@Calvin: was the absence of cloth / screens mainly about appearance, or acoustics as well?
I did more listening tests and comparing, and the overall impression is that on average I prefer the woofer + esl setup to the esl only setup. The esl only setup is still very capable of producing LF, but the woofers produce just more pressure and, depending on the record, give a bit more dynamics, which I prefer. Still questionable if I would spend about 1500 euro's for just the 12 midwooders and dsp and stereo amplifier to power this hybrid setup, and in my case, being dependent on windows-only minidsp software, but I hope to extend the improvement by building a new, similar panel, maybe a bit taller, with smaller d/s spacing to improve sensitivity, so I can use easily obtainable, cheap toroidal power transforers, compared to the heavy, custom made full range transformers I currently use for my stats. And I expect an audible improvement in mid-range transparency, if remembering correctly from listening tests a few years ago, because I will use them without any cloth / screens, as I don't need to tame the fundamental resonant frequency of the stat panels.
I did more listening tests and comparing, and the overall impression is that on average I prefer the woofer + esl setup to the esl only setup. The esl only setup is still very capable of producing LF, but the woofers produce just more pressure and, depending on the record, give a bit more dynamics, which I prefer. Still questionable if I would spend about 1500 euro's for just the 12 midwooders and dsp and stereo amplifier to power this hybrid setup, and in my case, being dependent on windows-only minidsp software, but I hope to extend the improvement by building a new, similar panel, maybe a bit taller, with smaller d/s spacing to improve sensitivity, so I can use easily obtainable, cheap toroidal power transforers, compared to the heavy, custom made full range transformers I currently use for my stats. And I expect an audible improvement in mid-range transparency, if remembering correctly from listening tests a few years ago, because I will use them without any cloth / screens, as I don't need to tame the fundamental resonant frequency of the stat panels.
Hi,
my experiences with ESLs featuring cloth or mesh damping relates in majority to Quads.
While I do like the 57, I never heard the 63 (or its heirs) really ´transparent´, regardless of setup and used amplifiers.
It always sounded muddy, boring, non-dynamic to my ears, as if a blanket were thrown over it.
Still though I´d like to experiment with mesh in my next panels, attempting to reduce the resonance peak burden before taking electronic measures.
Building a dedicated hybrid-panel will improve matters against just using a FR-panel and add some woof below.
Dynamics, speed and attac can improve by orders.
A larger system designed that way can easily perform with the authority and effortlessness of a big horn system, topping it in speed, resolution and naturality ... rem: it won´t reach the top SPL levels, but the ESL doesn´t suffer fom compression effects like a dynamic speaker.
Its a hard-clipping behaviour -almost perfect till that point- against the soft-clipping of dynamic drivers with grossly increasing THD which notifies about the nearby limits.
jauu
Calvin
my experiences with ESLs featuring cloth or mesh damping relates in majority to Quads.
While I do like the 57, I never heard the 63 (or its heirs) really ´transparent´, regardless of setup and used amplifiers.
It always sounded muddy, boring, non-dynamic to my ears, as if a blanket were thrown over it.
Still though I´d like to experiment with mesh in my next panels, attempting to reduce the resonance peak burden before taking electronic measures.
Building a dedicated hybrid-panel will improve matters against just using a FR-panel and add some woof below.
Dynamics, speed and attac can improve by orders.
A larger system designed that way can easily perform with the authority and effortlessness of a big horn system, topping it in speed, resolution and naturality ... rem: it won´t reach the top SPL levels, but the ESL doesn´t suffer fom compression effects like a dynamic speaker.
Its a hard-clipping behaviour -almost perfect till that point- against the soft-clipping of dynamic drivers with grossly increasing THD which notifies about the nearby limits.
jauu
Calvin
You're invited to come and listen in The Netherlands and be wildly surprised. PM for an appointment.
Could it be that damping mesh has a nonlineair behaviour? Nonlineair regarding amplitude? That may explain Calvins observation as well as my experience with an audiostatic + mesh