Hi Chris8sirhC - I don't recall anyone having that problem. I'd be interested to learn more.
~Don
~Don
I did a KEF B139 tapped pipe (no taper) for Al (pinkmouse) that simmed fine based on the assumption at that point in the thread where it would be XO'd at the first deep null, but its performance was abysmal, nothing like the sim and he was going to try to find out why, but then he disappeared from the thread.........
http://www.diyaudio.com/forums/sear...esults&searchid=1163848874&sortby=&sortorder=
GM
http://www.diyaudio.com/forums/sear...esults&searchid=1163848874&sortby=&sortorder=
GM
These Tapped Horns tend to be long ... too long to fit into a car. This morning, I played around with Cowan's (and MikeHunt79's) design, and came up with a fold that makes it a little more convenient.
This one will fit into your trunk, or your back seat. Is this something that appeals to you?
This one will fit into your trunk, or your back seat. Is this something that appeals to you?
Attachments
I'd rather see a smallish car-TH, for European-size cars...
Something build around a commonly availible 8"driver or so? Or maybe even smaller...
Paul
Something build around a commonly availible 8"driver or so? Or maybe even smaller...
Paul
Don Snyder said:
While I would have no trouble fitting the folded design in my trunk, the flare rate would need to be changed to avoid the use of heavy EQ due to the cabin gain. Anybody want to tweak this for a falling response below ~60Hz?
I'm trying to make a portable tapped horn, that's all ...
Most are using them for HT, and moving them isn't a problem. Others may want to move them, and don't want to have to rent a truck.
Most are using them for HT, and moving them isn't a problem. Others may want to move them, and don't want to have to rent a truck.
An externally hosted image should be here but it was not working when we last tested it.
This is my TH with a cheap 5 inch driver.
It can play loud enough to rattle the mirror inside the car.
Cheers Johannes.
6 for me.
# 1-4:
30m away the garage doors were shaking. 😀
2xB&C 15PS100, 2xSPH450TC
#5+6 are the same folding as SPH450TC but this time with the B&C 15PS100
The 15PS100 have more attac and detail, as the big SPH450TC have.
@ Mavo:
I wouldn´t do heavy 18 inch drivers from the experiences I made.
(as Horst says)
4 th in one romm is nice (for acoutics), don´t be scared of to less spl with 4x15.
Two of the B&C are able to demolish a 100m² livingroom with nearly 4m high ceiling.
Michael
Driver suitable for Tapped Horn?
Guys. I've spent a few days reading this whole thread...
WOW...so much good information. Since I'm terrible with the math and simulation part...I was wondering if I could ask for a little help...
Will this driver work well in a tapped horn?
I've got two of these 10" drivers that were formerly in Fitsmaurice horns, and would like to re-purpose them for 2 tapped horns, if possible. I'm looking fo max efficiency from 30 hz to 120 Hz, If I can get that full two octaves. I'll be folding it like the fold that was just shown in Don's post, so I can travel with it from gig to gig.
Resonant Frequency (fs) 44Hz
DC Resistance (Re) 3.70
Coil Inductance (Le) 1.60
Mechanical Q (Qms) 2.80
Electromagnetic Q (Qes) .32
Total Q (Qts) .29
Compliance Equivalent Volume (Vas) 19.8 liters / 0.7 cu. ft.
Peak Diaphragm Displacement Volume (Vd) 372cc
Mechanical Compliance of Suspension (Cms) 0.13mm/N
BL Product (BL) 18.3 T-M
Diaphragm Mass inc. Airload (Mms) 109 grams
Efficiency Bandwidth Product (EBP)136
Maximum Linear Excursion (Xmax) 11.1mm
Surface Area of Cone (Sd) 334.5 cm2
Maximum Mechanical Limit (Xlim) 22mm
Guys. I've spent a few days reading this whole thread...
WOW...so much good information. Since I'm terrible with the math and simulation part...I was wondering if I could ask for a little help...
Will this driver work well in a tapped horn?
