Can your house support infinite baffle?
IF not these look real nice in a slightly undersized bass reflex for 1-2db peak before rolloff Dayton Audio RSS460HO-4 18" Reference HO Subwoofer 4 ohm | 295-472
IF not these look real nice in a slightly undersized bass reflex for 1-2db peak before rolloff Dayton Audio RSS460HO-4 18" Reference HO Subwoofer 4 ohm | 295-472
Hey scholl! Why do infinite baffles only have to be 8ft wide while low note on an organ is some 40 ft long? I'm not into 4 ohm stuff, but thanks for thinking of me!
Reminds me of a joke:
Roses on a piano look nice. Tulips on an organ is a whole different story!
Thanks, Al.
Reminds me of a joke:
Roses on a piano look nice. Tulips on an organ is a whole different story!
Thanks, Al.
Those old JBL's were some rockers. Today I see they have some "Selenium" crap for the yogurt swillers. Times come and go. Along with opinions. I have many which I try to keep hidden. Sooner or later someone comes along with a pry bar and opens up the vault.
Somehow I knew once again I would be shot down riding my 18.
So far this thread has offered me many good reasons to blow off my desires.
A little support here would be nice. Am I that anal?
Thanks, Al.
Somehow I knew once again I would be shot down riding my 18.
So far this thread has offered me many good reasons to blow off my desires.
A little support here would be nice. Am I that anal?
Thanks, Al.
Al, we really don't know you well enough to comment on your proclivities 😱.
But to support your speaker quest, you need to hone in on a few basics, you started out wanting a ported 18", then you have gone off the rails.
1)Are you thinking of bridging the PL700? An 8 ohm load in that case presents the amp with the same load as two four ohm loads. The amp can handle 4 ohms per side (or bridge mono 8) if fan cooled.
2)Do you want one or two 8 ohm 18?
3)What price range?
4)What size is acceptable? Decent quality plywood is not cheap anymore, though you can often find empty cabinets for less than the cost of wood.
5)What sound level you want to achieve at various frequencies at what listening distance?
Infinafe baffle the back wave has to be completely cut off from the front. The back of the woofer is in one room while the front in another. The dayton 18s look more like a 6 ohm woofer than 4. They do well in 4 cubic foot closed boxes too.
Sorry about the psycho-babble, guys! Sometimes the meds make me kind of loopy when I'm tired.
Thanks scholl, I may go that route (sealed box) if the other options are too large.
Hi Art,
Actually, the first three lines of my original post: "I want to build an 18" mono sub and need advice. Not even sure what cabinet alignment to start with. I am leaning toward at least a bass reflex or maybe a scoop". I failed to mention I need to keep it small as possible so I can move it around. That's why those short horns caught my eye. I think a full scoop as well as a keystone would be too large.
1) Mind reader! That's exactly what I was planing. Bridging my Phase Linear 700 with an 8ohm 18" speaker. Are you saying the out-put would be the same as stereo 4 ohm (as in a dvc 4 ohm speaker)?
2) Yes, mono 8 ohm 18" single driver.
3) Hopefully around $200 or a little more. You know, that mule thing.
4) Smaller the better.
5) I would like to blend in with my Theile 12's @ 10~20 feet.
Thanks, Al.
Thanks scholl, I may go that route (sealed box) if the other options are too large.
Hi Art,
Actually, the first three lines of my original post: "I want to build an 18" mono sub and need advice. Not even sure what cabinet alignment to start with. I am leaning toward at least a bass reflex or maybe a scoop". I failed to mention I need to keep it small as possible so I can move it around. That's why those short horns caught my eye. I think a full scoop as well as a keystone would be too large.
1) Mind reader! That's exactly what I was planing. Bridging my Phase Linear 700 with an 8ohm 18" speaker. Are you saying the out-put would be the same as stereo 4 ohm (as in a dvc 4 ohm speaker)?
2) Yes, mono 8 ohm 18" single driver.
3) Hopefully around $200 or a little more. You know, that mule thing.
