Some of that and more of finding a newer plan. My original plans for the 6m hulls are feeling a bit archaic after almost two years on hold. It's a solid plan using a well established 'old school' system of the petrol outboard and electric foot controlled bow mount. It's also fairly economical plan with just 30hp and efficient hulls
The beach cat is a newer acquisition. I helped a friend chase a solar fault that he just couldn't find and received the WindKart beach cat as a gift including all the rigging. It has me thinking that maybe there can be a better plan then spending $40-$80 as fuel expense a day. We won’t be in a position to do much build work on the 6m till Feb. I do wish to start working earlier than that though maybe the beach cat can be used for work and while sitting on the water, explore some systems to become a dry docked tractor for the 6m hulls as a more efficient newer plan
So I reimagined a more frugal booth for the beach cat instead and started thinking of the 6m hulls as long stay/extended travel 'booster rockets'
I hope this sentiment makes sense
My panels from Sydney and amp modules from Ali arrived via urgent courier on early Sat morning. These were scanned into the depot at the nearest city on the same day and prolly mismanaged for almost two weeks. They are here now so all good
It seems my foiling aspirations and the area of main use are not compatible due to safety considerations. I am at a bit of a dilemma with how to implement an efficient propulsion and regen via water. Shrouds will foul up here fairly quickly
As best as I can determine, a water wheel ticks all the boxes for safety and regen considerations as a slow cruise device. I have been researching the torque potential on various motor types and such and the best bet is a gearless electric hub motor in high voltage
A reduction would still be needed from that to the wheel to keep motor rpm highish. I am going to add a x-trainer to that wheel too via coaster hub with the brakes removed. This way, the wheel and motor won't feed back into the x-trainer. I have been wanting an on the water x-trainer for a while now. Done well, I can even regen on the spot while exercising
This is the way forward for now. Let's see how much weight the hulls can take
It seems my foiling aspirations and the area of main use are not compatible due to safety considerations. I am at a bit of a dilemma with how to implement an efficient propulsion and regen via water. Shrouds will foul up here fairly quickly
As best as I can determine, a water wheel ticks all the boxes for safety and regen considerations as a slow cruise device. I have been researching the torque potential on various motor types and such and the best bet is a gearless electric hub motor in high voltage
A reduction would still be needed from that to the wheel to keep motor rpm highish. I am going to add a x-trainer to that wheel too via coaster hub with the brakes removed. This way, the wheel and motor won't feed back into the x-trainer. I have been wanting an on the water x-trainer for a while now. Done well, I can even regen on the spot while exercising
This is the way forward for now. Let's see how much weight the hulls can take
Mid-low on the run out today, facing southeast with a face wind. Working from the right, the boat ramp, sail club, playground, Torquay Pier and in the far background is the 850m long Urangan Pier and the gateway to the Great Sandy Straits. This is the area between K'Gari Island (Formerly Fraser Island) and mainland Hervey Bay. This extends a 100ks down to Tin Can Bay at the southernmost point of K'Gari Island. My area of operation will be the lee shore of the Island all the way as well as the straits and up Hervey Bay's Main beach, running around 9ks. The sail club here in Torquay is about halfway along the beach
With a marine survey and exemption for smooth waters as defined by our local chart as up to 2k from the shore. I am allowed to moor for extended periods of time anywhere in this area except for the main shipping channel which is just along the main sandbar from Boat harbour at the south end of the beach and starts at the Fairway marker 9 nautical miles out from my house at the northern end of the beach near Gatetakers Bay ramp in Point Vernon
It's an amazing part of the world where the temperate and the tropics blends. The northern end of K'gari Island falls in true tropical white coral sands conditions. I have been coming here for fishing holidays and product R&D since 1996 and always thinking I would love to live here. In 2019, I brought my new young family here for a holiday for their first time, and we decided to actually make that a reality and move up here and try something new after the collapse of the taxi industry. We are working towards a self drive boat hire operation with the 6m cat and the Smartwave as well as things like SUP and such hire