I've got two of these 10" drivers that were formerly in Fitsmaurice horns, and would like to re-purpose them for 2 tapped horns, if possible. I'm looking fo max efficiency from 30 hz to 120 Hz, If I can get that full two octaves. I'll be folding it like the fold that was just shown in Don's post, so I can travel with it from gig to gig.
Resonant Frequency (fs) 44Hz
DC Resistance (Re) 3.70
Coil Inductance (Le) 1.60
Mechanical Q (Qms) 2.80
Electromagnetic Q (Qes) .32
Total Q (Qts) .29
Compliance Equivalent Volume (Vas) 19.8 liters / 0.7 cu. ft.
Peak Diaphragm Displacement Volume (Vd) 372cc
Mechanical Compliance of Suspension (Cms) 0.13mm/N
BL Product (BL) 18.3 T-M
Diaphragm Mass inc. Airload (Mms) 109 grams
Efficiency Bandwidth Product (EBP)136
Maximum Linear Excursion (Xmax) 11.1mm
Surface Area of Cone (Sd) 334.5 cm2
Maximum Mechanical Limit (Xlim) 22mm
Hi DonSnyder.
Simulation and measurement of the small (400l) B&C tappedhorns can be seen here: (sorry, only german, but the pictures say it all)
http://www.miwis-bastelbu.de/Galerien/quattrostagioni/index.html
Measurement was done with driver out of the box, now it is burned in and response reaches a little bit deeper. They are running in my living room and I´m very pleased with their performance.
The bigger ones in front with the 18inch drivers have approx 550l.
Simulation with the SPH450TC got lost.
But now they are changed a bit and are working with some more B&C 15PS100 like this:
We made this for a friend of mine.
The 15inch now delievers more detail compared to the 18s.
They still have more spl than you´ll ever need in a living room and they keep up with the speed an dynamics of the mains very well, wether if played loud or very quiet.
All speakers are DSP controlled and got a bit EQ to flatten the response of the tapped horns (especially the first peaks).
They all are filtered with 24dB/oct @ 60Hz
Michael
Simulation and measurement of the small (400l) B&C tappedhorns can be seen here: (sorry, only german, but the pictures say it all)
http://www.miwis-bastelbu.de/Galerien/quattrostagioni/index.html
Measurement was done with driver out of the box, now it is burned in and response reaches a little bit deeper. They are running in my living room and I´m very pleased with their performance.
The bigger ones in front with the 18inch drivers have approx 550l.
Simulation with the SPH450TC got lost.
But now they are changed a bit and are working with some more B&C 15PS100 like this:
An externally hosted image should be here but it was not working when we last tested it.
We made this for a friend of mine.
The 15inch now delievers more detail compared to the 18s.
They still have more spl than you´ll ever need in a living room and they keep up with the speed an dynamics of the mains very well, wether if played loud or very quiet.
An externally hosted image should be here but it was not working when we last tested it.
All speakers are DSP controlled and got a bit EQ to flatten the response of the tapped horns (especially the first peaks).
They all are filtered with 24dB/oct @ 60Hz
Michael
Thanks Michael, you do beautiful work. It amazes me that outside our DIY circle, no one seems to know about these incredible cabinets.
Thanks again for the report!
~Don
If quality and originality made people take notice, Danley would be one of the big hitters in audio.
Thanks again for the report!
~Don
If quality and originality made people take notice, Danley would be one of the big hitters in audio.
Yeah, I tried to introduce simple pipe horns and THs on an HT forum awhile back and nobody posted, but it's a hotbed of low efficiency, mega excursion/power reflex boxes tuned to ~20-25 Hz.........
Apparently, bragging rights as to who has the most inefficient sub system while not really going particularly low or loud is the goal. There are of course those with multiple driver IBs and the low tuned EBS alignments I've used for decades are finally starting to flourish, though they call it something else to make it seem different, but mostly, SBS and similar products rule even in $$$ dedicated HTs. Heck, I basically got run off one HT forum for repeatedly recommending adhering to DD/DTS/THX room layout and SPL reference, etc. specs for dedicated HTs. One dude even accused me of being a THX 'plant' to hawk 'overpriced' THX approved gear.
