Pavel, understood, I'm using cheapest RCA connectors with cable braid soldered evenly around connector shell. It looks that the RCA-shielded twisted pair with the shield connected on the source side-RCA is the worst case for ground loop current according to your setup
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Mr. Curl
You may post the pages you find are of interest when you are ready.
I have read a few metallurgy and material science books so far, so I don’t have great expectations this book will open a window to the world for me.
In a month or two the technical library will have it.
Incidently, Indra mentioned annealing.
Dan, this process should draw your attention and sooth this neurotic assumption that dislocations within the metal are the cause of the mythical directionality in conducting (AC mind you) electrical signals in a wire .
Have you tried reading what annealing does to metals in general and to copper in particular? How is it performed? Have you heard of loop annealing?
Dan how well are you informed on the wire drawing processes used in factories before drawing conclusions? Processes, engineering, metallurgical details?
Cold drawing at these high speeds that modern equipment is working today, isn’t exactly “cold”.
600d Celsius is readily achieved during drawing wire through the formers (friction) and this is above the ½ melting temperature of copper. You know what effect has this on copper?
This is a whole new world. Be willing to study before safely assuming such assumptions
PS. Just knowing how easily new dislocations are induced in a copper wire by simply bending the wire during normal handling, makes the whole scenario of dislocations-generated wire electrical directionality a good joke.
George
Well tonight I actually ordered some lead. My SME 3009 SIII is missing half it's counterweights (they all generally are) and I plan to finally get it comissioned soon. Not paying ebay prices so going to make my own. And smile as they aren't allowed to make them this way anymore. Shame really as it's a think of beauty to just hold in your hand and seems so delicate compared to its younger sibling 309. It also marks an interesting point in audio evolution, where low mass and low friction were swept aside in the rush to support the brutish wave of low compliance MCs that became fashionable.
These days as vinyl replay is about the experience rather than the quality we can appreciate these wonders of precision engineering far more I reckon.
These days as vinyl replay is about the experience rather than the quality we can appreciate these wonders of precision engineering far more I reckon.
person | Origin and meaning of person by Online Etymology Dictionary
Phersu (in Greek) is the imperative present form of the verb “ pheromae”, meaning to behave in a certain manner.
See how things cling together!
PS. Use of theatric masks is dated (documented) during classical years ~500BC, much earlier than late Roman period
Teaching History with 100 Objects - A Greek theatre mask
George
Thank you Mr. Curl. Very kind of you.
I'll come back on this when I read it (tomorrow)
George
Having observed in close range these processes in operation I think the first issue is that stranded wire will be in random direction from the reels. It will have been through the drawing dies many times to get to a 30 to 36 AWG gauge for stranding. Then stranding and bunching processes will further mix and randomize the wire. The high purity wire needs special handling since exposure to the environment will degrade the copper and it needs to be processed quickly, however it all starts as 1/4" drawing stock do you can see how there is a lot of processing before its usable.
Then its jacketed which is another hot process. Usually for audio cable, there is more than one insulating/jacketing process so more opportunities for randomization.
If getting it all unidirectional is important the only process I would suggest is CAT 5-7 etc. Those systems/machines take drawing stock at one end and reels in boxes pop out the other end. Asking for a special version is not easy or cheap. You could go through 1000' starting the system up.
Mr. Curl
The pages you kindly posted do not contain any evidence of burn-in effects in electrical conductors.
On the contrary, in two places –see attachment- it is written that grain boundary movement and defect generation was taking place during a time interval where the electron microscope was switched off , so neither the presence of an electron field , nor the electron irradiation or electron beam heating was the cause of these changes in the thin copper foil (if this is what you call as evidence of burn-in )
A side effect (collateral damage) from the posting of those pages is the verification of the ease by which defects (dislocations) are generated or move around in the copper. They show that changes are inevitable and occur all the time
This is really bad news for a directionality hypothesis based on dislocations and metallurgical defects within copper wires
George
The pages you kindly posted do not contain any evidence of burn-in effects in electrical conductors.
On the contrary, in two places –see attachment- it is written that grain boundary movement and defect generation was taking place during a time interval where the electron microscope was switched off , so neither the presence of an electron field , nor the electron irradiation or electron beam heating was the cause of these changes in the thin copper foil (if this is what you call as evidence of burn-in )
A side effect (collateral damage) from the posting of those pages is the verification of the ease by which defects (dislocations) are generated or move around in the copper. They show that changes are inevitable and occur all the time
This is really bad news for a directionality hypothesis based on dislocations and metallurgical defects within copper wires
George
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Thank you Demian once again for providing your valuable experience from the manufacturing floor.
I wish your opinion and suggestions will be noted.
That’s funny.
