answer is Yes. its almost direct drop in replacement for watt puppy (assuming you use same xover) sonicaly they will be somewhat between wp6 and wp7/8
actualy its the only driver which is very similar to 21w54. I rememeber when I talked to Per , he also admit that it have slight improoved back venting comapring to 21w54. otherwise it very similar drivers(boths sonicaly and technicaly)
Hi,
Yes. However, remember my crossover is for the Peerless driver and designed to give the same response as the Dynaudio's with this driver, it is NOT for the Dynaudio Driver...
Ciao T
Yes. However, remember my crossover is for the Peerless driver and designed to give the same response as the Dynaudio's with this driver, it is NOT for the Dynaudio Driver...
Ciao T
woofer x-over
About the x-over you wrote:
"The Lowpass feeding the Woofers uses an Impedance Compensation. If the Dynaudio 21W-54 Woofers are employed, this Compensation is un-neccesary and should be omitted. It might be desirable to connect a high power resistor of 15 Ohm Value (> 50W) across the Woofers to slightly attenuate the woofers as well as reducing the Impedance swing at low frequencies"
X-over schematic will be as the pic?
About the x-over you wrote:
"The Lowpass feeding the Woofers uses an Impedance Compensation. If the Dynaudio 21W-54 Woofers are employed, this Compensation is un-neccesary and should be omitted. It might be desirable to connect a high power resistor of 15 Ohm Value (> 50W) across the Woofers to slightly attenuate the woofers as well as reducing the Impedance swing at low frequencies"
X-over schematic will be as the pic?
Attachments
Hi,
I wrote that over a decade ago, so I guess it must be right if I wrote it... 😉
I guess so...
Ciao T
I wrote that over a decade ago, so I guess it must be right if I wrote it... 😉
I guess so...
Ciao T
Look a like tangband inversedome titaniumtweeter.
http://www.tb-speaker.com/detail/1208_03/25-1372sc.htm
The focal one's
http://www.rumoh.nl/nl/313-focal
http://www.tb-speaker.com/detail/1208_03/25-1372sc.htm
The focal one's
http://www.rumoh.nl/nl/313-focal
Attachments
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Gents,
What about this approach: take the AT woofer plus the Focal tweet3r and build them in an enclosure with identical outside dimensions to the original Puppies. I do not know if the drivers in the original Puppies are flush mounted, but if so, it is a must to do so in your clones as well.
Now get yerselves a pair of original Puppies for a at least a whole weekend. Disconnect the tweeter from the x/o, but be careful to leave the tweeter in situ. Connect the high pass output of the x/o to the tweeter of the other Puppy and be careful keep this tweeter out of reach of your measurement mike.
Measure the on axis transfer function of the woofer+x/o in box. Store this SPL measurement file curve in your measurement program. Now make the same measurement on 15/30/45/60/75 degrees, and do a spatial avaraging of the curves.
Do the same routine with the original tweeter+Puppy x/o.
Re-assemble the original Puppies, and make the same on/off axis measurements for the complete Puppy speaker.
After making SPL and Impedance measurements of the unfiltered AT and Focal drivers, import these into a sophisticated filter optimization programm such as Lsp CAD, LEAP or SE. Use the spatial avaraged measurements of the Puppy woofer and tweeter as target curves for the filter optimization of the Puppy clone filter legs for AT and Focal.
By the time you have finalized your optimization in such a way that your new filter+ drivers yield the same (averaged) transfer functions as the original Puppy woofer and tweeter plus filter, you have truly cloned the Puppies.
Calsod can possibly do the same trick. The Ultimate Equalizer may also be helpful to emulate the Puppies digitally, but I am not sure if the UE software will allow to import target functions at will.
Have fun and take your time.
Eelco
What about this approach: take the AT woofer plus the Focal tweet3r and build them in an enclosure with identical outside dimensions to the original Puppies. I do not know if the drivers in the original Puppies are flush mounted, but if so, it is a must to do so in your clones as well.
Now get yerselves a pair of original Puppies for a at least a whole weekend. Disconnect the tweeter from the x/o, but be careful to leave the tweeter in situ. Connect the high pass output of the x/o to the tweeter of the other Puppy and be careful keep this tweeter out of reach of your measurement mike.
Measure the on axis transfer function of the woofer+x/o in box. Store this SPL measurement file curve in your measurement program. Now make the same measurement on 15/30/45/60/75 degrees, and do a spatial avaraging of the curves.
Do the same routine with the original tweeter+Puppy x/o.
Re-assemble the original Puppies, and make the same on/off axis measurements for the complete Puppy speaker.
After making SPL and Impedance measurements of the unfiltered AT and Focal drivers, import these into a sophisticated filter optimization programm such as Lsp CAD, LEAP or SE. Use the spatial avaraged measurements of the Puppy woofer and tweeter as target curves for the filter optimization of the Puppy clone filter legs for AT and Focal.
By the time you have finalized your optimization in such a way that your new filter+ drivers yield the same (averaged) transfer functions as the original Puppy woofer and tweeter plus filter, you have truly cloned the Puppies.
Calsod can possibly do the same trick. The Ultimate Equalizer may also be helpful to emulate the Puppies digitally, but I am not sure if the UE software will allow to import target functions at will.
Have fun and take your time.
