A little higher up in this thread, I'm using the W8-1772, and a sub from TB as well, but not a great match. The sub is not sensitive enough.
Here are the finished Brio Trio clones. They sound truly impressive. I'm playing them in conjunction with a very compact sub using the TB W4 2089 Sub woofer driver and a PE 25 W plate amp crossed over at 150HZ. Many many thanks to all for a great thread and the personalized help as well.
Jay
Jay
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Thanks for the kind words Gents. I did use the 20uF caps. The imaging, detail and harmonics are way better than anything else I have heard in their size range and remind me, on a much smaller scale, of a friends Acoustat (electrostatic) panel speakers.
Their only shortcoming is their lack of bass. Since I am hoping to gift some of these to friends who may not be interested in a 2.1 system, I am wondering if the basic design concept could be used to come up with a pair that could get by without a sub.
The Aura sound NS 3 produces good, usable bass ( F3 = 48HZ) in a 3L cabinet, is an extended range speaker and sounds good without a filter. Are there reasons why using this in the bottom, ported section of the speaker and the TC9 in the upper open portion would not work well?
I am not sure if the magic of the Brio is due to the excellence of the drivers, the fact that they are identical, the basic closed plus open cabinet design, or a combination of these, but it is something special. It would be even more special if it had enough bass to obviate the necessity of a sub.
I'm thinking my next build will be something along these lines but would appreciate input on its real world practicality.
Best,
Jay
Their only shortcoming is their lack of bass. Since I am hoping to gift some of these to friends who may not be interested in a 2.1 system, I am wondering if the basic design concept could be used to come up with a pair that could get by without a sub.
The Aura sound NS 3 produces good, usable bass ( F3 = 48HZ) in a 3L cabinet, is an extended range speaker and sounds good without a filter. Are there reasons why using this in the bottom, ported section of the speaker and the TC9 in the upper open portion would not work well?
I am not sure if the magic of the Brio is due to the excellence of the drivers, the fact that they are identical, the basic closed plus open cabinet design, or a combination of these, but it is something special. It would be even more special if it had enough bass to obviate the necessity of a sub.
I'm thinking my next build will be something along these lines but would appreciate input on its real world practicality.
Best,
Jay
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Drjay,
I looked back at your previous posts to see if you had mentioned anything about your driver selection and haven't found anything. After looking at your photos, nice work by the way, it appears you're using the stamped frame version of the TC9. TS specs are quite different from the TC9FD18. Most notably the difference in FS being 50hz higher in the version you're using. I'm not sure if that's going to make all the difference you're missing in the lower region but I thought I might point that out. Please excuse me if you've already mentioned this elsewhere.
I looked back at your previous posts to see if you had mentioned anything about your driver selection and haven't found anything. After looking at your photos, nice work by the way, it appears you're using the stamped frame version of the TC9. TS specs are quite different from the TC9FD18. Most notably the difference in FS being 50hz higher in the version you're using. I'm not sure if that's going to make all the difference you're missing in the lower region but I thought I might point that out. Please excuse me if you've already mentioned this elsewhere.
Jay,
Your work is fantastic. I have been inspired to finalize my version. I have ordered some decent 20uf caps. Maybe I will have some time this weekend to work on the cabinets. You have given me a great looking road map.
I am listening to mine at the moment. I am only using one of my 15" subs crossed at 150 and it sounds great in my small room. I wonder what other kinds of subs would work with this?
Again, great work!! I can't believe that you can build something this fantastic for so little money.
Your work is fantastic. I have been inspired to finalize my version. I have ordered some decent 20uf caps. Maybe I will have some time this weekend to work on the cabinets. You have given me a great looking road map.
I am listening to mine at the moment. I am only using one of my 15" subs crossed at 150 and it sounds great in my small room. I wonder what other kinds of subs would work with this?
Again, great work!! I can't believe that you can build something this fantastic for so little money.
I have borderline diagnosable attention deficit disorder, so when I ordered the drivers for my build from PE, I ordered the metal frame 4 Ohm version, not even noticing the other model. The 8 ohm version certainly looks better, but the 4 Ohm has a somewhat lighter diaphram and retails for more money. Looking at the frequency response of both, I doubt that the flat frame version would give enough more bass to make a real difference. This speaker needs a lot of help in the bass department.