When I read JC post where he asked suggestions for good hook-up wire, I thought to reply that if the gauge is adequate, he would be OK with individual wires from the bundles of CAT 5 wire. (based not on directionality concerns but on the thought that telecommunication industry has far more demanding requirements than audio for the connecting cables and that long runs of not proper wiring would have unacceptable consequences for them. So if CAT 5 wire is the proper wire for them how it can not be good for hook up wire inside audio equipment )
But I said to myself, you will make another public exposure of how cheap you are and I didn't post it.
But here we are again.
George
Demian,
Wow, starting at 1/4 inch dia. Small to start. The stuff I use starts at one foot dia. Goes to 13 mils.
We also use 7 nines copper and aluminum, needed for thermal conductivity at 4 Kelvin.
Yet, with all the smart guys working this stuff, they've seemed to have neglected wire directionality.
I should direct them to Ed and Max, maybe the lead researchers on this planet need to learn reality as it applies to high end audio??
So many world class researchers need to learn this stuff...
Jn
Wow, starting at 1/4 inch dia. Small to start. The stuff I use starts at one foot dia. Goes to 13 mils.
We also use 7 nines copper and aluminum, needed for thermal conductivity at 4 Kelvin.
Yet, with all the smart guys working this stuff, they've seemed to have neglected wire directionality.
I should direct them to Ed and Max, maybe the lead researchers on this planet need to learn reality as it applies to high end audio??
So many world class researchers need to learn this stuff...
Jn
Demian,
Wow, starting at 1/4 inch dia. Small to start. The stuff I use starts at one foot dia. Goes to 13 mils.
We also use 7 nines copper and aluminum, needed for thermal conductivity at 4 Kelvin.
Yet, with all the smart guys working this stuff, they've seemed to have neglected wire directionality.
I should direct them to Ed and Max, maybe the lead researchers on this planet need to learn reality as it applies to high end audio??
So many world class researchers need to learn this stuff...
Jn
You need to put some of Max's magic goop on your magnets. Nobel prize winning stuff I am sure.
Howie,
As you noted cables can have issues that are measurable and can cause problems. As sensitive as my test is, wire directivity is not a clear issue and may only appear under extreme circumstances at a low level.
I did do experiments where I measured wire before and after stressing it. My initial results showed something, but that turned out to be an error. The after stress test had allowed the test equipment to get warmer and that was the difference.
I get the feel that thin wire may have less issues than thicker gauges, but no clear repeatable results. Of course on my large scale projects skin effect can actually make an easily measured difference.
I have noted the peanut gallery has now changed from "cable" to "wire."
As you noted cables can have issues that are measurable and can cause problems. As sensitive as my test is, wire directivity is not a clear issue and may only appear under extreme circumstances at a low level.
I did do experiments where I measured wire before and after stressing it. My initial results showed something, but that turned out to be an error. The after stress test had allowed the test equipment to get warmer and that was the difference.
I get the feel that thin wire may have less issues than thicker gauges, but no clear repeatable results. Of course on my large scale projects skin effect can actually make an easily measured difference.
I have noted the peanut gallery has now changed from "cable" to "wire."
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Speaker drivers and headphone drivers do change when 'gooped'.You need to put some of Max's magic goop on your magnets. Nobel prize winning stuff I am sure.
Dan.
No. As long as an amplifier will drive a speaker, this has no meaning the way you seems to see it.
Compare a flat amplifier with an other that is not linear at all, but compensate the accidents in the response curve of this speaker. Witch one is better ? The one with the less "degree of faithfulness" as you say.
If an amplifier with a lot of distortion is the one that produce the more "natural" or enjoyable sound, witch one is the best ?
When you mix a record, you do it, referring your work on a speaker's system, with the room acoustic of the studio. The best system, at home, the one that will reproduce this mix in the most accurate way is ... the exact same imperfect system. Not a perfect one that do not exists anyway.
it is like cars. Performance numbers on the paper do not tell a lot about the way you will feel on the road. And it is not sure at all that the formula one with the best numbers will win the next race.
You are living in a marvelous but utopian world (on my opinion). The nature has endowed us with senses to perceive the outside world. It is not totally stupid, in hifi as for the rest, to use them to compare the "accuracy" of the sound artifacts that is music reproduction with the idea of the real thing that you can have, that depends on *your* culture.
Oh, yes, culture, subjectivity ....
Numbers are good, it helps during a design process, but it is only the middle of the way. And that is to be welcomed, it would be so boring, otherwise, and this forum would not exists.
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What is the contact force like? Usually when I see these they are barely hanging on. You can smash the leaves down but it never works for long.
These might be easier to use:
1 X 567 Socket; RCA; female; straight; crimped; nickel plated, tinned | eBay
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