sorry guys, I am doing my best, just problem with new website exterior.unfortunately it depends not on me, but people who working on it. 🙁
I believe we will start this late autumn at least.
as for watt puppy I have never put any sigificant data (for longer period) in previuos website. I will ask WIlson audio if they dont mind(as wp is out of production already) if i put some their R&D on my new, and if they dont you will find some interesting stuff here.
R.
Thanks for your information about "cloning" watt puppy the users of this site would appreciate that the information could arrive still in this life!
Several years ago I read about the WATT/Puppy clone project published by Thorsten Loesch. I just saw this thread and thought this link may be helpful.
A Speaker project
If you guys decide to pursue this project you'll have to find suitable replacement speakers, as the original ones are no longer available. Make sure you post your findings. I am curious as to whether this is still a viable project.
A Speaker project
If you guys decide to pursue this project you'll have to find suitable replacement speakers, as the original ones are no longer available. Make sure you post your findings. I am curious as to whether this is still a viable project.
Hi,
The problem here is all the original drivers are unavailable and cannot be simply substituted.
So you are looking at a re-design from scratch. If you can do this, there may now be more worthy targets for cloning or really interesting options for making your own...
I would be tempted these day's to do a "Watt/Puppy-ish" speaker with ribbon HF and a Higher efficiency midrange and use an active bass system...
Ciao T
The problem here is all the original drivers are unavailable and cannot be simply substituted.
So you are looking at a re-design from scratch. If you can do this, there may now be more worthy targets for cloning or really interesting options for making your own...
I would be tempted these day's to do a "Watt/Puppy-ish" speaker with ribbon HF and a Higher efficiency midrange and use an active bass system...
Ciao T
Oh you are revering to this design.😀
http://www.audax-speaker.de/index.php?module=shop_articles&index[shop_articles][action]=details&index[shop_articles][category==2&index[shop_articles][data][shop_articles_id]=83]%[/category][category=
An externally hosted image should be here but it was not working when we last tested it.
Attachments
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Hi,
Not really. But it looks nice enough.
If you where to ask ME personally, what I would do as "Super Speaker" it would be my latest incarnation of the "modest proposal", which nowadays looks like this:
HF RAAL or similar ribbon * 1
MF Supravox 215-2000 EXC OB * 2
LF Supravox 400-2000 EXC * 2
Arrangement:
W
M
T
M
W
Hf and MF on open baffle with rear felt/foam mask to produce cardioid response, LF with top unit open baffle and bottom unit sealed, electronically steered to produce cardioid response.
MF and HF would use passive series crossover as low as feasible and probably operate from around 120Hz or thereabouts upwards fully passive, giving around 98dB/2.83V/1m SPL with around 8 Ohm impedance. Vertical dispersion should be quite controlled from the largeish vertical dimension driver array while horizontal would be made cardioid. LF needs some sophisticated parametric EQ to get good and even rear attenuation.
A cheaper version using for example the Mids and Hornloaded HF Ribbon from my Crescendo project for diyhifisupply and some pro audio 15" drivers is also quite easily conceivable...
Ciao T
Oh you are revering to this design.😀
An externally hosted image should be here but it was not working when we last tested it.
Not really. But it looks nice enough.
If you where to ask ME personally, what I would do as "Super Speaker" it would be my latest incarnation of the "modest proposal", which nowadays looks like this:
HF RAAL or similar ribbon * 1
MF Supravox 215-2000 EXC OB * 2
LF Supravox 400-2000 EXC * 2
Arrangement:
W
M
T
M
W
Hf and MF on open baffle with rear felt/foam mask to produce cardioid response, LF with top unit open baffle and bottom unit sealed, electronically steered to produce cardioid response.
MF and HF would use passive series crossover as low as feasible and probably operate from around 120Hz or thereabouts upwards fully passive, giving around 98dB/2.83V/1m SPL with around 8 Ohm impedance. Vertical dispersion should be quite controlled from the largeish vertical dimension driver array while horizontal would be made cardioid. LF needs some sophisticated parametric EQ to get good and even rear attenuation.
A cheaper version using for example the Mids and Hornloaded HF Ribbon from my Crescendo project for diyhifisupply and some pro audio 15" drivers is also quite easily conceivable...
Ciao T
I like the original WATT.
How different is the Focal kevlar tweeter to the newest Focal aluminum ones?
I even consider using all ceramic drivers from Accuton such as AC32 tweeter and their 7" driver but the crossover would be crazy.
How different is the Focal kevlar tweeter to the newest Focal aluminum ones?
I even consider using all ceramic drivers from Accuton such as AC32 tweeter and their 7" driver but the crossover would be crazy.
Hi,
No, Supravox not just because of efficiency but mainly because the sound quality.
Ciao T
No, Supravox not just because of efficiency but mainly because the sound quality.
Ciao T
Hi,
The original kevlar focal was somewhat spitty, snifty sounding, due to the low breakup, the later Ti ones just shifted this breakup high enough to to reduce this tendency low enough to no longer be bothersome. It is possible to re-work earlier Watt's with Ti repair sets, of course then they are no longer original, but the spittiness is reduced.
The key to the original Watt was the cone driver, a Seas Paper Cone with a fairly big magnet system. The Watt was never the same after Wilson went to the Scan Speaks.
Ciao T
The original kevlar focal was somewhat spitty, snifty sounding, due to the low breakup, the later Ti ones just shifted this breakup high enough to to reduce this tendency low enough to no longer be bothersome. It is possible to re-work earlier Watt's with Ti repair sets, of course then they are no longer original, but the spittiness is reduced.
