Hi Peter,
Great work. Just measured my Stages. Horizontal dimensions are 67 and 54cm, height 95cm.
Best regards
Great work. Just measured my Stages. Horizontal dimensions are 67 and 54cm, height 95cm.
Best regards
Hi Damic....
Thanks for the info. I'll ponder a while about how to dress these up. In the meantime, they sound darn good. I briefly tried a ripole sub(I have two), but seemed to lose the coherency.
Without the sub and a little boost on the low end, they produce a very satisfying output to 60hz, and sound quite spacious. They don't have the liveliness and bass of my LXmini version, but they are super smooth. I'll play around with the crossover point over the next few days.
Peter
Thanks for the info. I'll ponder a while about how to dress these up. In the meantime, they sound darn good. I briefly tried a ripole sub(I have two), but seemed to lose the coherency.
Without the sub and a little boost on the low end, they produce a very satisfying output to 60hz, and sound quite spacious. They don't have the liveliness and bass of my LXmini version, but they are super smooth. I'll play around with the crossover point over the next few days.
Peter
I have had some success with integrating the ripole sub using the speaker level input/outputs crossing at about 60hz.
Also lowered the crossover point of the woofer/ribbon to 350hz LR4 after reading north creek crossover mod for the Stage. They used an even lower crossover point with 12db slopes.
Soundstage is absolutely huge.
Bill.....you are going to enjoy your project.
Also lowered the crossover point of the woofer/ribbon to 350hz LR4 after reading north creek crossover mod for the Stage. They used an even lower crossover point with 12db slopes.
Soundstage is absolutely huge.
Bill.....you are going to enjoy your project.
The cap in the minor is 30mf....the Stage is 70mf.. the minor top end is vary sweet...
I got a lot of info off the North creek site....on Stage crossover....most of my work was on the bass driver....
I added a Zobel on the bass driver....like he has......never sounded better.........thanks
I got a lot of info off the North creek site....on Stage crossover....most of my work was on the bass driver....
I added a Zobel on the bass driver....like he has......never sounded better.........thanks
Interesting that you can get it that low. Certainly gives some flexibility to try and get the balance right of where to crossover.
I really have to start saving...
I really have to start saving...
How are you finding the available volume? I notice xmax is only 3.5mm with those, but with 8 on the go you only need 4W to hit 100dB at the listening position (ish). getting seriously tempted to try and work out a cheap way to ship those to me.
No problem whatsoever with volume in my 15ft x 13ft room. The integration is excellent. I overlapped the crossover 350hz on the ribbon, 450hz on the woofers, 24db slopes.
I will soon be making an mdf back panel and a hardwood frame around the baffle to stiffen it and make some grille covers for the woofers. The ripoles work really well turned flat underneath the mains, so I am figuring out a way to make the whole assembly look decent. The subs are only 6" high in that position, makes the speakers 42" tall, and the soundstage is raised to a level that I prefer.
I will soon be making an mdf back panel and a hardwood frame around the baffle to stiffen it and make some grille covers for the woofers. The ripoles work really well turned flat underneath the mains, so I am figuring out a way to make the whole assembly look decent. The subs are only 6" high in that position, makes the speakers 42" tall, and the soundstage is raised to a level that I prefer.
well I might actually start making some progress soon. Found some drivers on special offer in UK. Peerless M16NH 6.5" Bass / Midrange - Willys-Hifi Ltd currently £19 a pair. No where near the deal pjb got, but affordable compared to the other options I was looking at. Will hit buy if I can work out how to fit them. May have to change my plan to build the amps into the speaker.
They appear to be pretty decent. 2 or 4 per side?
Good to see that progress is being made. Keep us up to date.
Good to see that progress is being made. Keep us up to date.
Four per side. Gives more flexibility in eq plus the added psychological bonus of it looking like the bass will have a similar launch pattern to the ribbon. I still expect to need a ripole or similar like you have to fill in until the sub can take over, but I might get lucky.
I have a question concerning the construction of the Apogee Stage. Is the rear panel removeable, and if so, is there a flexible membrane or thin cushion of some sort sandwiched between the F&R panels?
