Stop wasting $ and time. You now will have built two cabinets that will not give you solid 40hz performance.
Btw I have nothing against the ss15 at all. I had two loaded with eminence 3015lf. GREAT for a 50lb cabinet. Not so great for 30hz and up bass.
I didn't include it or many others in the list because you mentioned 40hz was a must.
Btw I have nothing against the ss15 at all. I had two loaded with eminence 3015lf. GREAT for a 50lb cabinet. Not so great for 30hz and up bass.
I didn't include it or many others in the list because you mentioned 40hz was a must.
I hope so. We actually have someone who is interested in buying the Titan39. An electronic drummer friend of mine who likes likes the 50-70hz punch of it. My brother will probably be compensated about a dollar an hour for the time he put into building it, but he learned a lot and he doesn't regret it.
Here is my 17 year old brothers logic:
He got the used Eminence 15LF-2 for about $50 dollars. A sheet of plywood and the other things needed will another $50 dollars. So for just $100 dollars we hope to have something that is hopefully better than the Titan39.
We have someone who will hopefully pay us $350 for the Titan39, which we will in turn used to possible buy some Eminence LAB12's. Then, with my brothers increased cabinet building skills, very likely bang out a set of your PAL12's.
Then we will rock!!!! Have patience mRgSr, we are learning fast.
I just don't want to see you wasting $ and time. For any project, plan it out first and try to stick to that plan. Obviously small changes will be made along the way, but with any build it costs less to have a well spelled out plan before jumping in.
Just trying to give you my experience from all this stuff.
Just trying to give you my experience from all this stuff.
Well, happy to help out. Marketing is part of every industry, just have to know what is actually important.
I had the infinity 1260w in hornresp, so I ran some sims vs. my subs model. The single infinity in 3 cubes gross (estimated overall cab volume, internal volume plus port = 63L) tuned to 35hz on 600w will do 120 db @ 1m, while one of my subs does 123 db @ 1m on 900w, both at nominal xmax, 2pi space (on flat ground outside). My sub is about 1.5 db more sensitive in the model. Strap two of the infinity's together in a 2x12 though, and you get 126 db off 1200w at xmax. Figure a cabinet about 30"x15" front face with 24" depth, with a large slot port. Both of these are with my preferred response curve, which is a peak around 40 hz, with a normal steep ported rolloff below that (still effective to 35hz or below) and roughly 3 db/oct decrease above 40hz. Granted, these are sims and real world compression will blunt the peak at full output.
The infinity's seem like a very good deal for the price, but I haven't used them myself so I can't speak to their durability or sound quality. I'm also modeling a design that sees xmax at double their rated RMS power, which may prove questionable for sustained PA use. A nu3000 may not be enough power to comfortably drive a pair of 2 ohm cabs, I think a nu6000 with two 2x12 with the dual voice coil 1262's wired for a 4 ohm load in each cab would be better.
For $130 in drivers plus materials you could build one 12x2 to try it out, and it would definitely be worth good money to someone as a car audio sub if you don't like it.
Also keep in mind that this design will work well with the Lab12, although the infinity sims with a slightly lower extension and better output, probably because of a fractionally larger surface area and heavier driver cone.
And also, the lab12 is available in a 12c version which is 4 ohms, think this could be easier to match to most amps.
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The Lab 12C has a DC resistance of only 3.11 ohms.
Most alignments, including bass reflex, will have impedence minima very close to the DCR, so a pair in parallel (1.6 ohms) would be "challenging" for a two ohm capable amp.
unless you got a beast mode amp and series wired them... not that 80 volts should be considered "extremely high output"
If you're using 1/0 guage speaker cable, short runs and soldered connectors all the way to the drivers, perhaps.
In real life, I don't think there should be much to worry about.
Some of us here wish our projects returned $1 per hour, many times it is just expensive firewood. 😕
If you are going to have 2 systems I recommend investing in some (better) powered tops. They are handy for the ceremony and quicker to set up, get the best that will fit in your car.
Not all venues/weddings need a huge sound system, a set of (decent) mains can cover a large room IMO, especially when corner loaded.
Be sure to factor in good wireless mics and lighting into the budget.
What brands of tops would you recommend? QSC is right here in Orange County and I have seen some people using those and they sounded really nice. Our EV tops sound pretty good right now, but I could see us needing something bigger at some point, and the powered ones would be a lot easier to deal with.
My brother wants to try to build some of the BFM tops, but I have seen some mixed reviews of the piezo tweeters that are used in those, so I am not so sure. Thanks.
Hey, thanks for all that info. My brother is pretty excited about this idea, and it looks like he may try to build just a single one to test it out. If it doesn't work for PA, he says he won't have a problem selling it for home or auto use. There isn't any difference between the 1260w and the 1262w except the impedance, is there?
He finished gluing the SS15 yesterday and is going to mount the speaker today. I am going to go check it out tomorrow. He was in a real good mood when he called me yesterday, said he had a big surprise for me! Usually whenever he surprises me it isn't good, so we will see whats up. Thanks for your help.