4) Smaller the better.
5) I would like to blend in with my Theile 12's @ 10~20 feet.
Thanks, Al.
1) Yes, bridged mono at 8 ohms the output is the same as two channels each with a four ohm load. In either case, fan the amp to keep it cool if you are going to try to get full tilt output. The Blue Light 700s could do an honest 700 watts per side at 4 ohms, the series II might peak around that, which would be 1400 watts bridged mono at 8 ohms. Don't hang less than 8 ohms on it bridged, even with fans.
2) If you insist, though two 12" may have more output and less power compression.
3) Probably a little more if you want good quality.
4) Smaller speakers in general perform better in smaller enclosures than larger speakers.
5) Your pair of TL 12 boxes can probably do around 123 dB max around 100 Hz at around 200 watts per. Given around 700 watts, a box like the WS Lab 2x12" or a DefiniMax 4018LF can do about 124 dB. At four meters (about 13 feet) the level would be around 112 dB.
The 4018LF at about $260 is a better deal than a pair of Lab 12" at $350, but the Lab 12" would go a bit lower in a slightly smaller box.
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Hi, Art.
1) I have two 4" boxers rigged up on it in the rack. The power you project is wonderfull headroom for me. I may try it once. LOL
2) I do. I've messed around with 12's and 15's but never an 18. The doctors don't give me that long, so there I am.
3) I've been talking to Nick over at Stereo Integrity about that HT 18. What can I say? Looks good to me and my mule.
4) That being said, I don't fit in too well, either. LOL
5) I'm driving them with 200 watts per Phase linear DRS 400. I know, I know. Your Lab 2x12's would be perfect for me (in a perfect world). I have no idea what a DefiniMax 4018LF is.
Know what? I totaly forgot about the TL 505 cabinet. What if I stuck that SI in there? (4 ohm x 4ohm). Well, most of it would be 80's!
Thanks, Al.
1) I have two 4" boxers rigged up on it in the rack. The power you project is wonderfull headroom for me. I may try it once. LOL
2) I do. I've messed around with 12's and 15's but never an 18. The doctors don't give me that long, so there I am.
3) I've been talking to Nick over at Stereo Integrity about that HT 18. What can I say? Looks good to me and my mule.
4) That being said, I don't fit in too well, either. LOL
5) I'm driving them with 200 watts per Phase linear DRS 400. I know, I know. Your Lab 2x12's would be perfect for me (in a perfect world). I have no idea what a DefiniMax 4018LF is.
Know what? I totaly forgot about the TL 505 cabinet. What if I stuck that SI in there? (4 ohm x 4ohm). Well, most of it would be 80's!
Thanks, Al.
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I just looked at your thumb nail. That is the exact slope I would like! Please tell me it is in a TL 505!
Thanks, Al.
Thanks, Al.
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May I suggest a subwoofer design that I built last winter. It turned out to be better than I could have imagined. It's used in our church, which plays contemporary music, very rocky music with lots of kick drum and bass guitar.
It's an onken style enclosure which is quite big even for two 15's. The plans are from B&C themselves, I did not design it.
I've had countless positive feedback from various musicians saying it's the best sub they've ever heard.
Joseph Crowe's DIY Speaker Building Blog: B&C Sub 215 (Dual 15") project
Cheers
It's an onken style enclosure which is quite big even for two 15's. The plans are from B&C themselves, I did not design it.
I've had countless positive feedback from various musicians saying it's the best sub they've ever heard.
Joseph Crowe's DIY Speaker Building Blog: B&C Sub 215 (Dual 15") project
Cheers
Hi Joseph!
Great cab with excellent responce. I actualy have the B&C plans down loaded into my box folder.
But it's not an 18! LOL
Thanks, Al.
Great cab with excellent responce. I actualy have the B&C plans down loaded into my box folder.
But it's not an 18! LOL
Thanks, Al.
There was a plan for the 18 it was called SUB218, but it's no longer on the B&C website. Maybe an email to them might generate a response.
