sparkle said:
Nuts, bolts and screws.
Maybe move away the transformer a bit.
If I should stumble across on of those boomboxes, I would give it a try.
But when I see that flimsy mechanism, mounted on massive copper / wood / acrylic / what else ? bases, I hardly believe that makes any sense.
The motor and the spindle are a horror of their own.
thnx Bernhard 
- no offense - but i like to hear a comment from the guys that have tried it ... you did not try that transport and simply could not comment my problem.... sorry....
i know it is looking crazy and i know it is very fragile - but it si working very very nice.... better than my dvd with dac combo.... and i am no begginer....
so, from my point of view it is a device that has a big potential - but you could allready read that from the previous pages of this thread....
p.s. transformer is not near the transport - it is arround 50cm from the transport - only on this picstures you ca see it close to the mechanism.....
******************************
now, does anybody that actually made the transport have any comment on my problem/ doubts etc......
should i move back to the real wood and leave the copper out... does anyone have any experince with this behaviour....
should i go to the better psu... ...
i am confused because i kow Peter is usingthat psu and also copper plate (not exactly like i am using) and i know he is not a begginer to... people also made a lot of positive comments... so i am confused... is my hearing wrong or is it the Black Gate not fully burned in problem.....????
hmmmm.....
doubts, questions..... crazy transport....
- no offense - but i like to hear a comment from the guys that have tried it ... you did not try that transport and simply could not comment my problem.... sorry....i know it is looking crazy and i know it is very fragile - but it si working very very nice.... better than my dvd with dac combo.... and i am no begginer....
so, from my point of view it is a device that has a big potential - but you could allready read that from the previous pages of this thread....
p.s. transformer is not near the transport - it is arround 50cm from the transport - only on this picstures you ca see it close to the mechanism.....
******************************
now, does anybody that actually made the transport have any comment on my problem/ doubts etc......
should i move back to the real wood and leave the copper out... does anyone have any experince with this behaviour....
should i go to the better psu... ...
i am confused because i kow Peter is usingthat psu and also copper plate (not exactly like i am using) and i know he is not a begginer to... people also made a lot of positive comments... so i am confused... is my hearing wrong or is it the Black Gate not fully burned in problem.....????
hmmmm.....
doubts, questions.....
crazy transport....
First I think it has to be determined if you are listening/judging the transport or a total cdplayer (you use a dac)...
You can ONLY modify the transport if you know what your old transport sounded like in your set-up or if you make a decision that your dac in your system is a bit referential or a component that will stay unmodified in your system... only then you have a structured path to follow so you can tune the new component (transport) to your liking........STEP BY STEP....give it more time....!!
Use your own ears... advice is hardly to be given since everybody's set-up is different ..let alone their taste (and priorities)...
If you want to know my personal opinion I would say that a mix of copper and wood...tunes the transport to my liking...and is furthermore beneficial for adressing technical solutions ...
One of my recent listening experiences is that the encasing establishes a much higher resolution...
Just to give a response...
You can ONLY modify the transport if you know what your old transport sounded like in your set-up or if you make a decision that your dac in your system is a bit referential or a component that will stay unmodified in your system... only then you have a structured path to follow so you can tune the new component (transport) to your liking........STEP BY STEP....give it more time....!!
Use your own ears... advice is hardly to be given since everybody's set-up is different ..let alone their taste (and priorities)...
If you want to know my personal opinion I would say that a mix of copper and wood...tunes the transport to my liking...and is furthermore beneficial for adressing technical solutions ...
One of my recent listening experiences is that the encasing establishes a much higher resolution...
Just to give a response...
I have gone down my own path and all I can say is this transport {EZ51} is nothing less than astounding!!!!! Up against my super modded Marantz and Rotel players I seem to spend most time listening to this one, it would appear to have magic smoke in its circuitry.
PS Im great fan of Oscons. You can keep your overpriced BGs.
PS Im great fan of Oscons. You can keep your overpriced BGs.
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sparkle said:
Hi sparkle,
this thing above is I just what I wish to ask you. From your prototype photos seems that there are no any mechanical elastic and dumping hangs. So seems that whole drive laying directly on hard surface and has nothing what would control vibrations from drive itself. In this case, vibrations generated by rotating elements (motor and disk) must reflect back to the most sensitive component of assembly. This is laser head and lot of reading mistakes must be generated.