This beachcat project will be my office on the water/beach, and I hope to promote DJ and sound system including marine PA from here. There are a number of pathways that I can follow, so it's pretty flexible and relaxed approach with next Feb as when we can seriously start the build for the larger vessel as I can have some help then
Yesterday I had to go past the reuse centre and saw I had a few minutes before it shut for the day, so grabbed the first likely looking 12v motor/fan. She spins up fast in that breeze, but the camera doesn't seem to be able to capture that. The current flow isn't sufficient along this stretch of the beach. I went in wading to chin deep past the pier in the pic. The real flow is along the shipping channel direction
This fan is 12v and 130w. The prop part looks fairly safe if fingers aren't poked in, and looks like it could form the basis of a slow cruise drive if geared down from a BLDC motor and or foot pedal with PAS. Regen only appears likely to happen if dragged with a sail. I should be able to safely fit at least two such units on the roof, too. That Pier is pretty high above water, but I was able to get the fan to spin up from the ramp too
I'll service the motor on it and mount it on a pole with the shroud removed. There is a ring around the rim of the blades that connects them together and looks like a wheel with spokes with prop only. So fan blade tips can't cut
What would be a good, easy way to check its output as a windmill? I am curious about using it to feed the DC-DC converter to see if I can get 14.6v DC charge voltage happening. Is this the right way to use this?
No load, easy spin.
Short circuit the output, measure the voltage.
Assuming it works as a generator, probably need around 70 kph wind speed to reach that voltage when loaded.
No, it was designed as a fan, not a wind generator 😉
Do they have a smiley with that expression on the bull that was being milked? The shorting part I can sort of figure out, twist + and - wire ends together. Do the probes go each side of the twist?
This is the part that I am trying to get my head around, but at a wider scope. I don't know if I am mentally arranging this following scenario properly;
The battery buss is a "floating" voltage, I see this as a cloud of potential hanging over the battery and is at battery voltage being 12.8v for the LiFePO4. The charging voltage for this battery is 14.6v and when a charger is connected, the floating voltage is 14.6v on this buss/cloud
Am I seeing this correctly so far?
If the battery is full, the cloud is still 14.6v as the charger is still connected to the buss, but there is no real charge current flowing from the charger to the battery. The available power in the cloud is the sum of the power in the battery and the charger's output rating
(Just for the sake of some numbers and hope they are reasonable)
Let's say the sound system and support are drawing 10w music. If the battery is full and the charger can maintain excess of 10w. I have a feeling that this can then work for my use as would the load not then draw from the potential available in the cloud rather than only drawing from the battery?
So if I am understanding this correctly, then why am I setting incorrect targets? I was hoping that between 4 solar panels, a pair of 50cm or so wind generators and pedalled or dragged wheel regen, I could maintain that 10w excess potential 24/7 and most importantly;
Maintain that 10w bounty at night on wind alone by asking a solid 5w per fan. The item in the video is an indication of the safest form of bladed gen/thrust for the beachcat application. I really believe in BLDC in the wide out runner axial type such as the hub motors and Samsung washing machine types (I have one in storage and would make massive power if I could get enough blades on it). Maybe I am mistaken, but I feel that a basic turbofan like this would develop a high voltage even at low RPM . These gearless type hub motors are around $80 more than the geared ones. If such a fan can generate a 5w load in that breeze, then I win
Would really welcome some suggestion on a way forward with this wind harvest. The best I can think off is to see if this thing spins with a 5w 12v globe attached and also replace that motor with an RC model aircraft smallish one. The motor drag may not be a prob on a smaller motor of around 10w rating. Workable or should I try something different for wind?
Indeed, tell me you have never repurposed or tried to think of a way to repurpose something 😉
Look at life like this taxi driver, if it looks like a road, chances are it can be driven on and very well. Things like one-ways, no turns and stuff are just regular use 'concepts' for those to whom regular use suffices
Can such smallish turbofan type blades be used for gen? Can they be detached from the stock motor and coupled to a smaller BLDC via a belt driven shaft to keep motor speed high? Can multiple units be summed to deliver the target power?