As far as subs go for the Brio Trios, I have not tried them with the Cerberus (on the workbench in the background) since I want to keep the whole system as small as possible. For near field listening they are very impressive with the tiny sub in the picture,
which measures 7.5" on a side and uses one Tang Band W4-2089 4.5"subwoofer driver and two Peerless 5.25 passive radiators. The sub has an F3 of 34HZ but an output with the 25 W PE plate amp of only around 95 DB.
As far as subs go for the Brio Trios, I have not tried them with the Cerberus (on the workbench in the background) since I want to keep the whole system as small as possible. For near field listening they are very impressive with the tiny sub in the picture,
which measures 7.5" on a side and uses one Tang Band W4-2089 4.5"subwoofer driver and two Peerless 5.25 passive radiators. The sub has an F3 of 34HZ but an output with the 25 W PE plate amp of only around 95 DB.
Another thing, does anyone have a clue as to what, if any, sound damping material is in the bottom ported section of the factory model? Now that we have a winner, it is time to start to fine tune it.
Parts ordered. Hopefully I can knock these out in a few days.
Initially they will sit on top of a pair of Hivi D8.8 sealed woofers (replacing the BG Neo3/Neo8 combo these right now) with a MiniDSP handling the crossover duties.
If they sound good, then I will work up a dedicated woofer for these.
Any thoughts on this plate amp driving the whole system?
https://www.parts-express.com/dayton-audio-mca2250e-21-channel-class-d-plate-amplifier--300-771
Initially they will sit on top of a pair of Hivi D8.8 sealed woofers (replacing the BG Neo3/Neo8 combo these right now) with a MiniDSP handling the crossover duties.
If they sound good, then I will work up a dedicated woofer for these.
Any thoughts on this plate amp driving the whole system?
https://www.parts-express.com/dayton-audio-mca2250e-21-channel-class-d-plate-amplifier--300-771
My review: These are great. At first i has my doubts but the wife came in after a week and said "Those sound FANTASTIC. You built them?" Thats when i started believing. I do use a smaller subwoofer. What i find great about them is that the symphony is great. jazz is great. classic rock / metal not so much... My favorite now is Ambiance/ Spa/ New Age; which i used to think was shyte ; is incredible! 180 degrees left to right and yards deep...the decay on solo piano is so cool... Carl Marchisotta is a genius...
Which is why i think we should clone one of his more expensive models like the K2 or Studio Grand Reference Gold...
Which is why i think we should clone one of his more expensive models like the K2 or Studio Grand Reference Gold...
Those certainly would be interesting to clone. I wonder how complicated the crossovers are...
As for the smaller ones, here are mine and my review. These things are spectacular. I finished them last weekend. They sound even better than I imagined. I let a couple of my friends listen to them. These friends are both music teachers and avid audiophiles. They were both blown away. The detail, richness, width and depth of the sound stage is amazing. For now, I am going to keep using them with my dual 15" u-frame subs.
Here are the pics. Thanks for the inspiration everyone.
As for the smaller ones, here are mine and my review. These things are spectacular. I finished them last weekend. They sound even better than I imagined. I let a couple of my friends listen to them. These friends are both music teachers and avid audiophiles. They were both blown away. The detail, richness, width and depth of the sound stage is amazing. For now, I am going to keep using them with my dual 15" u-frame subs.
Here are the pics. Thanks for the inspiration everyone.
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The K2 would be a fun project. I would go active with the crossover. Need to figure out the drivers.
OK ... so now I'm getting a little obsessed with this K2 idea ... but on a super tight budget.
I found a mid and tweeter that were originally used in a Velodyne compact 'theater in a box'. The finished speaker got great reviews so the drivers are good and are meant to work together (and cheap!)
So going all active ... four mids and tweeters per side open baffle, and two woofers (probably 8") in a ported box.
I found a mid and tweeter that were originally used in a Velodyne compact 'theater in a box'. The finished speaker got great reviews so the drivers are good and are meant to work together (and cheap!)
So going all active ... four mids and tweeters per side open baffle, and two woofers (probably 8") in a ported box.
I really don't like the spacing on the tweeter woofers on the K2, but maybe the dipole effect will minimize the combing effect?
I wonder what 4 tc9's would be like...
Two open baffle , two boxed...in twice the volume...
Double the goodness???
Two open baffle , two boxed...in twice the volume...
Double the goodness???