I ask because I am about to make rear panels for my Ribbon Hybrid speakers(picture in post #195) using 18mm mdf. I'll make cutouts for the ribbon waveguide and a large rectangular cutout for the cone drivers. Multiple screws will be used to attach the panels and I am a little concerned that without some sort of membrane separating them, the assembly may rattle a little, especially when sitting on top of subwoofers.
Thanks
Peter
I ask because I am about to make rear panels for my Ribbon Hybrid speakers(picture in post #195) using 18mm mdf. I'll make cutouts for the ribbon waveguide and a large rectangular cutout for the cone drivers. Multiple screws will be used to attach the panels and I am a little concerned that without some sort of membrane separating them, the assembly may rattle a little, especially when sitting on top of subwoofers.
Thanks
Peter
Being doing some sums some of the conclusions of which I'll start a new thread for, but by my reckoning four 6.5" units will get you down to about 60Hz before you need to roll off rapidly (like LR4 rapid) unless you are happy with very limited LF output in a centaur minor sized unit. The stage is a bit wider so may go a teensy bit lower, but I reckon that for this size of device bass reinforcement is needed unless you are willing to pin peak listening levels at 90dB or so and have some lacking low bass.
Now 60Hz is in that area that you ought to be able to hand off to a pair of subs. But the minigrand style sub is tempting, other than the cost of decent 8" subwoofers. The ripole would fit under there, assuming it can put out the SPLs required with a single driver.
Of course once you have a sub under the speaker you can roll off at 120Hz and some of the problems go away....
Now 60Hz is in that area that you ought to be able to hand off to a pair of subs. But the minigrand style sub is tempting, other than the cost of decent 8" subwoofers. The ripole would fit under there, assuming it can put out the SPLs required with a single driver.
Of course once you have a sub under the speaker you can roll off at 120Hz and some of the problems go away....
Tyu......
I still haven't found evidence of a isolation membrane between the panels. Common sense tells me there should be one and have a few 1mm sheets of synthetic rubber(the type that is used under engineered faux wood flooring) that may well be suitable.
Thanks
Peter
I still haven't found evidence of a isolation membrane between the panels. Common sense tells me there should be one and have a few 1mm sheets of synthetic rubber(the type that is used under engineered faux wood flooring) that may well be suitable.
Thanks
Peter
yes the back come off the stages...pic 1...no other Apogee bass panel is made like the Stages.....if Jason had lived....I think there would have been more bass panels made like the Stages.........pic 2...there a small strip of foam that's under the foil....all the way a round the edges.....front an back..
this foam ....is what come off over time an makes the dreaded .....buzzzzzzzing... that what this... man is fixing in these great pic...
All other Apogee bass panels have the magnet an pole peace monted from the inside...this deaden the pole-peaces an magnets....kills more output...ringing...call it what you well.............
Stages pole-peace.. setup adds more output to the bass panels...if you well.....pole peace works a littel like .....a simthick resonator ..an adds to the sound ...............
I have add mass... like blue dap to the Stages pole peace....an it changes the sound...a lot..... just one small peace.....more bass..but less upper mid.......
but in the end I like the sound without any added mass....less is more
as for you setup.....I cant say what well work.....
all just one mans finding.....keep up the great work
this foam ....is what come off over time an makes the dreaded .....buzzzzzzzing... that what this... man is fixing in these great pic...
All other Apogee bass panels have the magnet an pole peace monted from the inside...this deaden the pole-peaces an magnets....kills more output...ringing...call it what you well.............
Stages pole-peace.. setup adds more output to the bass panels...if you well.....pole peace works a littel like .....a simthick resonator ..an adds to the sound ...............
I have add mass... like blue dap to the Stages pole peace....an it changes the sound...a lot..... just one small peace.....more bass..but less upper mid.......
but in the end I like the sound without any added mass....less is more
as for you setup.....I cant say what well work.....
all just one mans finding.....keep up the great work
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Peter,
The front and rear panels are a direct MDF/MDF coupling. There is no "isolation membrane" between them. The woofer ribbon needs to be maintained under tension (via the spring-loaded mechanism) and a membrane, or excessive adhesive, or double-backed tape, or etc, will not work.