This, if it can be made to work, would become a viable option as most of the safety concerns of a larger windmill on a very small vessel would be neutralised. You guys are a lot more knowledgeable, and it is my interest to not wander down useless rabbit holes. Just like the ZR6.4Ds, I don't mind dropping the idea for something that makes more sense
Having the power system for the audio and bass as a self-sustaining thing for that 96dB onboard SPL is a requirement for what I intend with this craft. Solar has been deemed unfit earlier. I waded in and determined that there isn't sufficient flow for at anchor regen via tidal current
I have a feeling that you are thinking along peak recharge numbers. Do you feel the same about generating the actual target power?
2212 BLDC out runner 1400KV
I have this kit but with a 40A ESC. If I am correctly reading this, the BLDC motor can suits a 10v system and rated for max efficiency around 4-10A. i am guessing that it can regen at that spec too if the required amount of wind force on the blade and motor RPM was met. This does not mean that I actually know how to harvest from the three phase wires
If the motor does that 4A regen at 10v, thats 40w in the cloud. The turbofan is much larger than the aircraft prop in the kit and by my thinkijng should harvest a lot more of the wind. But does it look likely that the turbofan has the dia to overcome the motor drag at 4A of regen in that breeze? If the ideal RPM is met, can that be a good 100w? I only need that 10w plus whatever to keep the monitor screens and such going
Let's look at this transmission type. These things are fairly cheap and available in a wide range of shafts and cogs
Timing belt drive
Can a combination be met that can harvest max potential from the 2212 outrunner to feed a DC-DC converter to create the 14.6v charge/buss voltage?
Here is a further thought? Can a horizontal fan work? This would be viable with CNC for structurals and print for the blades. If that 100w is feasible from the 2212 motor then I am very able to deploy 10 such units from the roof in a long array and two solar panels on each side of this thus forming the canopy
Getting the charge system sorted before designing the craft structurals would be best. I make use of permaculture in the garden and enjoy working in a similar spirit with other endeavours. This is a big project and needs some elegant answers to the design challenges. I know what questions to ask, but very out of my depth figuring out the answers
Thrust
I do feel there is a good chance this fan blade can work as the impeller in the ducted system that I mentioned as a circular wing. As you pointed out, it's designed as a fan, which means it transfers large amounts of air. Water is much denser, but our speed demands are much lower. In the water it doesn't need its design RPM but rather repurposed as a wide and slow thrust from the duct output. Think those para gliders with fans
Btw, I think a trailing vane or two from this duct would work as rudders. Been thinking about EVA sheathed foils for rudder and skegs and such
I must say that the idea of the duct as a low slung nacelle with the paired hulls is very appealing. Like the deflector dish in front of the Enterprise battle section or an underwing turbojet. I imagine the duct would be about 60cm long to be a usable circular wing for this craft, and a wing in the rear half is a must for a power conversion with a sailing only hulls
Feels like I am getting close to a system that address the safety concerns, propulsion and regen without trading off efficiency as the paddle wheel would have
A hub motor is still no. 1 on the shortlist for main drive. It can be reduced to the prop shaft via belt (not the timing belt type). A rice mill type of belt over the hub groove to a pulley mounted and sized to the fan's rim thing. A pair of guide pulleys to cinch up the sides into and up a leg that holds the nacelle
I would still want to connect an x-trainers output shaft to the hub motor via a desexed coaster hub
Sorry, my response was useless without the inclusion of a bridge rectifier.
Without a bridge rectifier the fan will draw energy from the battery to spin itself.
https://www.windynation.com/blogs/articles/open-circuit-voltage-and-short-circuit-current
This might also be useful:
https://www.automaxxwindmill.com/bl...y-measure-power-output-from-your-wind-turbine
I think your fan/generator conversion will be very low efficiency, resulting in more energy loss from shadowing the solar panels on a boat than they can generate on average. Even with a high efficiency wind generator this will be a problem.
