hello pano.
make good sense, thank you.
i love the speakers very much. i want to improve mine. better coil 20mh? where? right now iron core from partsexpress.
peerless surround material to foam switch rubber? always foam better sound, from experience. maybe parameters change, but still sound good, maybe better?
make good sense, thank you.
i love the speakers very much. i want to improve mine. better coil 20mh? where? right now iron core from partsexpress.
peerless surround material to foam switch rubber? always foam better sound, from experience. maybe parameters change, but still sound good, maybe better?
Updates
The Ultra baffles have been glued and screwed down securely and properly finishing the baffles made the Ultras sound *far* more refined. A fairly amazing change considering it's just a lot of wood glue and a small ton of screws. There was enough change in the sound that I've changed the system to use a more open sounding preamplifier.
The extra woofer cap and inductor are pretty interesting sonically, too. Adding the additional parts does smooth out and refine the midrange which sounds amazing.
The fronts of the baffles also went from having a gloss polyurethane (that just didn't dry right) to a non-gloss. It doesn't change the sound any but it sure looks a whole lot better.
The Ultra baffles have been glued and screwed down securely and properly finishing the baffles made the Ultras sound *far* more refined. A fairly amazing change considering it's just a lot of wood glue and a small ton of screws. There was enough change in the sound that I've changed the system to use a more open sounding preamplifier.
The extra woofer cap and inductor are pretty interesting sonically, too. Adding the additional parts does smooth out and refine the midrange which sounds amazing.
The fronts of the baffles also went from having a gloss polyurethane (that just didn't dry right) to a non-gloss. It doesn't change the sound any but it sure looks a whole lot better.
I hate to ask (but will anyway) - has anyone thought about modifying the Manzanita by adding a top and sides behind the woofer section of the OB (basically so that the woofer mimics a U-frame)? I am just curious (and rather ignorant if this would really foul up the crossover and sound).
Again, just asking out of curiosity.
Again, just asking out of curiosity.
What I would suggest is you build the base Manzanita except for the wings and experiment with heavy cardboard wings held in place with Velcro. You will learn a lot about the ratio of wing depth VS sonic compromises. Size, depth and shape will yield significant differences in tonal balance, clarity and presentation. Over all efficiency will increase slightly with deep wing depth.... but at a cost... let us know what your variations tell you....
John
John
Bass
donovas,
Don't know if this will help you but it did in my system.
I did add weatherstripping between the frame of the woofer and the wood baffle. That changed the sound for the better.
But there was still too much bass and I thought it was a speaker/room issue but it wasn't.
Changing the type of feet on the preamp (tube) and amp cleaned things up. The preamp was on a few vibrapods originally. It is now on vibrapods with triangular cones between the preamp and the vibrapod. The bass is now excellent.
This fix is basically a homemade version of the vibrapod cone. I have no idea if it's better or worse than the commercial version ... but it tamed the bass in the system.
I've played with vibration control before but it's never had this much of an effect. I'm guessing it has to do with the electronics being just about directly behind one of the speakers.
Barry
donovas,
Don't know if this will help you but it did in my system.
I did add weatherstripping between the frame of the woofer and the wood baffle. That changed the sound for the better.
But there was still too much bass and I thought it was a speaker/room issue but it wasn't.
Changing the type of feet on the preamp (tube) and amp cleaned things up. The preamp was on a few vibrapods originally. It is now on vibrapods with triangular cones between the preamp and the vibrapod. The bass is now excellent.
This fix is basically a homemade version of the vibrapod cone. I have no idea if it's better or worse than the commercial version ... but it tamed the bass in the system.
I've played with vibration control before but it's never had this much of an effect. I'm guessing it has to do with the electronics being just about directly behind one of the speakers.
Barry
hi, barrry
thank you. good information. maybe tube preamp- vibration- microphonics?
i too notice weather stripping sound better in the past. but no add for peerless. it already have. no add for vifa, but maybe i will. vifa mount foam front. maybe meant to mount from rear of baffle? (maybe for car)
lots of maybe.
it rain here yesterday. speakers damp, sound go bad. fewer bass, but now bass back. no rain today, haha.
thank you. good information. maybe tube preamp- vibration- microphonics?
i too notice weather stripping sound better in the past. but no add for peerless. it already have. no add for vifa, but maybe i will. vifa mount foam front. maybe meant to mount from rear of baffle? (maybe for car)
lots of maybe.
it rain here yesterday. speakers damp, sound go bad. fewer bass, but now bass back. no rain today, haha.