The onken style enclosure seems to work really well. We ran the crown amp into thermal overload while giving it on a bass guitar with a low E note (41 hz). That was fun. 2,400 watts too!
Hey, Joseph.
That B&C stuff is great if you want to drive an exotic to the food mart.
You may have noticed (or not) I'm not much into all the newest technology. I drive an old 4wd Blazer. I really would like to build an 18" mono subwoofer to match my EV TL 12's. I am not very interested in being talked out of my desires. I would rather have support in the fact that I know what I want, not sure how to get there. Know what I mean? I've seen some very interesting cabs along the way from you righteous responders. The short horns, tapped horns, bass reflex, horn loaded bass reflex, sealed box, scoops, band pass, transmission line, 2x this and that, variants, and so on and so forth.
I'm rambling again.
Sorry to hang this on you. Just came out, sorry, man.
Al.
That B&C stuff is great if you want to drive an exotic to the food mart.
You may have noticed (or not) I'm not much into all the newest technology. I drive an old 4wd Blazer. I really would like to build an 18" mono subwoofer to match my EV TL 12's. I am not very interested in being talked out of my desires. I would rather have support in the fact that I know what I want, not sure how to get there. Know what I mean? I've seen some very interesting cabs along the way from you righteous responders. The short horns, tapped horns, bass reflex, horn loaded bass reflex, sealed box, scoops, band pass, transmission line, 2x this and that, variants, and so on and so forth.
I'm rambling again.
Sorry to hang this on you. Just came out, sorry, man.
Al.
OK, the TL12 is rated 93 dB/65 Hz, rising to 97 dB/100 Hz and the Definimax 4018LF calculates 95 dB/1 kHz, so should dovetail in somewhere around an 80 Hz XO point.
With a 32 Hz Fs though, going infrasonic in a simple ported cab will heavily roll off lower down if there’s not enough room gain plus dual drivers will ideally be required. Size wise, figure at least a Vb = Vas per driver and Fb = Fs or tuned lower if there’s some room gain.
GM
Are you aware of the step down option for the TL12? It would provide output down to 43 hz instead of the standard 60hz.
The lowest setting on my old Pioneer SF-850 active is 125Hz. Wish I could go deeper, say 80Hz. The TL 12's go lower, I know. I hate to cross over right in the middle of my beloved metal bass. I am fixed at 125Hz x-over due to my 1980's theme.
The 18" EV Thiele 505 box looks good size wise at 2'Wx2.5"H. I can put wheels on it so I can move it about with my disability.
Loaded with an EVM 18B, looks like the response and SPL would blend in well with my TL 12's.
I would like to know if I loaded this box with a SI HT 18? Would I destroy it or better it?
Thanks, Al.
PS, Yes I have made step down plates and understand their purpose.
The 18" EV Thiele 505 box looks good size wise at 2'Wx2.5"H. I can put wheels on it so I can move it about with my disability.
Loaded with an EVM 18B, looks like the response and SPL would blend in well with my TL 12's.
I would like to know if I loaded this box with a SI HT 18? Would I destroy it or better it?
Thanks, Al.
PS, Yes I have made step down plates and understand their purpose.
I dunno... I've blown EVM18B's with 400 watt amps playing stuff that's pretty tame by today's standards. They seem to be one of the easiest drivers in the world to physically bottom out.
I'm not sure how much Metallica I'd throw at them.
Al,
The EV18B has only 3.3mm Xmax (linear excursion), the Eminence 4018LF has 7.9mm.
Doubling excursion gives 6 dB more output. There is no replacement for displacement, you would need more than two EV18B in two TL 505 boxes to equal one 4018LF in one box.
The EV18B will run out of Xmax at around 200 watts and start flapping uselessly if given more power (and may burn up or destroy the voice coil hammering on the back plate), while the 4018LF would provide clean output up to 800 watts, and at least 7 dB more output.
At 40 Hz, a 7 dB SPL increase or decrease happens to sound twice or half as loud.
Art
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