The "classic" JBL 4530 single scoop rolls off below about 55 Hz, while the TH18 rolls off below 35 Hz, a HUGE difference.
Trying to get response much below 35 Hz really becomes a huge compromise both in the size of cabinet needed, and the amplification and AC power needed to support the LF.
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Another question please. I don't k ow how to calculate the among of power needed to push say 4 powerful amps like the qsc 4050 or the itech 5002. Do I need to purchase some type of equipment to stabalizer the current or do I need to configure components a certain way. I. The bahamas we use 120 power circuits in buildings. All I have on my system at this time is a furman power conditioner and I'm sure that can even stabalizer my system as is.
Thanks again
Thanks again
amps have power conditioning built in. you dont need an external one. look for 20 or 30 amp single phase (3prong) ciruits or better, or look into buying a power distribution unit to breakout 240v 3 phase (4 prong range plug etc) into smaller single phase circuits if you are going to attempt to run 4 itechs. you are not going to be satisfied with 15 amp 120 circuits, even if you have 4 seperate circuits to power your 4 amps.
Use the power conditioner on your pre-amp level stuff.
For most music, the average draw is less than 10% of the amp's peak rating, so blowing breakers (if you find enough) is not a big deal.
The main problem you will deal with in powering up multiple large power amps is voltage drop.
Voltage drop can easily cut the output of your subs by 6 dB, a big amp on a whimpy 100 foot 18 gauge may put out no more power than a small one.
With 120 volt you need 10 gauge wire and need to be as plugged in close as possible to the mains transformers, or on a power distribution using adequate wire size for the run.
More speakers are your friend, each time you double the number of bass cabinets, only 1/2 the AC power is needed to achieve the same output level.
"IMO a "modern" scoop system is real strong down to at least 30Hz.
Old scool, and new on the same system. The TH18 won't like this lower bassline it goes south at 40Hz, it'll cook the driver and you will be out some $$$."
A 'modern' scoop can only go to 30hz if it is longer and has more mouth area.
The difference between a scoop and a tapped horn is where the driver is 'tapped'.
The Danley TH118 has its impedance minimum just below 30hz, looks like 28hz or so to me. It's very compact mouth means it will need a couple of dB of boost at 30hz, but these new drivers should handle it with ease.
Old scool, and new on the same system. The TH18 won't like this lower bassline it goes south at 40Hz, it'll cook the driver and you will be out some $$$."
A 'modern' scoop can only go to 30hz if it is longer and has more mouth area.
The difference between a scoop and a tapped horn is where the driver is 'tapped'.
The Danley TH118 has its impedance minimum just below 30hz, looks like 28hz or so to me. It's very compact mouth means it will need a couple of dB of boost at 30hz, but these new drivers should handle it with ease.
Hi!
Someone else opinion:
http://forum.speakerplans.com/new-danley-subs_topic79523_post794041.html#794041
http://www.usspeaker.com/18.htm#B&C
(nw100, sw115 prices)
Regards,
Someone else opinion:
http://forum.speakerplans.com/new-danley-subs_topic79523_post794041.html#794041
http://www.usspeaker.com/18.htm#B&C
(nw100, sw115 prices)
Regards,
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how strong would the sound be if i use the 18sound 2400's? also where would i look for a proper power distribution unit? i see lots for servers and nothing about 3 phase 4 prong setup thanks. i am going this morning to purchase wood to start building two of the TH18's and really need to know if this is the way to go, dan are you suggesting some type of scoop now? if so can you point me in the right direction for a plan or drawing. thanks to all
Hi Pabesco,
I've not used the 18LW2400's but I do not think you will be disappointed, and they should do nicely for a "smaller" system. There are two routes you can go on wood IMO, one being quality plywood, and the other being something cheap like OSB. The middle ground of particleboard, MDF, and regular construction ply you should avoid altogether.
Quality plywood is or can be tough to find and really expensive, especially on an island. 13 ply Baltic Birch B/BB grade is generally considered the good stuff, but what makes it good is that there are no voids and the quality of the inner ply's is nearly as good as the outer surface you see. Baltic Birch is totally made of birch, not just birch veneer for outer skins.
BB ply:
The difference:
Both examples appear to be of good quality, but I would prefer not to buy the one on the left. Fewer ply's give a tendency to to warp and the thin outer veneers are easy to damage.
This is what you want to avoid:
The gaps due to voids or splices can make air leaks or rattle
There is some stuff called Auraco Ply that I tried on some monitors:
It's OK if available, not great but serviceable. It's one of those that tends to warp, but it is generally void free.
If you are inexperienced in woodworking get help, you don't need fancy tools but you do need to be able to make clean straight accurate cuts.
