I do have a raised output at lower frequencies, but not as much as you suggest. I largely follow the curve Toole published (The dashed Trained Listeners curve):
Now that I have subs, I might actually play with these numbers again to see what I like. The Trained Listeners curve was quite close to what I had evolved towards over a long period of time of adjusting. Nowadays I choose it as the curve to start with. As I've already dialed up the subs somewhat I might like more bass. I do think a lot has to do with average listening SPL.
I stay at about 85 to 87 dB on average but with bass heavy songs it's easy to have my SPL meter go higher.
If you would extend your current FR trend line to below 100Hz it would almost exactly be what I proposed
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I figured as much and probably will try that. I've already dialed in a bit extra sub and made a tweak to round off that graph I posted (small low Q boost at 30 Hz).
That comes close to the part where you feel more than you hear, I've had that but dialed it back some to 'spare' the little drivers in the array. With the 2 Scan Speak 30W woofers I've added 2/3 more volume displacement than the arrays had and with the room gain it provides enough of headroom to get it how I want it.
That comes close to the part where you feel more than you hear, I've had that but dialed it back some to 'spare' the little drivers in the array. With the 2 Scan Speak 30W woofers I've added 2/3 more volume displacement than the arrays had and with the room gain it provides enough of headroom to get it how I want it.
I figured as much and probably will try that. I've already dialed in a bit extra sub and made a tweak to round off that graph I posted (small low Q boost at 30 Hz).
That comes close to the part where you feel more than you hear, I've had that but dialed it back some to 'spare' the little drivers in the array. With the 2 Scan Speak 30W woofers I've added 2/3 more volume displacement than the arrays had and with the room gain it provides enough of headroom to get it how I want it.
Sounds good!
Another thing you could try is experimenting with xover freq.
I see a little raised distortion around 120Hz.
Would be interesting to see if this is the sub or the array...
If it is the sub you could go as low as 100 or 80 for xover.
I know I can win something there, but it is a part where I need to see how to get them to 'work together' to get the best results. It is part of why I actually let them (sub and arrays) play together rather than choosing a straight crossover.
It's a bit of both that's causing some disturbance there due to room influences. But I definitely can win some more headroom there. Even if the level looks to be a bit higher, it's still under 1%. I'll try and get it lower, while observing what that does over a wider listening area. No rush though, there's plenty more I want to revisit.
Yes it does.
It's a bit of both that's causing some disturbance there due to room influences. But I definitely can win some more headroom there. Even if the level looks to be a bit higher, it's still under 1%. I'll try and get it lower, while observing what that does over a wider listening area. No rush though, there's plenty more I want to revisit.
Yes it does
.
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Spend the afternoon to add the subwoofers to my Home Theatre setup. That one is slightly different, where I take advantage of having a discrete center channel that I can dissect and add to my left/right speakers myself.
Here, adding a shuffler makes a lot of sense (and a positive difference). So the center DSP is quite different than in my Stereo setup. I don't have an actual center channel, but with the shuffler in place you'd be hard pressed to hear it isn't there!
I've actually tried using the same setting in a Stereo setup, but due to the center not being a discrete channel (it's a Left + Right sum that always includes some left and right channel info) it just doesn't work as well as it does in Home Theatre.
Setting it all up took some time but it works like a charm. Quite impressive!
For the voices panned across the center I often use the movie "Rango". There each voice is placed exactly where it is on screen, not a classic center panned voice for all. The shuffler does a marvelous job of making it all sound more intelligible and have a good and equal tonal balance across the stage. I've used the Spears & Munsil Blu-ray to do the SPL levels within the 5.1 audio setup, checking levels etc. This gives us a pleasant "movie" sound setup that works across the couch. The bigger screen does help, as in the past it was easy to have the sound much much wider than the screen. Even though we're sitting off center with the TV, adjusting it to our liking is simple once everything is dialed in correctly.
Here, adding a shuffler makes a lot of sense (and a positive difference). So the center DSP is quite different than in my Stereo setup. I don't have an actual center channel, but with the shuffler in place you'd be hard pressed to hear it isn't there!
I've actually tried using the same setting in a Stereo setup, but due to the center not being a discrete channel (it's a Left + Right sum that always includes some left and right channel info) it just doesn't work as well as it does in Home Theatre.
Setting it all up took some time but it works like a charm. Quite impressive!