I had a high efficiency Air Breeze Marine 2V wind generator, after one month it's electronics failed, allowing the generator to spin fast enough for 7 out of 12 magnets on the rotor to break off and jam in the gap between the stator.
Fortunately (?) it failed while I was using it on land to generate heat in my shop during winter time. Before it failed, I did determine it was useless for that purpose...
Dual MPPT (Maximum Power Point Tracking) inverters that can be used for both solar panels and wind generators are available now.
An MPPT inverter would help extract some power from the little available from a fan conversion.
I wish you the best on your project, but it sounds like you are working on a Rube Goldberg machine:
Could be fun, but the added complexity will probably increase failure modes exponentially.
Art
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Thanks, lets call her Rudey Rube
Today is very light south easterly breezeand flat with very sunny. A day for solar to shine
Today is very light south easterly breezeand flat with very sunny. A day for solar to shine
Still working towards the fun option and extract max thrust for energy spent while harvesting as much energy as possible ina cohesive, coherent and elegant way and meeting the safety and performance requirements
Came across this turbine unit that's a new style for me. On top of the anchor light post may suit. It looks very safe when compared to the wider ones. Will try to avoid a shadow on the solar panels. @weltersys, the hybrid MPPT type setup looks good Art. Can the wind turbine be parallel to the solar array via the existing solar MPPT controller? Would it not just be treated like another solar array in parallel? This turbine removes the EVRE of the shopping list and makes for a fully green harvest
5kw windmill white
Let's get serious about the propulsion now. It's going to be a paddle wheel, as I just can't see another viable option with the safety considerations and human hybrid requirements. Also decided on a max 1kw 48v drive controller as the best fit with the DC-DC converter for my new 12v 100AH LiFePO4 battery
Gearless, 48v 1000w ebike kit
I have committed to this kit. The rim should accept 3D printed TPU blades. This is the least moving parts and fabrication route. The system is ready for human hybrid power as the controller features PAS and the hub motor is already setup for input from a pedal crank
Elliptical x-trainer
This is the type of x-trainer that I favour. I should be able to DIY one using aluminium tubing and a bike crank with some marine rated bearings This frame and the wheel will be on a pivot to the craft and with heavy duty linear actuators as 'suspension' tying to the craft creating a system that allows the blade's dip rate to be altered by the push of a button. Moving forward, with the drive system type sorted, I can now draw up an aluminium bridge deck with mounting points for the x-trainer frame and such the paddle wheel will be between the pair of sub cabs that will form the base for the double wide deck chair. A bottomless splash well of sorts with a removable wheel arch over the wheel slot
Ebike based regen braking for energy harvest doesn't seem to be appropriate for water use with a 5kw windmill on board, It's unlikely that drive motor regen will be needed but can be added later
Steering to be electric rudders with wings fitted and electric trim and tilt built into the rudder mount. Rudder and wing foils sheathed in EVA. Handle bar mounted electronic controls for the steering and tilt/trim. A fold out handle on the rudders should cover breakdowns
Drivetrain and power buss items list
Short biplane sail rig
1.4kw(?!) Solar panels
5kw windmill
12v 100AH LiFePO4
Hybrid MPPT charge controller (rather use my existing solar MPPT if possible)
That's the supply side. Now for drain
1.4kw DC-DC converter x2
1kw ebike hub motor and controller
1.2kw audio
LED nav, drive, flood and disco lights
Touchscreen displays
Raymarine Axiom sounder/nav
Marine CB
Electric winch or two for dry docking with 6m hulls
I think the larger hulls will be better off with one of these 5kw windmills, battery and a dedicated marine electric BLDC outboard per hull. And the existing Watersnake as its bow mount and deployable manoeuvring thruster for marina use, which I am now favouring over mooring. Let's me hire out the 6m on it own on Airbnb this way
