Steve - glad you dropped by this thread, would you be willing to post some of your SP-10 links here with a sentence or two of description what's it all about? It would be much appreciated.
There are currently 8 (or maybe more) tables in this thread currently being restored or fetteled with -- and you've done a lot of the foundational work.
There are currently 8 (or maybe more) tables in this thread currently being restored or fetteled with -- and you've done a lot of the foundational work.
Steve - glad you dropped by this thread, would you be willing to post some of your SP-10 links here with a sentence or two of description what's it all about? It would be much appreciated.
There are currently 8 (or maybe more) tables in this thread currently being restored or fetteled with -- and you've done a lot of the foundational work.[/QUOTE
sp10 Gallery
Above link to my rather small SP10 gallery. I'd like to grow this page with many more SP10 projects pictured.
I started that gallery when I purchased my own project table. As it turned out, the TT was in very good working order and only needed some bearing maintenance and a plinth.
A link to my SP10 mkII project page:
sp10_Mule
I'm still pretty happy with the Boston Audio Mat2.
I found that using a 'record weight' makes an audible difference for the better. (purer sounding)
The plinth seen in the photo above, which I named 'mule' seems like a good destination to me. The idea behind it was to use a rigid structure, yet with minimal thickness materials for a speedy migration of vibrational energy out of and away from the chassis.
The 4 round corner posts are hollow and hold #9 lead shot. The footers are earlier style Stillpoints which I acquired 2nd hand. The shelf beneath is a Neuance. And supporting the TT and shelf is a Minus-K platform.
The sound I get is very lively, highly detailed, articulate with very quick transients. Not organic sounding.....analytical in the best possible sense.
I plan to keep the Graham 2.2 on this turntable long term. When I choose another cartridge I will select one that is known for quick transients......Like the Shelter 501-II that I have in that photo.
-Steve
It's great to be a part of this thread and see the pics of everyone's builds, thanks.
Not much activity in the cabinet shop today so I had free rein with the tools. The CNC tech was in and gave me some time to write the program for my plinth. Today's step in my build was to cut a prototype out of 1" MDF and make sure everything fits and works before I start cutting up the Panzerholz.
Loaded up the full sheet in the panel saw to cut a couple strips off
Then cut up the 4 pieces that will make up the plinth. 19 3/8" wide, 16 1/8" deep, 4" tall.
Then some programing
Then the CNC
This is the bottom piece, the cut out is for the iron bearing drain
The 3rd down is blank at this stage, then the 2nd from the top. Cut out for the motor
Then the top, I will have to enlarge the cut out for the arm mount. I didn't pick up the arm (SME 312S) until later this afternoon and it might not fit. I made the cutout 3 1/4".
Then I took a 7/8" round over bit and ran all the corners. My goal was to make the plinth about as small as possible. Both the platter cut out and the arm cut out are right to the edge of the round over. From the center of the platter to the center of the arm is 11.63 inches.
Over the next couple of days I'll start fitting the motor and arm, and monitor adjustment to be made to the real plinth.
Not much activity in the cabinet shop today so I had free rein with the tools. The CNC tech was in and gave me some time to write the program for my plinth. Today's step in my build was to cut a prototype out of 1" MDF and make sure everything fits and works before I start cutting up the Panzerholz.
Loaded up the full sheet in the panel saw to cut a couple strips off
Then cut up the 4 pieces that will make up the plinth. 19 3/8" wide, 16 1/8" deep, 4" tall.
Then some programing
Then the CNC
This is the bottom piece, the cut out is for the iron bearing drain
The 3rd down is blank at this stage, then the 2nd from the top. Cut out for the motor
Then the top, I will have to enlarge the cut out for the arm mount. I didn't pick up the arm (SME 312S) until later this afternoon and it might not fit. I made the cutout 3 1/4".
Then I took a 7/8" round over bit and ran all the corners. My goal was to make the plinth about as small as possible. Both the platter cut out and the arm cut out are right to the edge of the round over. From the center of the platter to the center of the arm is 11.63 inches.
