
Also they have a really cool catalog that you can study till you wear it out! That's what I did!
Parts Express also has a section of their website with speaker designs. Find that and consider one of those designs.
Someone suggested the GR Research , Did you check that out?
My thought is that you could cruise the web looking for designs such as these or others and ask peoples opinions on them.
There are tons of designs out t here- i's fun to search them out.
The drivers you found are in the right ballpark, but now you are stuck without the crossover design. Pretty much everyone starting out makes kits designed by others. You can get great quality for a lot cheaper than factory models, so you are on the right track.
😉 😉 😉 😉
Mark
Here is a company that has lots of kits. The kits include the drivers and crossover designs and cabinet plans.
So you could order one of their kits and make cabinets with your woodworking skills. Then asemble the crossovers with parts from them or others such as Parts Express.
A lot of people use their designs because it is very hard to design a crossover yourself even if you know a lot. Some of the people giving you advice couldn't do it and would be happy to admit as much.
Now I'm sure people here would quibble with one design or another of theirs, (actually I would) but If you get a speaker from then it will at least be listenable and no doubt a whole lot better than that.
Go here
http://www.zalytron.com/
Then select "Kits"
They have some very reasonable Home theater models
Also they have a really cool catalog that you can study till you wear it out! That's what I did!
Parts Express also has a section of their website with speaker designs. Find that and consider one of those designs.
Someone suggested the GR Research , Did you check that out?
My thought is that you could cruise the web looking for designs such as these or others and ask peoples opinions on them.
There are tons of designs out t here- i's fun to search them out.
The drivers you found are in the right ballpark, but now you are stuck without the crossover design. Pretty much everyone starting out makes kits designed by others. You can get great quality for a lot cheaper than factory models, so you are on the right track.
😉 😉 😉 😉
Mark
is there anywhere i can buy a crossover kit?
i will check those places out....
i was wondering if their is anywhere i can buy a crossover kit?
just the crossover...
i figure that i can handle the rest...IE. enclosure design and driver selection...
if i cant buy a ready to put together kit maybe some of you guys could help me design a crossover based on prover design...
what you think?
well thank for the links i will be sure to check them out now....
thanks,
Slice
i will check those places out....
i was wondering if their is anywhere i can buy a crossover kit?
just the crossover...
i figure that i can handle the rest...IE. enclosure design and driver selection...
if i cant buy a ready to put together kit maybe some of you guys could help me design a crossover based on prover design...
what you think?
well thank for the links i will be sure to check them out now....
thanks,
Slice
would this be a good book for me....
i know some of you have suggested "Loudspeaker Design Cookbook -- by Vance Dickason" as a good sorce for information...
doese this book feature indepth info on crossovers?
thanks,
Slice
i know some of you have suggested "Loudspeaker Design Cookbook -- by Vance Dickason" as a good sorce for information...
doese this book feature indepth info on crossovers?
thanks,
Slice
For the crossover, they usually give you a circuit diagram which is usually pretty simple, and you order the parts (resistors, inductors, capacitors, wire, terminals, from wherever you want.
To design a crossover correctly is a LOT of work. Once the theoretical calcs are done, then you have to build it and then tweak the values of various parts to make it sound as you like.
To help with this there is software that will simulate outcomes of various crossover designs and show you frequency and impedance curves, etc. but you have to buy the better ones.
There is also software that uses a calibrated microphone to measure speaker output and show you what is hapening, but it is expensive and complicated.
Here is another spot that has lots of speaker drivers and crossover components:
http://www.madisound.com/
They also have kits and suggested designs.
For $25 they will use their computer to design a crossover from any components that they stock. Of course it won't be perfect without the tweaking, but better than anything you (or I ) could do.
To design a crossover correctly is a LOT of work. Once the theoretical calcs are done, then you have to build it and then tweak the values of various parts to make it sound as you like.
To help with this there is software that will simulate outcomes of various crossover designs and show you frequency and impedance curves, etc. but you have to buy the better ones.
There is also software that uses a calibrated microphone to measure speaker output and show you what is hapening, but it is expensive and complicated.
Here is another spot that has lots of speaker drivers and crossover components:
http://www.madisound.com/
They also have kits and suggested designs.
For $25 they will use their computer to design a crossover from any components that they stock. Of course it won't be perfect without the tweaking, but better than anything you (or I ) could do.
Just use a kit
Slicemaster, if you select the drivers yourself you will also have to design the crossover yourself. Bad idea. Just buy a kit with this work done for you. Adire Audio, GR Research, Zalytron and speakerbuilder.net (PE driver-based projects) are the best places to start. You don't (and shouldn't) even design the cabinet yourself - just build it according to plans. You may be surprised at how much you learn and how good the result is, when you follow someone else's lead for your first project. I did.
Slicemaster, if you select the drivers yourself you will also have to design the crossover yourself. Bad idea. Just buy a kit with this work done for you. Adire Audio, GR Research, Zalytron and speakerbuilder.net (PE driver-based projects) are the best places to start. You don't (and shouldn't) even design the cabinet yourself - just build it according to plans. You may be surprised at how much you learn and how good the result is, when you follow someone else's lead for your first project. I did.
I have looked at those places and could not find a kit that I liked...
I already know how to design enclosures...
The last thing I need to master is crossovers...
I feel that it would be more beneficial to me to find or get help designing a crossover...
I have the concepts of enclosure design down and I would like to step it up to the next level. I have designed several subwoofers with great success. The only catch is that I did not have to design the crossovers because I had an active crossover built in to my sub amp. I under stand your concern and have not thrown out the idea of a kit yet I just would like to keep my options open…
I also would like to hear what planet10 has to say about this…
Well I thank you for your advice and I will definitely take it into consideration…
A kit is a good idea but finding one that fits my needs and is cheap is another thing…
Thanks,
Slice
😀
I already know how to design enclosures...
The last thing I need to master is crossovers...
I feel that it would be more beneficial to me to find or get help designing a crossover...
I have the concepts of enclosure design down and I would like to step it up to the next level. I have designed several subwoofers with great success. The only catch is that I did not have to design the crossovers because I had an active crossover built in to my sub amp. I under stand your concern and have not thrown out the idea of a kit yet I just would like to keep my options open…
I also would like to hear what planet10 has to say about this…
Well I thank you for your advice and I will definitely take it into consideration…
A kit is a good idea but finding one that fits my needs and is cheap is another thing…
Thanks,
Slice
😀
You should not buy a pre-made crossover, a good crossover needs to be specifically taylored to the speakers that you are using. We will help you make a xover with drivers you select, or you can buy a kit. Loudspeaker design cookbook goes extremely in depth into passive crossover design.
-andy
-andy
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