Selfmade said:
You must have missed one of the more controversial thread on this forum: http://www.diyaudio.com/forums/showthread.php?s=&threadid=6031&highlight=
Well, 47Labs claim big improvements with removing jackets from the caps. I didn't notice anything that big, however, certain degree of easiness (in sonic presentation) is added, when the caps are being "skinned".
On larger caps in power supplies, I often thought about removing the sleeves and using the clamps to ground the casings for a possible shielding scheme. I wonder if you could use solder braid and link all the casings together on smaller caps on a PCB and then to a ground point. I am npt sure about any immediate sonic benefits but it would elimnate HF or even RF noise from affecting the electrolitic.
I theorise this as recent discoveries have been made on quantum particles magnetic alignment being altered with HF radiation.
Hummm
Anthony
I theorise this as recent discoveries have been made on quantum particles magnetic alignment being altered with HF radiation.
Hummm
Anthony
Ok, this is an update after all these. I cleaned every single solder joint, then desolder everything to clean the PCBs. Then I resolder the Right channel, and the PSU, and they are fine. About the cap, I decided not to test it. And thanks to Brian, he will send me two caps soon. THANKS MAN! YOU ARE THE BEST. I learned one thing in using alcohol to clean the components that cleaning ugly solder joint is not using a hobby knife. I used to scratch the liquid which come out after heat applied to solder, and then use a tooth brush to clean the dust. It was all wrong, and it is not how ppl clean the joint. And I understand why ppl have good looking solder joint without scratching it now. Also Chemistry do help EE major a big time.
S.C said:Ok, this is an update after all these. I cleaned every single solder joint, then desolder everything to clean the PCBs. Then I resolder the Right channel, and the PSU, and they are fine. About the cap, I decided not to test it. And thanks to Brian, he will send me two caps soon. THANKS MAN! YOU ARE THE BEST. I learned one thing in using alcohol to clean the components that cleaning ugly solder joint is not using a hobby knife. I used to scratch the liquid which come out after heat applied to solder, and then use a tooth brush to clean the dust. It was all wrong, and it is not how ppl clean the joint. And I understand why ppl have good looking solder joint without scratching it now. Also Chemistry do help EE major a big time.
I have the caps all packed up, and they are going in the mail today.
I urge everyone to be extremely careful and follow the proper safety precautions when assembling/testing kits.
--
Brian
peranders said:
This is only true for axial caps. Radial caps don't have any pins connected to the can.
Hi,
First of all some, not all, caps have their cans internally connected to the neagative terminal so whatever it is you think of shielding often already is.
Secondly, in case the can isn't making contact with the negative pole of the cap, the cap itself won't pick up anything. Not even a message from ET.
Thirdly, if you remove the insulation from a cap use some common sense and mark one of the poles with a clear and simple symbol such as - for negative or + for positive, no need to reinvent wheels here, before you solder it in.
Fourth, if you really must try to reach ET, connect or let the cans touch your chassis/ groundplane willy nilly and maybe, just maybe you'll get a message every now and then. (kidding)
More likely though, you'll have all kinds of funny groundloops and whatever starearthing scheme was implemented, if any, now is finally down the tubes.
IOW, better use a method where the can can't come in touch with anything remotely conductive.
Adhering to starearthing the proper way will be much more effective against RF and extraterrestrials than making a rats' nest of an otherwise good layout.
Fifth, for those thinking that skinning caps is the latest fad...think again. I've seen it done in amps (one of the best I know of) at least 40 years ago already.
Incidentally or not that engineer also knows what ferrites are for, knows how to solder (something I see much lacking if the pics are anything to go by), did not use any PCBs and knows precisely what to do with a global negative feedback loop... and no, he doesn't use opamps but that besides the point.
Peter,
Rest assured I am not. [Joke, short for Johanna in Flemish]
If I were to apply those "ideas" about safety with tube electronics I wouldn't be around to tell funny stories anymore now would I?
Maybe some of you guys should take an example to the "Tubes" forum here where people are warned to take precautions or leave things alone when we sense they're not up to it?
Either way we don't put any "funny" ideas into their heads, not now, not ever.
Dhaen,
Does removing the amp/voltage rating of a fuse bring an improvement in sound?
Seriously, the plastic sleeve of a cap is only one place where polarity is marked. Often, very often there are permanent markings on the casing itself.
Admittedly, it becomes a tad hard to tell once you played champagne bottle cork with it...
Cheers and play safe...(sex too),😉
First of all some, not all, caps have their cans internally connected to the neagative terminal so whatever it is you think of shielding often already is.
Secondly, in case the can isn't making contact with the negative pole of the cap, the cap itself won't pick up anything. Not even a message from ET.
Thirdly, if you remove the insulation from a cap use some common sense and mark one of the poles with a clear and simple symbol such as - for negative or + for positive, no need to reinvent wheels here, before you solder it in.
Fourth, if you really must try to reach ET, connect or let the cans touch your chassis/ groundplane willy nilly and maybe, just maybe you'll get a message every now and then. (kidding)
More likely though, you'll have all kinds of funny groundloops and whatever starearthing scheme was implemented, if any, now is finally down the tubes.
IOW, better use a method where the can can't come in touch with anything remotely conductive.
Adhering to starearthing the proper way will be much more effective against RF and extraterrestrials than making a rats' nest of an otherwise good layout.
Fifth, for those thinking that skinning caps is the latest fad...think again. I've seen it done in amps (one of the best I know of) at least 40 years ago already.