Your test with foam proves this thought.
Discussion regarding type of signal lead, analog or digital:
I read a lot about digital sound technology lately. What I can say here, analog signal from drive itself is very good even better that what you can achieve using coax.
This is my personal opinion, which I can explain if anybody curious.
That's why many of us have coupled the mechanism so stiffly to a big hunk of metal. I used machined standoffs of over 1.5cm in diameter with 10-32 screws and heavy washers (sorry do not know metric equivalent) to mount the mechanism at 2 diagonal points only. I have over 6Kg in mine overall and I could really hear the difference securely mounting the mechanism to a heavy aluminum plate which was in turn mass loaded with about another 3.5Kg of bronze. I have not used any elastomeric or other isolation between the mechanism and the plate.
Your basic set up looks pretty good, I would just add a whole lot more mass under the copper, but well coupled to it.
Note that it seemed to take forever for my BG caps to break in, but when they finally did it was a pretty obvious improvement. My mech is the same, but the boards are slightly different as I used an RC-EZ32 instead of the '31. I removed the ceramic caps across the BG on the board, used Peter's recommended xtal, (did not find the stock resonator the least bit compelling after the swap and a reswap to double check) and paid a lot of attention to the spdif output impedance and level. I used 392 and about 89 ohms to make the 75 ohm spdif output pad, but 300//100 should work pretty well as well. I used all 75 ohm hardware including the bnc connectors themselves and I could hear a difference I thought.
Finally a larger power transformer (50VA) did make a very subtle difference.
You would be surprised at the sort of things that make a difference. I recommend going back to the very early part of the thread as there is a great deal of information about getting it to work right, and Peter spent a long time figuring out how to get the best out of this hardware, follow his advice closely and it would be hard to get a bad result.
It took about 100hrs of use and tinkering to get it sounding right and while I still prefer SACD, LP or tape to CD, this is about the best CD sound I have ever had. (I had a PS Audio Lambda Drive which was pretty close in terms of sonics, but it died of old age a couple of years ago, so no direct comparison was possible.)
Your basic set up looks pretty good, I would just add a whole lot more mass under the copper, but well coupled to it.
Note that it seemed to take forever for my BG caps to break in, but when they finally did it was a pretty obvious improvement. My mech is the same, but the boards are slightly different as I used an RC-EZ32 instead of the '31. I removed the ceramic caps across the BG on the board, used Peter's recommended xtal, (did not find the stock resonator the least bit compelling after the swap and a reswap to double check) and paid a lot of attention to the spdif output impedance and level. I used 392 and about 89 ohms to make the 75 ohm spdif output pad, but 300//100 should work pretty well as well. I used all 75 ohm hardware including the bnc connectors themselves and I could hear a difference I thought.
Finally a larger power transformer (50VA) did make a very subtle difference.
You would be surprised at the sort of things that make a difference. I recommend going back to the very early part of the thread as there is a great deal of information about getting it to work right, and Peter spent a long time figuring out how to get the best out of this hardware, follow his advice closely and it would be hard to get a bad result.
It took about 100hrs of use and tinkering to get it sounding right and while I still prefer SACD, LP or tape to CD, this is about the best CD sound I have ever had. (I had a PS Audio Lambda Drive which was pretty close in terms of sonics, but it died of old age a couple of years ago, so no direct comparison was possible.)
Erik van Voorst said:First I think it has to be determined if you are listening/judging the transport or a total cdplayer (you use a dac)...
You can ONLY modify the transport if you know what your old transport sounded like in your set-up or if you make a decision that your dac in your system is a bit referential or a component that will stay unmodified in your system... only then you have a structured path to follow so you can tune the new component (transport) to your liking........STEP BY STEP....give it more time....!!
Use your own ears... advice is hardly to be given since everybody's set-up is different ..let alone their taste (and priorities)...
If you want to know my personal opinion I would say that a mix of copper and wood...tunes the transport to my liking...and is furthermore beneficial for adressing technical solutions ...
One of my recent listening experiences is that the encasing establishes a much higher resolution...
Just to give a response...