Eelco
Look a like tangband inversedome titaniumtweeter.
http://www.tb-speaker.com/detail/1208_03/25-1372sc.htm
The focal one's
Focal - RumoH - Caps, coils and speakers
Wilson Audio uses the Focal TC120 TD5 not the Focal TC90 TD5B
Focal TC120 TD5 - RumoH - Caps, coils and speakers
Hi,
Sure you can. You will have of course a totally different speaker then and need a totally different crossover...
TO be honest, in 2011 the WP clones of my mis-spend youth are not what I would I build now...
There are now so many great Planar/Ribbon/AMT Tweeters, I would use these.
Next, I would probably ratchet the midrange efficiency up several dB and use an active bass system.
If you do that you likely arrive likely at something like the Crescendo speaker I recently designed for diyhifisupply. This uses a large surface area horn loaded magnetic planar as tweeter and a nice carbon fibre & paper cone midrange plus an active sub. Crossover is first order around 600Hz, sensitivity is 98dB/1m/2.83V...
And yes, I think it is better than my WP Clones, especially driven by a nice SET Amp...
Ciao T
Sure you can. You will have of course a totally different speaker then and need a totally different crossover...
TO be honest, in 2011 the WP clones of my mis-spend youth are not what I would I build now...
There are now so many great Planar/Ribbon/AMT Tweeters, I would use these.
Next, I would probably ratchet the midrange efficiency up several dB and use an active bass system.
If you do that you likely arrive likely at something like the Crescendo speaker I recently designed for diyhifisupply. This uses a large surface area horn loaded magnetic planar as tweeter and a nice carbon fibre & paper cone midrange plus an active sub. Crossover is first order around 600Hz, sensitivity is 98dB/1m/2.83V...
And yes, I think it is better than my WP Clones, especially driven by a nice SET Amp...
Ciao T
Most of the ribbons have very poor of axes >8kHz. Not the raal you mentioned lately. Off axes that is probably the big difference with a good dome.
Although a big ribbon can be crossed low that is a problem with a 1"dome.
One would think you get better HF response because it does >40kHz fast transient bla bla, in most set-ups the opposite is the case. Poor of axes above 8-10kHz so you have a huge drop in HF response on your listening position.
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Hi,
http://www.diyaudio.com/forums/diy-hifi-supply/166633-crescendo-eureka-100db-30l-cabinet-65hz-25khz.html
Full plans should be on-line somewhere on diyhifisupply's website.
Ciao T
http://www.diyaudio.com/forums/diy-hifi-supply/166633-crescendo-eureka-100db-30l-cabinet-65hz-25khz.html
Full plans should be on-line somewhere on diyhifisupply's website.
Ciao T
Hi,
Sorry, I no not really understand...
In order to work well almost any tweeter (be it a 1" dome or a ribbon) needs a correctly designed waveguide that matches it dispersion at lower frequencies to that of the woofer, which in turn necessitates a suitable equaliser in the crossover to correct the resulting "CD HF Rolloff".
The original Watt implemented instead a mask of absorbent foam to create a similar result, as did the BBC in their LS3/5. It is also applicable to ribbons.
Wide dispersion is really a terrible idea in domestic speakers (well, omni's are worse)...
Why would you have a huge drop at your listening position from poor off axis response, unless you sit somewhere that is considerably outside any sensible listening window for stereo reproduction and hence far off axis?
Ciao T
Sorry, I no not really understand...
In order to work well almost any tweeter (be it a 1" dome or a ribbon) needs a correctly designed waveguide that matches it dispersion at lower frequencies to that of the woofer, which in turn necessitates a suitable equaliser in the crossover to correct the resulting "CD HF Rolloff".
The original Watt implemented instead a mask of absorbent foam to create a similar result, as did the BBC in their LS3/5. It is also applicable to ribbons.
Wide dispersion is really a terrible idea in domestic speakers (well, omni's are worse)...
Why would you have a huge drop at your listening position from poor off axis response, unless you sit somewhere that is considerably outside any sensible listening window for stereo reproduction and hence far off axis?
Ciao T
I have built and tried this CQ23 in BR boxes and pretty conventional crossovers. I must say I do enjoy FU6, FU10, FU12 and CQ18 much much more than whatt he CQ23 ever performed.
Anyone else with similair experience?
I do not follow your schematic. There are two positive connection points, while one goes directly to negative point? The (large) capacitors are in parallel but before the crossover.
Anyone care to explain?
Hi,
The Watt is a 2-Way speaker with a 6.5" Woofer and Focal Tweeter. It has it's own crossover.
What was shown is the crossover for the "Puppy" Woofer unit. This contains a high pass for the "Watt" and a lowpass for the Puppy's dual 8" Woofers. The feed for the "Watt" is inverted, otherwise there would be a major suck-out in the bass. It may be clearer if you read the original notes I published ages ago (and which still knock around the internet)...
Ciao T
The Watt is a 2-Way speaker with a 6.5" Woofer and Focal Tweeter. It has it's own crossover.
What was shown is the crossover for the "Puppy" Woofer unit. This contains a high pass for the "Watt" and a lowpass for the Puppy's dual 8" Woofers. The feed for the "Watt" is inverted, otherwise there would be a major suck-out in the bass. It may be clearer if you read the original notes I published ages ago (and which still knock around the internet)...
Ciao T
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