Incidentally or not that engineer also knows what ferrites are for, knows how to solder (something I see much lacking if the pics are anything to go by), did not use any PCBs and knows precisely what to do with a global negative feedback loop... and no, he doesn't use opamps but that besides the point.
Peter,
Rest assured I am not. [Joke, short for Johanna in Flemish]
If I were to apply those "ideas" about safety with tube electronics I wouldn't be around to tell funny stories anymore now would I?
Maybe some of you guys should take an example to the "Tubes" forum here where people are warned to take precautions or leave things alone when we sense they're not up to it?
Either way we don't put any "funny" ideas into their heads, not now, not ever.
Dhaen,
Does removing the amp/voltage rating of a fuse bring an improvement in sound?
Seriously, the plastic sleeve of a cap is only one place where polarity is marked. Often, very often there are permanent markings on the casing itself.
Admittedly, it becomes a tad hard to tell once you played champagne bottle cork with it...
Cheers and play safe...(sex too),😉
With all this "cap" talk going on...... has anyone tried the 1500uF Panasonic FC cap bypassed with a Film/Foil cap? This would be cheaper than using the 1000uF BG's. Just wondering how the sonics of this combo are.
Oh and BTW I got the idea of grounding the cans from when I used to repair Tube Equipment. It was a common practise to ground all the RF shields around the tubes by linking them together with copper braid. I guess the designers of tube equipment are a little flaky as well. 🙂
Anthony
GO ON TEACH ME...
Hi,
Maybe you've also forgotten that in those days these caps' - terminal actually was the can?
And no, it had nothing to do whatsoever with RF shielding.
The shielding cans around the tubes have got nothing to do with the powersupply either and the braids where only there to make sure the cans were grounded in case the chassis was painted (insulated), BTW.
In 99% of the cases this was not necessary at all as the sockets were already grounded anyway and the better units even had silverplated chasses....
Anything else?
Cheers,😉
Hi,
Maybe you've also forgotten that in those days these caps' - terminal actually was the can?
And no, it had nothing to do whatsoever with RF shielding.
The shielding cans around the tubes have got nothing to do with the powersupply either and the braids where only there to make sure the cans were grounded in case the chassis was painted (insulated), BTW.
In 99% of the cases this was not necessary at all as the sockets were already grounded anyway and the better units even had silverplated chasses....
Anything else?
Cheers,😉
Re: GO ON TEACH ME...
No thanks, that's all I have for now, and was that so hard to give a civil answer?
Anthony
fdegrove said:
No thanks, that's all I have for now, and was that so hard to give a civil answer?
Anthony
To test out this nude cap idea for myself, I took the skins off of the all the electrolytic caps in the PS of my Creek 4340, just to see.
I don't know if this contributed to the result, but Creek believes in using multiple small value caps instead of a couple of large ones, so there are something like 12 or 14 caps in that PS.
The result was a presentation that sounded much easier and significantly less stressed. In this particular instance the effect was unmistakable and very positive.
After I listened to my nuded PS for a couple of weeks (with renewed interest in the amp, I might add), I decided to nude all the small electrolytics in the Creek's phono stage. There were maybe 12 small electrolytics on the phono card.
In this instance, I wasn't sure if there was an improvement or not. There might have been a small increase in transparency, but it was so small I couldn't be sure it wasn't from variations in the power grid, or from something else.
In any case, the nuding of the PS caps did a spectacular thing to the way the amp plays music. I would not hesitate to do it again if I had another Creek 4340. The nuding of the phono stage really didn't to much. Don't know if this would translate to other amplifiers or not.
On a practical note, I use a Sharpie permenant marker to mark all the caps that I nude, first marking the negative leg on top before the skin comes off, and then writing down the uF and voltage ratings on the side of the cap after the skin comes off.
Best,
KT
I don't know if this contributed to the result, but Creek believes in using multiple small value caps instead of a couple of large ones, so there are something like 12 or 14 caps in that PS.
The result was a presentation that sounded much easier and significantly less stressed. In this particular instance the effect was unmistakable and very positive.
After I listened to my nuded PS for a couple of weeks (with renewed interest in the amp, I might add), I decided to nude all the small electrolytics in the Creek's phono stage. There were maybe 12 small electrolytics on the phono card.
In this instance, I wasn't sure if there was an improvement or not. There might have been a small increase in transparency, but it was so small I couldn't be sure it wasn't from variations in the power grid, or from something else.
In any case, the nuding of the PS caps did a spectacular thing to the way the amp plays music. I would not hesitate to do it again if I had another Creek 4340. The nuding of the phono stage really didn't to much. Don't know if this would translate to other amplifiers or not.
On a practical note, I use a Sharpie permenant marker to mark all the caps that I nude, first marking the negative leg on top before the skin comes off, and then writing down the uF and voltage ratings on the side of the cap after the skin comes off.
Best,
KT
I started taking orders again for kits, and am now also offering Blackgate 1000uF STD upgrades. See my post here for more info:
http://www.diyaudio.com/forums/showthread.php?postid=409968#post409968
The order page:
http://www.BrianGT.com/order
--
Brian
http://www.diyaudio.com/forums/showthread.php?postid=409968#post409968
The order page:
http://www.BrianGT.com/order
--
Brian
Brain, I got the caps at 2:00pm. Thx for the amount you had sent me and your effective action. I think you will see something with my name on it next month haha.😀
Here are pics of my almost finished amp. I got anxious and hooked it up, now I don't want to pull it back out to finish it. Sounds wonderful. I need to pull it back apart and refinish the al, anodize it, make a wood bottom facade to match the top plate(so it looks like a sandwich, and make better feet for it(i'm making some daruma roller ball knock offs).
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