The key to the original Watt was the cone driver, a Seas Paper Cone with a fairly big magnet system. The Watt was never the same after Wilson went to the Scan Speaks.
Ciao T
Do you mean the Seas CA17 RC?
What would be a suitable Seas alternative?
The TC90 and TC120 are in limited supply.
What would be a suitable Seas alternative?
The TC90 and TC120 are in limited supply.
Hi,
I forgot which precise one Wilson used, the one I used over a decade ago was already a substitution as the originals where no longer available. I have not seen anything remotely similar in Seas catalogues for ages, so I don't think there is one.
Hence my point that any such project would have to clone current versions (the merit of which I would question) or to do something else.
Ciao T
I forgot which precise one Wilson used, the one I used over a decade ago was already a substitution as the originals where no longer available. I have not seen anything remotely similar in Seas catalogues for ages, so I don't think there is one.
Hence my point that any such project would have to clone current versions (the merit of which I would question) or to do something else.
Ciao T
What does suprafox good. Voice coil former material/diameter, or the papercone. Do they have low Rms. Or is it that you hear them and you like the tone of supravox drivers Thorsten.
Hi,
I have used Supravox drivers extensively, from the low end ferrite units all the way to the Fieldcoil drivers. I even had Supravox make me a custom version of the fieldcoil 8" driver to make it more suited for open baffle use, which is now on general sale.
They are essentially the professional version (cast frame, big magnets etc.) of the kind of driver found for decades in german tube radios (Saba, Nordmende, RFT etc.) and quite similar in a number of areas to the Schulze KSP215 (but not in all areas), which was essentially one of the main monitor drivers for the east german radio & TV, Supravox originally supplied their drivers to ORTF for monitor use.
Current Supravox is a Phoenix incarnation of original Supravox company after reecovering original tooling and as I have been told it finding and re-hiring some of the original workers.
And yes, they do sound very good to my ears, you might say all the good parts of Lowthers without any of the drawbacks.
The (whizzerless) 215-2000 EXC OB fitted to a modest size open baffle (and supported with a decent sub and supertweeter) may be "the best speaker I ever heard". You can read a review (including independent measurements) of a lower end version using the same open baffle here:
AnandTech - Audiophile Journeys with a PC
Ciao T
I have used Supravox drivers extensively, from the low end ferrite units all the way to the Fieldcoil drivers. I even had Supravox make me a custom version of the fieldcoil 8" driver to make it more suited for open baffle use, which is now on general sale.
They are essentially the professional version (cast frame, big magnets etc.) of the kind of driver found for decades in german tube radios (Saba, Nordmende, RFT etc.) and quite similar in a number of areas to the Schulze KSP215 (but not in all areas), which was essentially one of the main monitor drivers for the east german radio & TV, Supravox originally supplied their drivers to ORTF for monitor use.
Current Supravox is a Phoenix incarnation of original Supravox company after reecovering original tooling and as I have been told it finding and re-hiring some of the original workers.
And yes, they do sound very good to my ears, you might say all the good parts of Lowthers without any of the drawbacks.
The (whizzerless) 215-2000 EXC OB fitted to a modest size open baffle (and supported with a decent sub and supertweeter) may be "the best speaker I ever heard". You can read a review (including independent measurements) of a lower end version using the same open baffle here:
AnandTech - Audiophile Journeys with a PC
Ciao T
Similar to Seas CB17RCY is CB17RCY/P H 571, I spoked with Seas before replaced my originals CB17RCY and said I will not ear the difference between the two models.
I have on hand two Focal TC120TDX2, two CB17RCY/P so I only need four woofers to do the Watt & Puppy clon, Usher Spanish distributor told me that I can use the same crossover for Perless using two Usher 8955A 9" in parallel per louspeaker, or it's better others woofers?
I have on hand two Focal TC120TDX2, two CB17RCY/P so I only need four woofers to do the Watt & Puppy clon, Usher Spanish distributor told me that I can use the same crossover for Perless using two Usher 8955A 9" in parallel per louspeaker, or it's better others woofers?
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Hi,
I would not take their word. The "/P" means it is a driver with a phaseplug, not a dustcap. Anyway, according to Seas's site this one too is long history.
Consider removing the phaseplug and fitting some dustcaps. I still doubt it will be an exact fit.
The Peerless I originally selected where taken because they matched closely to the Dynaudio Units originally used. I doubt the Ushers are anything like them, but you can download my excelbox.xls spreadsheet and find out. I originally wrote this to find a woofer that was a close match to the Dynaudio, you may still find the driver data in it IIRC.
You do need to consider the voice coil inductance in the crossover, this makes a big difference.
Ciao T
I would not take their word. The "/P" means it is a driver with a phaseplug, not a dustcap. Anyway, according to Seas's site this one too is long history.
Consider removing the phaseplug and fitting some dustcaps. I still doubt it will be an exact fit.
The Peerless I originally selected where taken because they matched closely to the Dynaudio Units originally used. I doubt the Ushers are anything like them, but you can download my excelbox.xls spreadsheet and find out. I originally wrote this to find a woofer that was a close match to the Dynaudio, you may still find the driver data in it IIRC.
You do need to consider the voice coil inductance in the crossover, this makes a big difference.
Ciao T
Yes also CB17RCY/P is discontinued.
"Removing the phaseplug and fitting some dustcaps" I suppose that's for Focal?
Where can download your excelbox.xls, could you post the link?
"Removing the phaseplug and fitting some dustcaps" I suppose that's for Focal?
Where can download your excelbox.xls, could you post the link?
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