Oh well, their loss.
GM
Apparently, bragging rights as to who has the most inefficient sub system while not really going particularly low or loud is the goal. There are of course those with multiple driver IBs and the low tuned EBS alignments I've used for decades are finally starting to flourish, though they call it something else to make it seem different, but mostly, SBS and similar products rule even in $$$ dedicated HTs. Heck, I basically got run off one HT forum for repeatedly recommending adhering to DD/DTS/THX room layout and SPL reference, etc. specs for dedicated HTs. One dude even accused me of being a THX 'plant' to hawk 'overpriced' THX approved gear.
Oh well, their loss.
GM
Re: Driver suitable for Tapped Horn?
Nifty driver, what brand/model is it?
Yes, it's suitable for TH apps, but a conic is so small at 76.789 L/2.7118 ft^3 net that you're probably going to have a hard time squeezing a 10" into it.
If you're as serious about max efficiency as you say you are though, then an expo has considerably more (shadow response), though of course it's much larger at 599.496 L/21.171 ft^3 net.
Hmm, after I did these I noticed they are for band use rather than corner loaded in a room, so they will be ~10 dB lower just sitting on a stage, though you'll gain ~6 dB back if stacked and parallel wired.
GM
myoung1999 said:
Nifty driver, what brand/model is it?
Yes, it's suitable for TH apps, but a conic is so small at 76.789 L/2.7118 ft^3 net that you're probably going to have a hard time squeezing a 10" into it.
If you're as serious about max efficiency as you say you are though, then an expo has considerably more (shadow response), though of course it's much larger at 599.496 L/21.171 ft^3 net.
Hmm, after I did these I noticed they are for band use rather than corner loaded in a room, so they will be ~10 dB lower just sitting on a stage, though you'll gain ~6 dB back if stacked and parallel wired.
GM
Attachments
Thanks very much for the calcs GM.
I love the response curve of the Larger (approx 21 cu ft) Tapped horn. That's one of the best looking response curves I've seen, and will easily cover the 30hz to 120hz range.
Can you refer me to another part of the thread that has the correct representation of exactly what each measurement (s1, s2 s3, etc...) is for?
And of course, i'd need the details on how to get the flare correct..
I promise to do the final work of actually creating the cabinet design, and i'll post it here for everyone's reference.
The driver, by the way, is the discontinued Eminenece HL10C.
Parts express still has them in stock, and as I said, I've got two currently mounted in Bill Fitsmaurice tuba 24s.
These two tapped horns will be driven by a crown CTS 2000 amp.
I've got a pair of the EAW LA212s for tops. So, It should make for a very nice sounding system. I'm a DJ who does care very much about the quality of the sound...not just quantity. And the Top 40 Music keeps using lower and lower frequencies as fundamental parts of the music. I've measured pop rap music with frequencies as low as 28hz! That's not easy to reproduce well, and I'm not willing to carry around enough reflex boxes to get any decent output at those frequencies.
I love the response curve of the Larger (approx 21 cu ft) Tapped horn. That's one of the best looking response curves I've seen, and will easily cover the 30hz to 120hz range.
Can you refer me to another part of the thread that has the correct representation of exactly what each measurement (s1, s2 s3, etc...) is for?
And of course, i'd need the details on how to get the flare correct..
I promise to do the final work of actually creating the cabinet design, and i'll post it here for everyone's reference.
The driver, by the way, is the discontinued Eminenece HL10C.
Parts express still has them in stock, and as I said, I've got two currently mounted in Bill Fitsmaurice tuba 24s.
These two tapped horns will be driven by a crown CTS 2000 amp.
I've got a pair of the EAW LA212s for tops. So, It should make for a very nice sounding system. I'm a DJ who does care very much about the quality of the sound...not just quantity. And the Top 40 Music keeps using lower and lower frequencies as fundamental parts of the music. I've measured pop rap music with frequencies as low as 28hz! That's not easy to reproduce well, and I'm not willing to carry around enough reflex boxes to get any decent output at those frequencies.