One done - listening now.
What a difference! Much clearer, gone is the cheap radio sound. Very pleased I am!
Now THIS is a great midrange!
A bit tricky getting the recess deep enough - almost 2mm deeper. Driver is a perfect fit though, even the screw holes line up.
I'll get the other one done tomorrow.
What a difference! Much clearer, gone is the cheap radio sound. Very pleased I am!
Now THIS is a great midrange!
A bit tricky getting the recess deep enough - almost 2mm deeper. Driver is a perfect fit though, even the screw holes line up.
I'll get the other one done tomorrow.
Yep you have to get that important mid range right.It's good to hear the Vifas gave you the desired improvement.MJL21193 said:
The Vifa P and M mids were very nice drivers , great for the ears, they will be sadly missed. Good to see that have the PL series as a compromise though. 😎
Shame to hear those original mids didn't quite work out. Glad to hear these are much better though; its a range of mids I looked at myself (despite already having HM100Z0 drivers, i'm becoming increasingly paranoid about damaging them!). A case of good specs matching a good sound 🙂
Hi John, not spoke to you in while. Hope all is well - certainly sounds like it is 🙂
Congrats on the driver choice. The Vifa's PL, as far as drivers go, are near legendary. They're an easy driver to work with and give great results with a minimum of fuss.
The last speaker I heard using them was the Earthworks Sigma and featured the PL17 along with the Vifa XT25 tweeter. The sound was superb to my ears. And they cost £2000 so you got a bargain there.
Congrats on the driver choice. The Vifa's PL, as far as drivers go, are near legendary. They're an easy driver to work with and give great results with a minimum of fuss.
The last speaker I heard using them was the Earthworks Sigma and featured the PL17 along with the Vifa XT25 tweeter. The sound was superb to my ears. And they cost £2000 so you got a bargain there.
F1 FAN said:
Hi F1,
It's like night and day, the difference to my ears.
This is my first real 3-way, and I made the mistake of not paying enough attention to the midrange, assuming the Max was good enough. I didn't even test it's frequency response.
Lesson learned.
Andy Graddon said:
Hi Andy,
This is my second Vifa PL driver - I have two PL18's in a pair of TL boxes. These drivers are outstanding.
I also have an older pair of P13's in rear surround speakers. Excellent drivers.
Dr.EM said:
Hi Dr.EM,
How are things going? Get your DOZ working?
From all accounts, the Audax is a great mid, though I haven't heard them.
I have the same paranoia - one slip with the screw driver...
ShinOBIWAN said:
Hi Ant,
Good to hear from you and congratulations on your ascension to the peerage
Everything is A-OK here. 🙂I haven't heard the XT25, how does it compare to the Scanspeak R2904/7000? I see it's about 1/10 the price. I can't say that I heard the extra cost of the revelator in comparison to it's lesser siblings ( I have the D2905/9300 in this speaker). But then, I can't hear above about 12K anymore anyway. Smooth response is the important thing for me.
I think I've got a winning combination now. Further changes coming though: I'll be taking a look at the active amp and may change the slope of the woofer/midrange cross to 12db/octave, but I'll need to take some more measurements first.
I have put the other mid in this morning and I'm listening while I type this (at pretty high volume 😉 ). A change well worth doing.
I have also started the centre speaker that will match these (in style anyway). I have studied Tony Gee's USB and ran a few simulations in Unibox to come up with a high performance design.
I will treat the interior in the same way as the midrange chambers are done on the mains. This seems to work very well.
Here's the body, put together with glue and airgun nails. Front curve was layed out with a thin wood strip bent around a centre pivot. Only one brace as this box is small and the panels don't have wide spans.
Material is 3/4" cabinet grade plywood.
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Hi Ant,
Good to hear from you and congratulations on your ascension to the peerage
Thanks, I think. 😉
Not much in it TBH. If the your wanting a 2Khz or slightly lower crossover then I'd look at the R29 as its better in absolute terms. Problem is the ridiculous price.
Sounds good John. I'll keep checking back every now and then to see things develop. Oh, BTW, when do the surround start? 🙂
ShinOBIWAN said:
That's about what I figured for the difference. Thought I'd ask you since you have first hand knowledge.