For the voices panned across the center I often use the movie "Rango". There each voice is placed exactly where it is on screen, not a classic center panned voice for all. The shuffler does a marvelous job of making it all sound more intelligible and have a good and equal tonal balance across the stage. I've used the Spears & Munsil Blu-ray to do the SPL levels within the 5.1 audio setup, checking levels etc. This gives us a pleasant "movie" sound setup that works across the couch. The bigger screen does help, as in the past it was easy to have the sound much much wider than the screen. Even though we're sitting off center with the TV, adjusting it to our liking is simple once everything is dialed in correctly.
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Quite a while ago I promised to take a picture of the new OLED screen in my room. I said: I'll wait until the subwoofers are ready. Still winter here, days have been dark so I waited for a more sunny day to shoot that picture.
Here's the new TV on wall and the added subwoofers:
Compared to the old screen:
I'd say the size difference is pretty obvious. You've got to agree here, one barely notice the difference between subs and benches .
Here's the new TV on wall and the added subwoofers:
Compared to the old screen:
I'd say the size difference is pretty obvious
. You've got to agree here, one barely notice the difference between subs and benches .Attachments
Quite a while ago I promised to take a picture of the new OLED screen in my room. I said: I'll wait until the subwoofers are ready. Still winter here, days have been dark so I waited for a more sunny day to shoot that picture.
Here's the new TV on wall and the added subwoofers:
Compared to the old screen:
I'd say the size difference is pretty obvious
Mooie upgrade!
I'd like some help... no idea if I'm going to take you up on it though...
Let me explain, when I bought the Goldmund amplifier from koldby, I made a tag for it because I liked how that looked:
A bit later (after already placing the order for the tag) I found out the exact 'Telos' model this amp was modelled after. It turned out to be a 350 watt into 8 ohm amp.
Well, that's not too bad, at least the tag isn't a form of bragging.
These tags are expensive, being 3D printed as a mold (lost wax model), then cast in bronze and plated with Rhodium. It also takes a month or so to get the end product in hand. So that tag is here to stay.
However, I'm planning to get a replacement for the Pioneer A400 I use for ambience. To stay with one look I want a tag on that one as well.
What would be the better tag for it;
Vandermill Audio
Lucid Dreams System
Ambience Amplifier
Or
Vandermill Audio
Lucid Dreams System
50 Watt Amplifier
Keeping the fonts et. exactly the same as the first tag.
Any suggestions? To explain, the "Lucid Dreams System" is my way of describing the goal and function of my whole setup, so that's not up for debate. But do I add it's function on there or just state facts. I can't make up my mind.
Let me explain, when I bought the Goldmund amplifier from koldby, I made a tag for it because I liked how that looked:
A bit later (after already placing the order for the tag) I found out the exact 'Telos' model this amp was modelled after. It turned out to be a 350 watt into 8 ohm amp
.Well, that's not too bad, at least the tag isn't a form of bragging
.These tags are expensive, being 3D printed as a mold (lost wax model), then cast in bronze and plated with Rhodium. It also takes a month or so to get the end product in hand. So that tag is here to stay.
However, I'm planning to get a replacement for the Pioneer A400 I use for ambience. To stay with one look I want a tag on that one as well.
What would be the better tag for it;
Vandermill Audio
Lucid Dreams System
Ambience Amplifier
Or
Vandermill Audio
Lucid Dreams System
50 Watt Amplifier
Keeping the fonts et. exactly the same as the first tag.
Any suggestions? To explain, the "Lucid Dreams System" is my way of describing the goal and function of my whole setup, so that's not up for debate. But do I add it's function on there or just state facts. I can't make up my mind.
Attachments
Thanks its very beautifull and to dream of.
...You've got to agree here, one barely notice the difference between subs and benches
Agree (boys will
).No one is bad so can understand its hard, let me then vote for below one now you ask and no hard feelings should it end the other way around
.
I'd like some help... no idea if I'm going to take you up on it though...
Let me explain, when I bought the Goldmund amplifier from koldby, I made a tag for it because I liked how that looked:
A bit later (after already placing the order for the tag) I found out the exact 'Telos' model this amp was modelled after. It turned out to be a 350 watt into 8 ohm amp
Well, that's not too bad, at least the tag isn't a form of bragging
These tags are expensive, being 3D printed as a mold (lost wax model), then cast in bronze and plated with Rhodium. It also takes a month or so to get the end product in hand. So that tag is here to stay.