So that's it. A DIY human and electric hybrid beachcat reggae rickshaw with solar and wind charging. I hope this is a more cohesive and elegant drivetrain than the rubes that Art was dreading. 🙂 @weltersys
Came across this turbine unit that's a new style for me. On top of the anchor light post may suit. It looks very safe when compared to the wider ones. Will try to avoid a shadow on the solar panels. @weltersys, the hybrid MPPT type setup looks good Art. Can the wind turbine be parallel to the solar array via the existing solar MPPT controller? Would it not just be treated like another solar array in parallel? This turbine removes the EVRE of the shopping list and makes for a fully green harvest
5kw windmill white
Let's get serious about the propulsion now. It's going to be a paddle wheel, as I just can't see another viable option with the safety considerations and human hybrid requirements. Also decided on a max 1kw 48v drive controller as the best fit with the DC-DC converter for my new 12v 100AH LiFePO4 battery
Gearless, 48v 1000w ebike kit
I have committed to this kit. The rim should accept 3D printed TPU blades. This is the least moving parts and fabrication route. The system is ready for human hybrid power as the controller features PAS and the hub motor is already setup for input from a pedal crank
Elliptical x-trainer
This is the type of x-trainer that I favour. I should be able to DIY one using aluminium tubing and a bike crank with some marine rated bearings This frame and the wheel will be on a pivot to the craft and with heavy duty linear actuators as 'suspension' tying to the craft creating a system that allows the blade's dip rate to be altered by the push of a button. Moving forward, with the drive system type sorted, I can now draw up an aluminium bridge deck with mounting points for the x-trainer frame and such the paddle wheel will be between the pair of sub cabs that will form the base for the double wide deck chair. A bottomless splash well of sorts with a removable wheel arch over the wheel slot
Ebike based regen braking for energy harvest doesn't seem to be appropriate for water use with a 5kw windmill on board, It's unlikely that drive motor regen will be needed but can be added later
Steering to be electric rudders with wings fitted and electric trim and tilt built into the rudder mount. Rudder and wing foils sheathed in EVA. Handle bar mounted electronic controls for the steering and tilt/trim. A fold out handle on the rudders should cover breakdowns
Drivetrain and power buss items list
Short biplane sail rig
1.4kw(?!) Solar panels
5kw windmill
12v 100AH LiFePO4
Hybrid MPPT charge controller (rather use my existing solar MPPT if possible)
That's the supply side. Now for drain
1.4kw DC-DC converter x2
1kw ebike hub motor and controller
1.2kw audio
LED nav, drive, flood and disco lights
Touchscreen displays
Raymarine Axiom sounder/nav
Marine CB
Electric winch or two for dry docking with 6m hulls
I think the larger hulls will be better off with one of these 5kw windmills, battery and a dedicated marine electric BLDC outboard per hull. And the existing Watersnake as its bow mount and deployable manoeuvring thruster for marina use, which I am now favouring over mooring. Let's me hire out the 6m on it own on Airbnb this way
So that's it. A DIY human and electric hybrid beachcat reggae rickshaw with solar and wind charging. I hope this is a more cohesive and elegant drivetrain than the rubes that Art was dreading. 🙂 @weltersys
I ended up going with the 1500w version of the ebike kit with the LCD. One interesting experiment will be to see what speeds can be had with this drivetrain as cruise thrust on the larger hulls. Feels good and I think the project is looking healthy after all the ponderings trying to work out a plan
Yes, it can be.
Yes, it would, which may not be good for the wind turbine, which probably will need a diversion load, not required for solar panels.
Given your location, I would, first and foremost, concentrate on maximizing the solar power side of the equation. Inexpensive collection and energy storage combined with the reliability of having no moving parts is undoubtedly your best watt/$ value in both short and long term considerations.