Both the front and rear panels have an edge rabbet to support installation of weatherstripping for edge-damping. This weatherstripping material is the primary failure point of the Apogee bass system.
Dave.
The front and rear panels are a direct MDF/MDF coupling. There is no "isolation membrane" between them. The woofer ribbon needs to be maintained under tension (via the spring-loaded mechanism) and a membrane, or excessive adhesive, or double-backed tape, or etc, will not work.
Both the front and rear panels have an edge rabbet to support installation of weatherstripping for edge-damping. This weatherstripping material is the primary failure point of the Apogee bass system.
Dave.
Thank you guys.
Now I am beginning to see the picture. I have never even seen the Stage, apart or otherwise.
Peter
Now I am beginning to see the picture. I have never even seen the Stage, apart or otherwise.
Peter
All this talk of these Stages......I had to pull out the Stages....
Any one ever have the Caliper Sig.....can anyone give input.....
.I can get a pr..woking $300 for the pr...
How great my life would be.....if I could express myself like Dave an others....my brain works diff....some may say not at all....hehe ..
But I have not found better sound than these old ribbons..can sound with mods....
.I just wont to help the only way I can...an get helpet.....this is great site....full of info on Planars & Exotics
Any one ever have the Caliper Sig.....can anyone give input.....
.I can get a pr..woking $300 for the pr...
How great my life would be.....if I could express myself like Dave an others....my brain works diff....some may say not at all....hehe ..
But I have not found better sound than these old ribbons..can sound with mods....
.I just wont to help the only way I can...an get helpet.....this is great site....full of info on Planars & Exotics
a little progress
I recently substituted the 4 peerless nomex woofers for the no-name cheap woofers on one channel. Just to evaluate a possible "upgrade" for both channels.
In a nutshell, very little audible effect....at least to my ears.
The minidsp is now crossing the drivers with a slight overlap for smoothest response. The ribbon is LR4 at 350Hz and the woofers LR4 at 450Hz.
Attenuation of the woofers is -10db with respect to the ribbon.
I have the assembly securely mounted on the ripole subs which have to be isolated from the wooden floor with felt pads.The local hardware store had some heavy duty brackets that suited the requirements.
Sub plate amps are presently connected via high level inputs and crossed at about 65Hz and flat to 40Hz.
I fabricated a couple of grille frames and the resulting grilles are fairly decent. I plan on making similar grilles for the ripoles.
The wall of sound is quite stunning. I know it sounds trite, but you could almost swim in the spaciousness.
For the heck of it, I built a pair of Meniscus Continuum kits for reference and they do have a very very sweet midrange, but these ribbon assemblies ace them in every other way.
Little more trim work to do when I can pull myself away from the listening chair.
Cheers '
Peter
I recently substituted the 4 peerless nomex woofers for the no-name cheap woofers on one channel. Just to evaluate a possible "upgrade" for both channels.
In a nutshell, very little audible effect....at least to my ears.
The minidsp is now crossing the drivers with a slight overlap for smoothest response. The ribbon is LR4 at 350Hz and the woofers LR4 at 450Hz.
Attenuation of the woofers is -10db with respect to the ribbon.
I have the assembly securely mounted on the ripole subs which have to be isolated from the wooden floor with felt pads.The local hardware store had some heavy duty brackets that suited the requirements.
Sub plate amps are presently connected via high level inputs and crossed at about 65Hz and flat to 40Hz.
I fabricated a couple of grille frames and the resulting grilles are fairly decent. I plan on making similar grilles for the ripoles.
The wall of sound is quite stunning. I know it sounds trite, but you could almost swim in the spaciousness.
For the heck of it, I built a pair of Meniscus Continuum kits for reference and they do have a very very sweet midrange, but these ribbon assemblies ace them in every other way.
Little more trim work to do when I can pull myself away from the listening chair.
Cheers '
Peter
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