No scoops
I've not used the 18LW2400's but I do not think you will be disappointed, and they should do nicely for a "smaller" system. There are two routes you can go on wood IMO, one being quality plywood, and the other being something cheap like OSB. The middle ground of particleboard, MDF, and regular construction ply you should avoid altogether.
Quality plywood is or can be tough to find and really expensive, especially on an island. 13 ply Baltic Birch B/BB grade is generally considered the good stuff, but what makes it good is that there are no voids and the quality of the inner ply's is nearly as good as the outer surface you see. Baltic Birch is totally made of birch, not just birch veneer for outer skins.
BB ply:
The difference:
Both examples appear to be of good quality, but I would prefer not to buy the one on the left. Fewer ply's give a tendency to to warp and the thin outer veneers are easy to damage.
This is what you want to avoid:
An externally hosted image should be here but it was not working when we last tested it.
The gaps due to voids or splices can make air leaks or rattle
There is some stuff called Auraco Ply that I tried on some monitors:
It's OK if available, not great but serviceable. It's one of those that tends to warp, but it is generally void free.
If you are inexperienced in woodworking get help, you don't need fancy tools but you do need to be able to make clean straight accurate cuts.
No scoops
You should not be looking for three-phase power at the level you are working, most venues will only have single phase (two hot legs, not three).
Portable power distribution is a complex subject and subject to local electrical laws.
If the venues you work in don't have a dedicated 50 amp plug of the type you choose, an electrician would have to tie in your bare leads.
4/4 wire is required for a 50 amp service, and larger cable for runs over 100 feet.
You may find used units from large construction firms, they typically look like the ones below.
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ok, what i will be working with after about two months is as follows
four TH18's loaded with 18sound 2400's
two qsc 4050's
one inuke6000dsp
two custom cabs specific for 18sound 2400's
two active tops (not sure what type yet)
rack mount equalizer
rack mount crossover
firstly is all of the equipment listed a proper match especially the amps and cabs (can i use 0ne 4050 for two th18's)
then secondly how would i power this system say at someones home or my home for sound checks and testing at any time.
what would i need to be sure i dont damage breakers or any part of my system
thanks
four TH18's loaded with 18sound 2400's
two qsc 4050's
one inuke6000dsp
two custom cabs specific for 18sound 2400's
two active tops (not sure what type yet)
rack mount equalizer
rack mount crossover
firstly is all of the equipment listed a proper match especially the amps and cabs (can i use 0ne 4050 for two th18's)
then secondly how would i power this system say at someones home or my home for sound checks and testing at any time.
what would i need to be sure i dont damage breakers or any part of my system
thanks
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Two 15 amp, 120v breakers would suffice, as long as you don't go all out. If you do want to really push it, you need to get the export version of the 4050's, (240v) and run those off of 15 amp breakers. That will give you plenty of headroom, but good luck finding the same 240v plug at every single bar / house you go to. There's so many different kinds. Unless you have all on hand and are ready to swap ends on your 12 or 10 gauge extension cords
If I'm guessing correctly if I use TWO 15amp 120v breakers would not that make a 240v circuit? All of my equipment is 120. As you can see I am a rookie, but believe me I'm willing to do what it takes to learn as much as I can. Also what do you think a out the other part of the question. Two 4050s running four of the th18s with 18sound 2400s
No not at all. 15 amps at 240 volts is a ton more power than 15 amps at 120 volts.
Yes that's the issue, you'd need a distro, or you'd have to find different power sources. 120v and 240v. Or just be very very very careful trying to power everything off 120v breakers. I'd say you'd be okay with three 120v breakers, one 15 amp for each 4050 amplifier, then another 15 amp breaker for the rest of your stuff.
Two 4050's for four TH-18's sounds like a good plan to me. Four 8 ohm cabinets ?
Yes that's the issue, you'd need a distro, or you'd have to find different power sources. 120v and 240v. Or just be very very very careful trying to power everything off 120v breakers. I'd say you'd be okay with three 120v breakers, one 15 amp for each 4050 amplifier, then another 15 amp breaker for the rest of your stuff.
Two 4050's for four TH-18's sounds like a good plan to me. Four 8 ohm cabinets ?
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yes it will be 8ohms per cab. i will look into purchasing these asap. any suggestions as to where to purchase 4050s from used or new
also i was looking at a few distros online and found a few rated at 30 and 40 amps would one of these be ok? i will try to post a pic of it in the next post
thanks for the info
also i was looking at a few distros online and found a few rated at 30 and 40 amps would one of these be ok? i will try to post a pic of it in the next post
thanks for the info
i will be sure to call them to see if this price is right, thanksone more quick question , do you thing building some of the DR250s would be a good match for the TH18s i am going to build? do they give really good top end? if so can you point me in the right direction to a design plan. i know i saw it somewhere on this site but i cannot remember where, thanks