Boatowners's Mechanical and Electrical Manual by Nigel Calder is a terrific book to own. In it, he covers all of your multi-source generation, charging and distribution questions. Thankfully, you can skip the veritable treatise on battery chemistries (imo). It's pretty dry and the least relevant portion of the electrical coverage for your needs. Since Vol-4 was published, Lifepo4 production has exploded and prices have dropped dramatically
Boatowners's Mechanical and Electrical Manual by Nigel Calder is a terrific book to own. In it, he covers all of your multi-source generation, charging and distribution questions. Thankfully, you can skip the veritable treatise on battery chemistries (imo). It's pretty dry and the least relevant portion of the electrical coverage for your needs. Since Vol-4 was published, Lifepo4 production has exploded and prices have dropped dramatically
Art, I don't get this one. Are you talking about potential from the solar array trying to spin up the windmill motor if tied together in parallel? Can this be fixed with a rectifier on the wind turbine cable? Or, are you talking about something else?
My initial investment was in the solar panels and solar MPPT charge controller. Not being aware of the pipe type horizontal axis turbine, wind was not a consideration
But earlier there was a lot of talk and correctly about the limitations of solar on water, so I shied away from it a bit. We do get a change in conditions about midday too. Norm is flat seas and light breeze in the am and quickly picking up to a light chop by mid-afternoon. Around 5 knots average in the am and 15 knots average in the PM. Summer conditions are starting now with the northerlies doing this but can be twice as hard blowing on average and making it unlaunchable conditions in the pm for most
I just realised that if the wind turbine does indeed produce well, I may be able to upgrade to a 3-5kw hub motor later
You mentioned a fun factor earlier. Let's not look at this as an energy storage system, but rather a focus on a more dynamic one of harvesting energy on demand
All you guys, please allow the following thought exercise for a mod to my water gokart thing
Equipment
SUP
3kw pipe type wind turbine
A DIY circuit to provide a steady voltage to the ESC's
4x 250w hub motors and matching ESC's
2x high power servo
RC stick controller and 6 channel receiver
A bank of car audio 1 Farad capacitors
An axle is fitted to the front of the sup. This doesn't rotate. A hub motor is fitted to either end of the axle and wearing a fat ride on mower tube encased in an array of 3D printed bands with blades in TPU filament
An axle is fitted to the rear of the sup in the same manner with the hub motors, but there is a turning mech actuated with a servo
The remaining servo is used to raise and lower the axles for blade bite
The beam at the fat wheels is 2.5m wide and creates a righting force as outriggers for the SUP
Driver is mid seated and the turbine pole is part of the lean back rest
Wind turbine is connected to a pedal crank with freewheel bearing at the ideal gears to generate around 100w with an easy cadence to add to whatever wind is present
Ok so this is my gokart plan but with smaller motors and the wind turbine replacing a petrol generator and the capacitor bank replacing the battery. This would make for a 100w system split over 4 motors, with the 4 ESCs connected to the receiver channels and their power cables to the power buss. My thoughts are that this would be about a slow waking pace, matching a hand paddled SUP at WOT on the controller's lever. This top speed will go down with lower cadence and if the wind picks up, it will start exceeding the foot only cranking which can then be either backed off or kept up adding to the wind
As a battery less system, it would keep working to some capacity as long as the feet or wind is active and in a good breeze might even excel
What's the flaw in my thinking and the chances of getting some of this happening with the equipment already acquired
If my pivoting drivetrain for the beachcat also contains a spring mechanism. I can have is so the wheel is out of the water when inactive, and stepping on the feet boards deploys it. Then a linear actuator for trimming the blade bite
Been looking at these swim paddles. I always use the Speedo branded ones for my morning swim. These can make for some decent and safe wheel blades
Swim paddles