John,
Thank you. At the risk of being overly simplistic, assuming no changes to the baffle, is there a way you might be able to generally describe what one might expect if the wing depth were increased? Some some general idea would be helpful for the under-informed (yours truly).
Regards.
The Vifa does have a rising top end. Do you have a small inductor in series with it? That will help flatten the response.
I use mine in the UltraPlus (2 15" woofers) and it's not bright at all. Rather smooth, actually.
BeauB....
I have observed that as you increase the wing depth, the wing reflections & loading create add congestion to the lower midrange... clarity is sacrificed... so you get to choose. As you add wing the loading changes.. in a non-linear fashion... more in the upper mid-bass, lower mid-range... There is a nice balance.... but you need to get the heavy card board out and play a bit and let us know where YOU think the best trade off is reached.
I have observed that as you increase the wing depth, the wing reflections & loading create add congestion to the lower midrange... clarity is sacrificed... so you get to choose. As you add wing the loading changes.. in a non-linear fashion... more in the upper mid-bass, lower mid-range... There is a nice balance.... but you need to get the heavy card board out and play a bit and let us know where YOU think the best trade off is reached.
Thank you John.
I think I will build it with the recommended wings (they will be screwed into the baffle edge), and then spring clamp some hardboard extensions at various depths. If, by chance, something other than the recommended depth works out, it will be easy enough to change the wings.
I think I will build it with the recommended wings (they will be screwed into the baffle edge), and then spring clamp some hardboard extensions at various depths. If, by chance, something other than the recommended depth works out, it will be easy enough to change the wings.
Manza 'birth'
I have my Manzas up and running. They are great sounding. I have found them to have a sweet spot with regards to type of music, quality of recording, and play volume. They didn't like my tube pre-amp as much as my solid state chain.
I'm going to play them for a while and let them "stretch their legs" so to speak. At the moment, I would like to rein in the beasts a bit. It's mostly bass that I'd like to dial back a bit. It is true that I don't have them in the optimal position for listening. They did rattle the house, not kidding!! Any advice on how to tame them... just a wee bit?
The Baltic birch baffle and wings are, as of yet, unfinished. I'm still trying to decide if I should simply coat that or put a veneer on top. I will post more pics of the back as I think I have a clean implementation of John's design (Thanks John!)
Again, many thanks to John B and all the helpful folks on this forum and thread. More pics to come.
Ryan
I have my Manzas up and running. They are great sounding. I have found them to have a sweet spot with regards to type of music, quality of recording, and play volume. They didn't like my tube pre-amp as much as my solid state chain.
I'm going to play them for a while and let them "stretch their legs" so to speak. At the moment, I would like to rein in the beasts a bit. It's mostly bass that I'd like to dial back a bit. It is true that I don't have them in the optimal position for listening. They did rattle the house, not kidding!! Any advice on how to tame them... just a wee bit?
The Baltic birch baffle and wings are, as of yet, unfinished. I'm still trying to decide if I should simply coat that or put a veneer on top. I will post more pics of the back as I think I have a clean implementation of John's design (Thanks John!)
Again, many thanks to John B and all the helpful folks on this forum and thread. More pics to come.
Ryan
Attachments
I think it was more my perception of the 'controlled' nature of the cone movement. I was no where near full volume and it seemed that the driver motion was extreme and the bass started to get a little ill-defined. It is true that I haven't spaced them in the listening room per the suggestions, so that is certainly part of it.
I will try the previous suggestion. It's not so much a reduction in bass as a bit of tightening of it.
Thanks,
Ryan
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There are other things to try, as well. An amp with a higher damping factor has worked for me with this speaker and others. There isn't too far you can go, tho, considering the DCR of the big inductor.
A lot of content under the woofer Fs can also send it wobbling, so check that. But room placement is likely to make the biggest difference.
A lot of content under the woofer Fs can also send it wobbling, so check that. But room placement is likely to make the biggest difference.