Erik - thanks for the reply.... right now i am listening to the analogue output of the transport.... simply because i have sold out my dac... so until i make a new one i am stuck to the analogue out... BUT! what my problem seems to be is a new psu and also a copper under the mechanism.... i moded those two together and moved form the regular psu from the boombox to the Peter suggestion (or what i could make out of it to be exact - could not find the exact diodes so i put there MR914 ... also some values and types of the BG's are not correct - as i said i made the best of it .... )... right now it seems to me that the sound is not that relaxed and not that good "flowing" like it was when the transport was using stock psu and was mounted on 10mm mdf board....
so i asked did anyone had similar problem - and right now i am considering to try to mount the mechanism first on the massive chunk of real wood and under it to put some copper i made to make it even more heavy... this is in consideration...
although the situation seems to be improving while the BG's are burning in - maybe i am trying to turned down the fire that really only exists in my head..... will really have to wait for the BG's to fully burn in - right now the are on 75 hours or so.....
dzuvela said:
dzuvela - my mail is mukihrATyahoo.com an we can discuss further and more quickly over the mail - or i am "sparkle" on audiofil forum and also --muki-- on ACCO forum..... (best to try the mail or ACCO forum - that where i am the most active - also i am here often)
to answer you question... the transport is looking like this right now - i only lifted the copper together with the transport and put under it (between mdf and copper) that batheroom floor rubber - i assume you know what i am talking about) and it seems to me that the sound improved ... not that alot but it improved.... before the foam material the sound was a bit nervous, treble was a bit "screaming"... it was not relaxed and good to listen to... it made me nervous... with the foam material the sound is on the edge to be nervous but it isn't ...
i have to try the real wood plate and copper under it... maybe that would be better.....naturally - after the BG's fully burn in .....
kevinkr said:
my "hunk of metal" is entirely made out of copper with bronze "legs" to support the mechanism - two of them diagonally placed - i have read Peter's files for converting the transport..... but - it is hard to be exactly like Peter's since i can't use that same materials he had and keep the costs low and also i do not have the machinery he has and to keep the costs low is also m priority so i guess that like everybody, i will have to have my own way how to do it having those things in the back of my mind - like Erik said - only I can modify the transport - and that is o.k. - i will only add that also only i have to modify it and try to make the best out of what i have and can find for low or no price ;D
right now i am experimenting to find what suits the best for me - wood, cooper - copper, wood... bronze etc... ... and also searching for experiences to narrow the search if possible.....
BTW. thanks for those infos related your mod's
I know why you are pretty sure...there are simple LAWS agreeing on that.......................................
........................but your EARS are a completely different ballgame and it is not even of any importance if they are wrong or right for that matter because in the end it all comes down to what sound you like...... your sound.
BTW.
I am quite happy (understatement) with a simular coupling as Peter (in the end) and Kevinr have.
........................but your EARS are a completely different ballgame and it is not even of any importance if they are wrong or right for that matter because in the end it all comes down to what sound you like...... your sound.
BTW.
I am quite happy (understatement) with a simular coupling as Peter (in the end) and Kevinr have.
I agree. I believe that part of music reproduction takes place in the world of the very small where quantum mechanics takes over from classical mechanics. This opens the door to the possibility of the observer having an effect on the observed. This may very well mean that what works for you might not work for me without either of us being "wrong" or "right". And then there are personal preferences which vary from person to person. If hard suspension degrades the sound in your perception, then soft suspension may be the way to go for you.
These last few weeks I have been enjoying the transport a lot with a 7808-based PSU as the only mod. Yesterday I removed all unnecessary capacitors and common mode choke in one go. As there's no A-B comparison possible, I'm unsure what this did to the sound. It certainly didn't degrade it, maybe some more clarity and low level detail retrieval.
These last few weeks I have been enjoying the transport a lot with a 7808-based PSU as the only mod. Yesterday I removed all unnecessary capacitors and common mode choke in one go. As there's no A-B comparison possible, I'm unsure what this did to the sound. It certainly didn't degrade it, maybe some more clarity and low level detail retrieval.
dzuvela said:
I am using a half meter of Apogee 75 ohm word clock coax - works well, have tried longer lengths in other cables and overall prefer this one.
My mechanism is directly coupled to the subchassis which is also directly coupled to the base, and the base is decoupled from the rest of world via some vibrapods.