How do you like the Fostex T96H?
Is it smooth enough to blend with the very smooth B& C DCM 50?
I was looking at the Fostex line of Super Tweeters as an option to match with my Celestion AXI 2050's.
Is it smooth enough to blend with the very smooth B& C DCM 50?
I was looking at the Fostex line of Super Tweeters as an option to match with my Celestion AXI 2050's.
the problem with the Fostex tweeters is the bump of energy at 5Khz like with the the T90A and the T900 i had before .
the vintage T96H doesn't have this bump and crossed at 12db at 11Khz it mix nicely with the natural roll off of hte B&C . ( i also choose it for it's tiny size to insert it in the small part free between the driver and te horn. ) also you must deal with it's "only "100db efficiency..
you can also try the oldies but goodies JBL 2405 , one of the best sweet sounding tweeter i have tried when used after 8K /10K not 5K..
the vintage T96H doesn't have this bump and crossed at 12db at 11Khz it mix nicely with the natural roll off of hte B&C . ( i also choose it for it's tiny size to insert it in the small part free between the driver and te horn. ) also you must deal with it's "only "100db efficiency..
you can also try the oldies but goodies JBL 2405 , one of the best sweet sounding tweeter i have tried when used after 8K /10K not 5K..
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Oh - I really don't like the ME45. While good horizontal ... we are still living in a 3D world, not 2D.
For your frequency range I would try ME10. XT120 would also be possible when you want a little larger.
But all of these are not as good as the Limmer I mentioned, esp at high frequencies.
(Celestion H1-8050 could also be ok but I never tested it)
Which driver goes from 1kHz to 20khz without membrane resonances?
All of the 1" drivers with domes I know have resonances >10kHz - some just nicely hidden in the frequency response smoothing of the datasheet but impedance tells the truth. BMS 1" would go pretty low (but not 1kHz) but doesn't reach 20kHz (17-18kHz - still not bad, used them in my PA builds).
I didn't pay much attention for the impedance before.
I was want to say 65CDN-T but yeah there's impedance rise at around 18kHz.
Is JBL D2 one of the option？
I was want to say 65CDN-T but yeah there's impedance rise at around 18kHz.
Is JBL D2 one of the option？
65CDN-T has the first resonance at 15kHz (impedance) and is exactly one of the examples of smoothed frequency response I thought about 🤓
While it's propably still a great driver I was searching for smooth response into the top end for Power HiFi/home cinema /monitoring.
Not a lot of information around about the JBL D2 ... what i found didn't look resonant free at all (Tech Review fohonline)
Here a measurement of DE360 red and BMS 4544 blue. While going deeper many BMS show that peak in the 18-19kHz area. B&C used a harder material for the membrane and doesn't have that problem, but needs to be crossed over higher.
That's mainly H2, H3 is actually a liiiittle better with the DE360.
While it's propably still a great driver I was searching for smooth response into the top end for Power HiFi/home cinema /monitoring.
Not a lot of information around about the JBL D2 ... what i found didn't look resonant free at all (Tech Review fohonline)
Here a measurement of DE360 red and BMS 4544 blue. While going deeper many BMS show that peak in the 18-19kHz area. B&C used a harder material for the membrane and doesn't have that problem, but needs to be crossed over higher.
That's mainly H2, H3 is actually a liiiittle better with the DE360.
Could the DE360 be reasonably crossed at around ~1.5K for home hifi listening that never goes above 80db?
Ähm - why use a compression driver for 80dBSpl? Just use a tweeter with waveguide?
At 90dBSpl/1m it crosses 1% THD at about 1,3kHz. With the 0,1W or less you need for that level you will never destroy it. So I would say yes.
I cross at 1,8kHz for home cinema and this speakers can go loud!
At 90dBSpl/1m it crosses 1% THD at about 1,3kHz. With the 0,1W or less you need for that level you will never destroy it. So I would say yes.
I cross at 1,8kHz for home cinema and this speakers can go loud!
Thanks. I just have them and ME20 waveguides and am not currently using them. Those measurements look great. Is that with the Limmer waveguide?
The Me 10 is the waveguide that I am currently using with the B & C DE 10....and with excellent results.....May order the DE 360 you mentioned to see how that might improve things.
I may also try the one inch Limmer you mentioned. Can you provide a link for a retailer?