However, I'm planning to get a replacement for the Pioneer A400 I use for ambience. To stay with one look I want a tag on that one as well.
What would be the better tag for it;
Vandermill Audio
Lucid Dreams System
Ambience Amplifier
Or
Vandermill Audio
Lucid Dreams System
50 Watt Amplifier
Keeping the fonts et. exactly the same as the first tag.
Any suggestions? To explain, the "Lucid Dreams System" is my way of describing the goal and function of my whole setup, so that's not up for debate. But do I add it's function on there or just state facts. I can't make up my mind.
I would, if you choose the fact plate, and still to be conservative, call it a 75 Watt amplifier. It delivers 82 Watts into 8 Ohms.
No one is bad so can understand its hard, let me then vote for below one now you ask and no hard feelings should it end the other way around
You guys present my dilemma very well. This is what I was arguing over with myself. I like the second the most, but only as part of this particular setup. Things may change over time, though I don't feel the need to do so very often. The Pioneer (757 MK II) I was using before was bought new by me in ~1990 or so.
I thought all this for an Eargasm?
Yes sir! I want both the sound and looks of a million dollar system
.How to achieve such a look is up for debate though. For me, this would be close enough
.I would, if you choose the fact plate, and still to be conservative, call it a 75 Watt amplifier. It delivers 82 Watts into 8 Ohms.
Good to know
, maybe I'll just call it a 75 watt amplifier then. That would fit the theme and the one already made.I'm sure you planted those benches there years ago to prepare the other inhabitants whats to come - smart
//
Exactly what I have done!
It worked too! But I guess she won't fall for something like that again!
When I was planning the arrays, I pointed to a small space on the floor and asked her; "would it be alright if I build speakers that can fit in there?" She replied: "Yes that would be perfect." My reply: "OK then, I will build some, but they will be this tall!" (holding my hand way above my head).
This was after first been denied to get some speakers placed into the room, away from the walls. Horn speakers were out of the question too.
This was after first been denied to get some speakers placed into the room, away from the walls. Horn speakers were out of the question too.
Getting a "no" on the first proposition is a good way to get a "yes" on the next less "moderate" suggestion
Good strategy
Are you sure that rhodium plated bronze sounds the best?
Joking aside, if you keep with the theme of Lucid Dreaming I would call it something along the lines of:
Vandermill Audio
Lucid Dreams System
Saunders 75
(http://nectar.northampton.ac.uk/8705/1/Saunders20168705.pdf)
Joking aside, if you keep with the theme of Lucid Dreaming I would call it something along the lines of:
Vandermill Audio
Lucid Dreams System
Saunders 75
(http://nectar.northampton.ac.uk/8705/1/Saunders20168705.pdf)
Good find Drengur... the text there should be somewhat self explanatory of why I wanted to call my audio setup the "Lucid dreams System".
Stereo is an illusion, make that illusion strong enough and you can sink back into the music (like a dream) and be taken on a journey.
At least, that has been the goal of this crazy long thread.
Basically, one isn't listening to songs anymore, they become more like being musical events.
Stereo is an illusion, make that illusion strong enough and you can sink back into the music (like a dream) and be taken on a journey.
At least, that has been the goal of this crazy long thread
.Basically, one isn't listening to songs anymore, they become more like being musical events.
For safety reasons and to be future proof I'm leaning towards:
Vandermill Audio
Lucid Dreams System
75 watt amplifier
It fits the other amp, it still is a conservative rating of what the amp can do and it isn't restricting it for other uses along the way.
Thanks everyone for playing, sorry tnargs for not taking any of your suggestions .
Vandermill Audio
Lucid Dreams System
75 watt amplifier
It fits the other amp, it still is a conservative rating of what the amp can do and it isn't restricting it for other uses along the way.
Thanks everyone for playing
, sorry tnargs for not taking any of your suggestions .
And since you have your subs and the new TV, how about some lucid dreams movies?
Here's a list from the Internet, just for fun.
She has a first top 10 post, but they are mostly commercial titles, this second post has some better suggestions, in my opinion.
10 More Lucid Dreaming Movies to Stimulate Your Night Life
Here's a list from the Internet, just for fun.
She has a first top 10 post, but they are mostly commercial titles, this second post has some better suggestions, in my opinion.
10 More Lucid Dreaming Movies to Stimulate Your Night Life