Retail here for the XT25 is $48.00; $400 for the SS.
The rear surrounds are already built. See here for details. I will be veneering these eventually though. The Baltic birch plywood has a reasonable grain pattern, but the surface veneer has minute cracks in it, so I'd like to improve upon this.
I have started to put the baffle on. It'll be three layers of 1/2" MDF, which will make it a bit thicker than the baffles on the mains.
I should have cut and glued in the styrofoam wedges before I put the front on, but I didn't want to wait. Besides, the front will need to dry over night before I can finish it with the final layer of MDF. In the meantime I'll cut the wedges, ready to glue in when I cut out the speaker hole.
Here it is with the first layer glued and screwed on. I used #8 x 2" screws and LOTS of yellow carpenters glue.
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ShinOBIWAN said:
THE driver of choice for lower x-o points is the Seas 27TDFC or 27TBFC.
The XT25 is a very neutral tweeter, but you have to be very careful because it doesn't like doing anything at its Fs. Big LRC and steep slopes are required. It is normally crossed around 3k or above despite is low Fs.
Andy Graddon said:
I'd have to agree for sane money but John asked for a quick comparison and since I've used the XT25 and R29 I gave my opinion.
Andy Graddon said:
I can resist, for that price. 🙂
The Seas 27TDFC looks like a nice tweeter, with specs very similar to the SS 9300 I have. A lot less money too.
I added the second layer of MDF to the baffle. Just glue holds it. Lots of glue. Notice in the pic the squeeze out.
I have cut these pieces bigger to trim down to the final size. I should be able to put the third layer on later tonight.
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Wow you are progressing quickly.Lookin good.
Im using the metal dome version the 27TBFC and it is a graet sounding tweeter.MJL21193 said:
MJL21193 said:
now you should truly appreciate the fun in constructing these.
http://members.optusnet.com.au/~gradds55/ARGOS/windswept.htm
F1 FAN said:
Thanks, I move fast when motivated.
I used the 19TAF on my surrounds, and found this to be a very good tweeter. I don't have a problem with metal dome tweeters.
Andy Graddon said:
Works of art Andy - Beautiful.
What did you use for the sides? Multiple layers of thin stock (hardboard?). My curves are not nearly as extreme, so a bit easier.
MJL21193 said:
The 27TBFC is the metal dome to use when you aren't sure you want a metal dome. very nice tweeter.
multiple layers of 3mm mdf with mdf painted on both faces, then squished and squeezed . The amount of oozed glue was amazing !!!
I just finished gluing the last layer of MDF. Now it has time to dry overnight and I can work on it tomorrow.
Design:
I used Unibox to determine the best box size and port tuning. Given this drivers low VAS and low Qts, a small vented box is the best alignment. Tuning could have been lower, but this being a centre speaker, low bass is not critical.Detail of the box design shown below.
I like the layout of the front baffle on Tony Gee's USB, with the driver in the middle and the ports on either side of it. I will do the same here. I will use 1 1/2" ABS drain pipe for the ports. Glue these in with epoxy and afterwards route where it meets the face with a round over cutter.
Crossover is a direct copy of the USB's, a series filter with few components.
I'll have plenty to do tomorrow, including the possibility of a listen. 🙂
Design:
I used Unibox to determine the best box size and port tuning. Given this drivers low VAS and low Qts, a small vented box is the best alignment. Tuning could have been lower, but this being a centre speaker, low bass is not critical.Detail of the box design shown below.
I like the layout of the front baffle on Tony Gee's USB, with the driver in the middle and the ports on either side of it. I will do the same here. I will use 1 1/2" ABS drain pipe for the ports. Glue these in with epoxy and afterwards route where it meets the face with a round over cutter.
Crossover is a direct copy of the USB's, a series filter with few components.
I'll have plenty to do tomorrow, including the possibility of a listen. 🙂
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curved laminated faces,
drain pipe for ports,
series x-o.
sounds like something I might build. 😎
you is learning, friend !!! 😀
drain pipe for ports,
series x-o.
sounds like something I might build. 😎
you is learning, friend !!! 😀
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