Thanks
Do you have any diffraction issues with the large Tratrix horn extending outward and the small Fostex tweeter that's mounted behind it?
it 's a compromise as usual ; i have tried different position and crossover point and to put the tweeter just at the level off my hears was the best for the fusion of the voices . i only listen at the center of my speaker so i can't tell about off axis respons .. but a flat respons is not enough to make it dissapear it really needs to be adjusted in delay and phase . crossed at 11K it doesn't pass much of music when you listen them alone ( i'm 50 years old) and with the RCF 850ND i really don't need it but with the B&C it adds some sparks and air missing..
I have put some foam around just to test ..
I have put some foam around just to test ..
Keep us updated about the comparison!
I have no idea where you can buy Limmer outside of Europe ... maybe just write him and ask?
It's interesting seeing all the measurements that look great to cover some 5+ octaves.
Wonder what they sound like?
I'm in the ribbon tweeter (Raal Lazy 111dB/W), camp for something above drivers / horns that excel to around 10-12KHz.
Very easy integration.
As an aside on alignment;
One thing I recently did was to align all the horn mouths physically, and then in DSP time align the diaphragm 1st peak positives, and then to incorporate the physical length of the respective horns in that alignment.
The idea is that the sound waves eminate and mingle with the room.
Can really hear the difference in presentation.
I didn't come up with this, but tried it, and would not go back to misaligned mouths or just diaphragm time alignment..
Wonder what they sound like?
I'm in the ribbon tweeter (Raal Lazy 111dB/W), camp for something above drivers / horns that excel to around 10-12KHz.
Very easy integration.
As an aside on alignment;
One thing I recently did was to align all the horn mouths physically, and then in DSP time align the diaphragm 1st peak positives, and then to incorporate the physical length of the respective horns in that alignment.
The idea is that the sound waves eminate and mingle with the room.
Can really hear the difference in presentation.
I didn't come up with this, but tried it, and would not go back to misaligned mouths or just diaphragm time alignment..
If one had to choose between these two waveguide's
...thoughts please ...
Application: 8 to 10kHZ > up to the max that a
B & C DE 10, or DE 360 can go ( apparently 20 kHZ for a DE 360, not sure regarding the DE 10, probably not quite 18kHz is my guess).
Application: 8 to 10kHZ > up to the max that a
B & C DE 10, or DE 360 can go ( apparently 20 kHZ for a DE 360, not sure regarding the DE 10, probably not quite 18kHz is my guess).
Attachments
Do you have a picture that shows how you implemented the 30 ppi foam over the vertical mouth of the wave guide on the Fountek 3.5 ribbon?
Thanks....
I haven’t. I’d recommend the driver to GregOH who commented after using it for a few months that the lower-end wasn’t as good as he wanted and as a result I believe crossed-over higher in freq. than what was (perhaps) “best” with respect to horizontal dispersion integration.
At some point later I thought:”why not use some foam”, though I’m not sure if I ever conveyed this to Greg (or if I did, if he ever tried it).
All I’m suggesting here is a strip across the top and bottom edge of the waveguide, probably a 1/8” of over-hang “into” the waveguide itself (and at least that much on the “outside” of the waveguide). So perhaps a strip that’s 3/8” in height, span’s the width of the waveguide, and is about 1/2” thick glued to the waveguides top and bottom edge where the foam slightly overlaps/“blocks” the waveguides exit by about 1/8”. Probably 30ppi foam.
At some point later I thought:”why not use some foam”, though I’m not sure if I ever conveyed this to Greg (or if I did, if he ever tried it).
All I’m suggesting here is a strip across the top and bottom edge of the waveguide, probably a 1/8” of over-hang “into” the waveguide itself (and at least that much on the “outside” of the waveguide). So perhaps a strip that’s 3/8” in height, span’s the width of the waveguide, and is about 1/2” thick glued to the waveguides top and bottom edge where the foam slightly overlaps/“blocks” the waveguides exit by about 1/8”. Probably 30ppi foam.
I picked up a pair of used BMS 4594 drivers- and tested it on a B&C Horn - and MiniDSP active crossover. No matter what I did it just sounded tinny and shrill- no matter where I set the crossover points.
Any idea what I might be doing wrong?
I’ve ordered a Dayton Audio active crossover and a different horn- but would love your help on proper set up.
Thanks!