Few ways to fit them to the rim. I am like the idea of a plywood disc replacing the spokes. This can be the thickness of the groove in the hub motor and secured through the spoke holes. Only the part entering this slot groove needs to be that thickness. The rest of the plate wheel can be as thick as the rim, which can be fitted over this plate of ply. A row of slits can be made at the edge under the rim. The hand paddles can be tucked into these sidewise, and the paddles for each hand side can fit in an alternating pattern
If this can be lowered into almost half immersion during sail, it might help as a keel for upwind and also regen while doing this
Replace the bike chain by fitting plate aluminium pulleys to replace the cogs and a long belt. If there are belt roller supports on the belt midway, the belt can bend left to right and steering be applied via the waterwheel too and solves some rust concerns as well. A wheel arch fender thing can be over the wheel for spray control and my needed wings be fitted to the wheel arch. I should be able to make safe wings using EVA kickboards. This one split in half and attached to each side of the fender should give me the surface area that I need for trimming the craft
EVA kickboard
So the last part of the pivot down frame would also pivot sideways for turning
Been looking at these swim paddles. I always use the Speedo branded ones for my morning swim. These can make for some decent and safe wheel blades
Swim paddles
Few ways to fit them to the rim. I am like the idea of a plywood disc replacing the spokes. This can be the thickness of the groove in the hub motor and secured through the spoke holes. Only the part entering this slot groove needs to be that thickness. The rest of the plate wheel can be as thick as the rim, which can be fitted over this plate of ply. A row of slits can be made at the edge under the rim. The hand paddles can be tucked into these sidewise, and the paddles for each hand side can fit in an alternating pattern
If this can be lowered into almost half immersion during sail, it might help as a keel for upwind and also regen while doing this
Replace the bike chain by fitting plate aluminium pulleys to replace the cogs and a long belt. If there are belt roller supports on the belt midway, the belt can bend left to right and steering be applied via the waterwheel too and solves some rust concerns as well. A wheel arch fender thing can be over the wheel for spray control and my needed wings be fitted to the wheel arch. I should be able to make safe wings using EVA kickboards. This one split in half and attached to each side of the fender should give me the surface area that I need for trimming the craft
EVA kickboard
So the last part of the pivot down frame would also pivot sideways for turning
A rectifier can prevent the battery or solar array voltage from wasting power spinning the windmill motor.
When the MPPT controller senses the battery has reached the cutoff voltage it disconnects the panels.
Solar panels have no problem running into an open circuit.
A wind generator may spin past it's design rating like mine did in post #47 if run without a "diversion load", "dump load" "resistor bank", so the controller must divert it's output to a load rather than simply disconnecting it.
The chop/swell conditions that reduce the effectiveness of solar collection at sea have the same effect on wind generation. Among cruising sailors that choose an alternative to running a genset everyday, solar is always the first choice, with wind-gen's a distant second. This holds true even with $$$ units designed for the environment and built with long-term reliability in mind, not requiring external dummy loads or safety additions.
Naysayer is not in my job description but I will say this: If you are able to develop a better performing, more cost effective solution to solar/battery storage, your days of money concerns are over. They'll quite literally beat a path to your door.
Good luck brother
Naysayer is not in my job description but I will say this: If you are able to develop a better performing, more cost effective solution to solar/battery storage, your days of money concerns are over. They'll quite literally beat a path to your door.
Good luck brother
Thanks for the explain. They seem to come with dump load usually in the listings. But maybe i can use a water heating element in a thermo bottle for a hot shower?