Over the next couple of days I'll start fitting the motor and arm, and monitor adjustment to be made to the real plinth.
It really looks very good!Keep up the good work!
One suggestion to everybody that makes it's own plith for the SP-10 or other turntables.
I have tried it in stand alone tonearm towers that i mostly use but i suspect that it will be even better in an integrated system:
Although it seems that everybody now understands the fact that bearing ballast weight (or drain if you prefer) is a good thing, i don't see anyone (please correct me if i've missed it) applying the same principle to the arm's base.
In every modification i try not rely to the (usually flimsy) arm's base.
Adding weight (non magnetic) with the form of a damped thick plate or thick rod under the arm's pivot point trully helps.
Please try it.It really works.
One suggestion to everybody that makes it's own plith for the SP-10 or other turntables.
I have tried it in stand alone tonearm towers that i mostly use but i suspect that it will be even better in an integrated system:
Although it seems that everybody now understands the fact that bearing ballast weight (or drain if you prefer) is a good thing, i don't see anyone (please correct me if i've missed it) applying the same principle to the arm's base.
In every modification i try not rely to the (usually flimsy) arm's base.
Adding weight (non magnetic) with the form of a damped thick plate or thick rod under the arm's pivot point trully helps.
Please try it.It really works.
Thanks for commenting.
I'm not really following a recipie for my plinth as a whole, but trying to incorporate various improvements that have proven successful.
As I mentioned earlier, this MDF plinth is a prototype for the final version that will be out of Panzerholz. You can order Panzer in different thicknesses. I chose 1" for a couple specific reasons. I don't have any engineering degrees or specific knowledge to support my reasons, maybe gut feeling reasoning😊.
I will be using a special bonding agent between each layer to provide some isolation. There will be no mechanical fasteners attaching layer to layer. The top layer only supports the arm. The second layer only supports the motor, and the bottom layer holds the drain and the feet of course.
The recessed pocket for the arm is 5/8" deep, giving me 3/8" depth for the mounting screws. And remember Panzer is dense enough that you can drill and tap it, so I will be using machine screws. My idea is that the entire top layer is the "drain" for the arm with the bonding agent giving the arm a little separation from the motor.
In my size and thickness each layer of Panzer weighs about 20 lbs. The top layer probably less than 10 lbs due to the cutout for the platter.
Any comments?
Made a little more progress, notched out a space for the wiring to pass through and the bearing portion of the motor
Then placed the motor
Then the platter
Fits perfect! With the adhesive between the top and bottom layer and the finish on the top, the bevel of the platter should perfectly line up with the top deck. The gap between the platter and the side walls is just large enough for a little finish build up, but not much.
An externally hosted image should be here but it was not working when we last tested it.
Then placed the motor
An externally hosted image should be here but it was not working when we last tested it.
Then the platter
An externally hosted image should be here but it was not working when we last tested it.
Fits perfect! With the adhesive between the top and bottom layer and the finish on the top, the bevel of the platter should perfectly line up with the top deck. The gap between the platter and the side walls is just large enough for a little finish build up, but not much.
It's making music!
I have a few changes to make in the design, required a little notching of the area around the base of the arm to get it to drop down another 1/8" (after this pic).
I'm really glad I made this prototype first. For the real thing I will keep a little more material around the motor, under the platter, in the first layer. This will keep some more of the weight and help support the front left corner.
For the arm location I'm going to recess the entire right rear corner 5/8" instead of just the circle. The arm looks too nice to bury part of it and makes it hard to get to the adjustment screws.
But I was able to dial in the arm perfectly, I like the overall shape and size, and I really like having the platter low into the plinth.
I will start on the Panzerholz version this week, but will enjoy this temp one for now.
BTW, it sounds pretty good right now, even with the $100 cartridge! I will fit a proper cart the very last thing on the new plinth, no sense in taking the chance on damage. Don't really like working around the arm, but so far no slip ups.