That Infinity 12" driver with its 2" voice coil is going to be running into power compression way before 600W. 300W is its RMS rating.
Your Choice of tops should be determined by how you intend to use them.
Sub or no sub?
If you intend to transport a sub go for a smaller set of tops. I like the size/weight/sound of my RCF 10" speakers. I sold most of my 12" and 15" boxes after getting them.
Speakers like the JBL PRX 710, QSC K10 and Yamaha DXR10 powered tops will require subs for the bottom octaves but are considered good values. Consider what you get, (amps/processing/warranty/compact size/weight) they can cover fairly large crowds 200+ (from 85hz hz up) and still don't look too out of place in smaller rooms. Louder boxes like the EV ZX5/Yamaha DSR or DIY multidriver + processing systems may be overkill for most weddings, you will also need a trailer full of subs to complement them.
A small system like like the EV ZX1 should fit in a sedan. Some DIY subs and set of QSC K8's would also.
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Soo.....I stated as such in my post:
The eminence lab12's have a 2-1/2" voice coil. My 15" HO's have a 2-1/2" VC, and I've sent them over 1000w each and driven them past xmax.
My design is also intended to accommodate for port compression and thermal compression, due to the peak at 40hz and ample air flow of the bracing configuration. Due to port compression (even though the port is very high flow) the peak will be blunted a bit at full output vs. the model. The cabinets are not stuffed and the bracing is inline with the air flow in the cab, so there is plenty of air cooling going on. As long as you don't have a badly clipping amp (set limiters) and aren't sending high power test tones at the tuning frequency (cone not moving), they should be fine.
http://www.qsc.com/files/5813/8012/1867/QSC_RSB-212_Spec_Sheet.pdf
Uh oh art, looks like qsc thinks they can do your box t half the size, and still maintain extension down to 30 hz at 96 db sensitivity LOL.
Uh oh art, looks like qsc thinks they can do your box t half the size, and still maintain extension down to 30 hz at 96 db sensitivity LOL.
Well, 2.83v in to 3 ohms is 2.7 watts, so one watt one meter is around 93 dB at some frequency, probably 1000 Hz 🙄.
Speaker cones look like Lab 12s, but use 3" rather than 2.5" voice coils.
Well, since you're already building a SS-15, if it's still not low enough there is a good chance 30 Hz is what you're after. I would go for an 18" tapped horn that does 30 Hz and up, I think something like the TH-18 is what you're looking for.
The Eminence Lab 12 was designed to be used per two, so 2 x 2.5 inch voice coil per cabinet. I've a Infinity 1260 laying at home and it's not a PA-driver, but I think it's a great substitute for the Lab 12 as long as it's used at home and say a 300 W amplifier.
I've gone the route of small band pass enclosures for PA and a 2" VC is just not gonna cut it. Either use a big voice coil driver in a small enclosure or a huge enclosure to make it with just 300 W.
Best regards Johan
If you're used to inexpensive store-bought subs, you'll probably think the SS15 goes down plenty low. Many advertize 35 or 40 Hz, but the real low end on an 18 from GC or the like is about 50 Hz. You've got to step up to at least JBL *S*RX (not some other letter in front of the RX) to get a real 40 Hz that won't excusrion limit at 200 watts. At that point, TH18's don't look too bad in terms of cubic footage, cubic dollars or cubic kilowatts of amplifier. I'm a 30 Hz guy (20 Hz in the home system), and four TH18 is working just fine for my DJ rig. I've used direct radiating 18's and the distortion is too high. The labhorn system is just overkill, but nice to have when needed. Horn loaded KP15LF2's worked well, had less distortion and had all the output required, but ran into thermal distress too often. The TH18 loaded with a beefy driver means you'll never have to worry about blowing a sub. For a real professional-sounding rig they will be hard to beat for many years. You may be fine with two, but 4 ensures there's enough oomph that they won't be constantly complaing and wanting you to turn it up with clip lights already flashing.
The big draw for the use of SS15's is their size and price. They'll blow away cheap plastic cased garbage, as well as many undersized horns like the T39 and virtually all $500 reflex 1x18's. The form factor is easy on a 1-man operation. To get stupid loud, just add more. And each one isn't that heavy. They just don't go really low, but if you look at what many DJs are using they are quite competitive.
The big draw for the use of SS15's is their size and price. They'll blow away cheap plastic cased garbage, as well as many undersized horns like the T39 and virtually all $500 reflex 1x18's. The form factor is easy on a 1-man operation. To get stupid loud, just add more. And each one isn't that heavy. They just don't go really low, but if you look at what many DJs are using they are quite competitive.
That is about the most complete, concise, accurate wrap up of the ss15 I've seen posted... well done.
SS15's coupled with peavey DSP IPR's with maxxbass for the high pass sound much deeper than they really go. Yes, they are a rock-n-roll sub, not an EDM or DNB type of sub. However with the maxxbass you can 'fake it'
SS15's coupled with peavey DSP IPR's with maxxbass for the high pass sound much deeper than they really go. Yes, they are a rock-n-roll sub, not an EDM or DNB type of sub. However with the maxxbass you can 'fake it'
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