Guys
I have been researching wind power. From what I can gather. The industry for non farm type units Is openly being called a scam. There are a couple of guys breaking down the maths of surface area to output efficiency and its dissmal for the whirlybird types with 9 to 13% at best which makes it pretty pointless
The screw type is an exception and there are small print models available. Let’s do a DIY with RC motors and test for efficiency
Never been good at making or keeping money, don't know enough for a 100% solo effort and not one for keeping knowledge and learning out of open discussion and sharing of info, so will give it a decent shot in open forum. Hope all this off grid talk is of help to others doing off the grid audio with power hungry subs
It has taken me a few days to write this post up due to travel and firstly reading up and trying to understand what I can and trying to frame questions with what I need help with. I think this post is pivotal to this project as, if successful, would enable around the clock operation of the craft without weighing it down with a large battery array and depending on storage
This is for both the audio and some propulsion assist via PAS, such as an equal level electronic input power to the detected human effort. Hoping for a few hours of easy workout on the x-trainer with sufficient craft speed harvested from wind and solar for a cool looking speed on water and sweet reggae bass
The last couple of weeks and then next coming is busy with me running around in the car from sunrise to sunset and more. I did about, 1000km of driving in the last three days. My wife's is an intern pharmacist with ongoing workshops and exams and such n the nearest major city which is almost 400km away, and also the time for my daughter's state honours invitational program around 40km away in the nearest large town for her double bass playing with the north coasts top students strings ensemble now that she will be in high school next year. Good time to focus on this power gen issue as I can't get much else done at the moment
Wind gen
I want to take a different approach to the usual wind turbine. What I mean by this is that I will work towards making one to fit a specific use and I wonder how this would fit in with efficiency perception
My uneducated person so far understands that I need to choose a motor that is very low KV for it's max voltage rating. And that when reversed, the low KV motor will create peak power if pushed with sufficient power at that same low RPM. Fortunately, the ebike motor coming in is a better example of such a motor, and we can experiment with it
It's rated 48v 1500w 680 rpm so a super low 14kv and also means it would need to make 11 rounds per second for peak. This doesn't seem too high when compared to a usual wind turbine hoping for the best
Let's say the Betz we can hope for is around 750w from the hub motor as gen, and that would be the spec for this particular component but not the system spec. Now let's imagine the system as a wind aux supply and charge. And build for a rating of around a reliable minimum 100w in the stronger breeze that comes up around after midday of around 10 knots
To start with, spin the wheel up and take a reading of RPM, voltage and power at 100w and peak output. The motor would output via a 3 phase bridge rectifier and I hope this one linked would be ok
Bridges Rectifier 1200v 3 Phase
What would be the best way to take this reading? Can this link item work here? Would this type also suit as monitors on the other input and output power lines?
Watt meter
I would need a way to monitor RPM of the wheel and the crank for the experiments. I am a bit lost here as to the best simple way
A test load will also be needed. Something that can drain all power created at any RPM in the range of this motor. Again, at a bit of a loss as to what to use here to find that RPM for 100w gen
Next would be to calculate the force and blade area for that RPM when weighed by the 100w load. Maybe an MPPT wind charge controller with 12v output could be used 'charge' a 12v 100w light bulb? This way the fluctuating voltage would always be regulated to 12v (14.6v) output and the 100w load would be the binding drag on the motor to help determine the amount of blade area to give it a 100w at 10 knot wind rating
A question here, what would be this turbine's efficiency if it can provide the design power of 100w in expected 10 knots of wind? (We can use a blower for testing)
If this can be achieved then a lower rated new wheel of around 500w might be a better one to source and setup with the wheel mounted flat and run via a bike chain from the fan shaft. Fan to be vertical with foil blades in XPS on my CNC. I am good with making the foils and mountings in a combination of aluminium and glassed foam
I also have some ideas around how to address the difficulty of a foil bladed vertical starting up other than the secondary drag surfaces which will always have that unwanted drag from the back of the blade
After pondering on all sorts of electronic triggering with a pulse or two into the hub motor to get it rolling with vertical foils, I had a bit of a light bulb moment. What it, I piggyback the vertical foils on top of a separate drag type turbine using a quality one way instant anti-reverse bearing so that the drag type can pull on the foil turbine, but its back drag doesn't compromise the foils which can be free to race away. Like you can always provide leg power but a bike can coast away without getting interfered with the legs. Does this make sense?
Looking at prices online, around AUD $400 seems reasonable for a solid 100w turbine
There is an alternative idea too, that I can test using a skateboard hub motor fitted with an air fan blade (compromise/safe'ish) to see if I can hit around 20w in the 10 knots. If possible, then one up high as a regular windmill may be enough for just the audio and three per side on rooftop outriggers may give a cool effect and collectively harvest around 120w for the PAS and audio while also acting as rotating sails. They can make the craft look a bit flighty too. I will go ahead on this one too as a portable lil wind turbine would be very handy away from the boats
Again, around $100 for a solid 20w turbine doesn't seem too bad and the 120w, six unit array for around $600 that can power a slow cruise or via PAS would be awesome