Any comments or suggestions or something I'm forgetting before I move on to the real thing?
I have a few changes to make in the design, required a little notching of the area around the base of the arm to get it to drop down another 1/8" (after this pic).
I'm really glad I made this prototype first. For the real thing I will keep a little more material around the motor, under the platter, in the first layer. This will keep some more of the weight and help support the front left corner.
For the arm location I'm going to recess the entire right rear corner 5/8" instead of just the circle. The arm looks too nice to bury part of it and makes it hard to get to the adjustment screws.
But I was able to dial in the arm perfectly, I like the overall shape and size, and I really like having the platter low into the plinth.
I will start on the Panzerholz version this week, but will enjoy this temp one for now.
BTW, it sounds pretty good right now, even with the $100 cartridge! I will fit a proper cart the very last thing on the new plinth, no sense in taking the chance on damage. Don't really like working around the arm, but so far no slip ups.
Any comments or suggestions or something I'm forgetting before I move on to the real thing?
I have no problem with the panzerholz.
I do like to mix materials and i would probably add a layer of metal (bronze probably) in between the panzerholz layers.
I would also use the cup (under the spindle) itself as a part of a vibration drain system.
As far as the tonearm goes i would attach under it a thick bronze rod (about 4cm diameter) that would penetrate all chassis layers.
And since weight and damping go hand in hand i would drill a slightly bigger hole than the rod diameter in the chassis and would add a damping agent around it and with contact to the main chassis...something like PU, silicone or neoprene foam.
Of course there is always the issue of modification to the arm's collar.
If you don't want to mess with that you can CNC cut another one and leave the original alone in case you ever want to sell the arm...
I do like to mix materials and i would probably add a layer of metal (bronze probably) in between the panzerholz layers.
I would also use the cup (under the spindle) itself as a part of a vibration drain system.
As far as the tonearm goes i would attach under it a thick bronze rod (about 4cm diameter) that would penetrate all chassis layers.
And since weight and damping go hand in hand i would drill a slightly bigger hole than the rod diameter in the chassis and would add a damping agent around it and with contact to the main chassis...something like PU, silicone or neoprene foam.
Of course there is always the issue of modification to the arm's collar.
If you don't want to mess with that you can CNC cut another one and leave the original alone in case you ever want to sell the arm...
Fantastic! I love it!!
As for comments or suggestions, the guys at Pass Labs ground that a total weight (table and plinth) of 50lb (22.5kg) is where the magic happens. That's my target, I'll need to make holes in the wood and add lead shot. I imagine that the Panzer will be quite a bit more dense than Baltic birch.
As for comments or suggestions, the guys at Pass Labs ground that a total weight (table and plinth) of 50lb (22.5kg) is where the magic happens. That's my target, I'll need to make holes in the wood and add lead shot. I imagine that the Panzer will be quite a bit more dense than Baltic birch.
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Looks good !
But should not the arm be able to move along its track for cartridge alignment ?
Trust me, mount the good cartridge last, why do I know that ?
Dave
Thanks,
The base of the arm requires a minimum of 3 1/4" diameter opening, which is what I have now. Version 2 will be 3 3/8" to allow for paint build up. The base, for those unfamiliar, has a built in track to allow the arm to move forward/backward for fine tuning to match different carts. I haven't measured, but the total adjustment distance is about 1". I also didn't look to see if I lost any of this range, but I did have enough adjustment to go way past the optimum setting, either way, as is for my cart.
Yea, I'm not even going to think about the final cart until the very end!
Thanks for jumping in.
How thick should the brass layer be? One or two?
The plan on the bearing drain is I have a 10 lb block of cast iron that has a threaded opening for a 3/8" brass rod that can be adjusted to kiss the bottom of the cup. Does this cover what your thinking?
I'll have to think about the arm drain. What would the bottom of the rod connect too to receive the energy?