None of you guys really even attempted to express an opinion if investing 10.000 Euro ($11.3K USD) in a speaker kit without first trying to hear the design is a good idea, which is the subject of this thread. I would not. Would you??
This seems to be CF's idea. Show me where I've ever said anything of the sort. The post that seems to have started this subtext is #191 and I never once suggested a separation of groups, nor have I ever. I simply gave my opinion and CF can't come to terms with that and like a dog with a bone, won't let it go.
Not EU10k, but I have spent large sums on drivers before, often on no more than recommendations or some measurements posted online because I may have no, or little experience in the type or model of drivers I might need to complete the project. Often they don't work out and can't be sold to recoup the costs involved, especially the shipping to here and local taxes. And I've been doing this for a long time. One example; I bought the first BMS4590s to come south of the equator (as told to me by BMS) at the time and they cost me with shipping and the insane customs fees I had to pay at the time, about 2.5x what they would have cost a US resident in equivalent $.
Would I spend that sort of money on a kit? Maybe, but not likely, unless it was close to what I would have designed myself and the kit got me substantial savings over buying the parts individually. Or it got excellent reviews from someone whos opinion I trust enough to take that sort of punt on.
Well I certainly will. Does this include drivers, crossovers and cabinets?? That to me is a ridiculous amount of money for any kit. And simply not necessary to get a good sounding pair of speakers.
If you do your own design work you don't get to hear them until they are essentially complete. So that said I don't put that much weight on having to hear a pair before I build. You have to take a leap of faith so to speak.
Rob 🙂
Hello Brett
I didn't take it that way. You were just saying what you do is all. We should all go for a beer and stop splitting hairs
Rob 🙂
Do it yourself. It's pretty self explanatory really. Everything we build has parts that we didn't build. The plywood or MDF, did you build that? The screws, did you make those? Probably not. The glue, did you make that? No? OK. So it's not truly DIY unless you make every part yourself? Hardly. It comes down to a matter of degree. I personally design AND build my projects, others build from a kit but someday they may want to try their hands at designing a speaker. It's the next step up in this DIY speaker world. It's all DIY. Anyone saying it's not DIY because you didn't design it I would ask did you design and build the drivers?
I would never spend $10,000.00 on a set of speakers period. For me there is a hard stop at about $4000.00 and at that price they had better be the best speakers I have ever heard.
Well , everybody knows that the type of screws and glue and MDF you use make or break the design so yes even an assembled KIT is your design and you own that sound you're getting 🙂 It really doesn't matter who designs the kit as long as it measures decently. I mean the hole is the hole and they all have the same features.
I'm thinking we agree, but the words come out wrong.
For example, you said:
Maybe you meant to say: DIY is about building speakers AND/OR designing them.
I have designed a lot of loudspeakers. They made me stop building them 2 decades ago — because Chris did a way better way faster, and forbade me :^)
I’m pretty sure i am a diyer.
dave
I’m pretty sure i am a diyer.
dave
I think that I covered that in the next sentence where I said:
"Who designs the speaker is irrelevant. It could be the builder, but it could just as easily be someone else."
Yes, but what if I design the speaker, design the crossover, then get a carpenter/tech to build and assemble it? I think that still includes DIY.
3D printing is also going to take some of it away. We'll still design and draw.
3D printing is also going to take some of it away. We'll still design and draw.
Absolutely that is DIY. The main point is to create something that is an alternative to a commercially manufactured product. There are many ways to get there and to divide up the tasks involved.
I do everything apart from the carpentry. I think folks who do nothing but buy a kit with readymade enclosures and bolt it all together are also DIY. The 'I' DIY is for 'it', but it is not specified what 'it' refers to.This is a hobby, we're not researching enlightenment or immortality. Really does not need so many teeth and nails.
Let's leave the nails for our enclosures.
Well put Sangram. My thoughts exactly; there’s a lot of “its” to “DIY” when it comes to speaker building. Nobody wants to see this thread get endlessly recursive to the point that one has to have designed their own loudspeaker design software or harvested and milled their own wood for the enclosure for it to be truly DIY (though some have done those very things).
I believe there could be different levels to D'ing IY. While some people copy commercial designs (clone), some others get a "kit" and a small portion chooses to do it all on their own i.e. specify, analyse, design, build, test / iterate, finalise and even document it. For example, I might prefer to copy (vs. designing myself), as acoustics, clearly, is not my field of expertise.
I have been researching immortality but not making much progress. I think I'll put more effort into building speakers for awhile, just in case i don't have much time left.