Amplifier purchased.
MiniDSP arrived and seems functional.
Wood being reclaimed, hoarded, and soon to be collected from my parents- flood damaged (but perfect) insurance claim remains precision veneered tongue and groove flooring.
This project will keep me occupied and sane for a while now I suspect, provided I can source the right drivers..
Thanks for all your help!!!
J James.
MiniDSP arrived and seems functional.
Wood being reclaimed, hoarded, and soon to be collected from my parents- flood damaged (but perfect) insurance claim remains precision veneered tongue and groove flooring.
This project will keep me occupied and sane for a while now I suspect, provided I can source the right drivers..
Thanks for all your help!!!
J James.
Cool, I'll have a look into their specs etc and see how suitable they might be.
Ta,
J James.
Unfortunately, while it wasn't my final decision (but I really did rather like it), the Beyma 12BR70 isn't in stock anywhere at the moment, removing it as an option. I'll be lucky to get in-stock items delivered (relatively) quickly at the moment, but out of stock stuff, not so good.
Blue Aran seem rather low on 12" drivers in stock with a Fs below 50hz (correct me if I'm wrong, but wanting deep bass this doesn't to be what I'm looking for) so they're out for the time being.
Falcon Acoustics have 12" Peerless SLS-315 drivers in stock at £76.74 with an Fs of 31hz (datasheet below) which could be a possibility. Their next cheapest 12" is way out of my price league so that's limited my options there.
Thank god I've ordered the amplifier, already have the required minidsp, and have been hoarding wood, or I'd be on the verge of thinking sod it and ordering a BK for £300-400. I really want to take this first step into DIY audio though, so I'm not regretting anything.
I'm still planning on two 12" driver sealed cabinets powered by an A800. My quest for deep, articulate, but not particularly loud bass continues!
Perhaps I should be looking harder at a single 12? I rather like the idea that (again correct me if I'm wrong) I should be able to optimise the frequency response over a wider area of the room with two subwoofers though, as this room has a variety of different listening positions.
It's a bedroom with two sets of speakers and listening is done from anywhere on a super-king size bed. I've one nice set of bookshelves which I will be optimising this all for, and one ancient pair of my first speakers... Some floorstanders that blew my mind 20 years ago, much less so now, but who can throw away their first love hifi speakers eh?
Is it best to keep the drivers the same size? I'd really rather not go for twin 10" subwoofers on my budget, but, well... I'm not the expert.
To save anyone reading back the whole thread, my speakers roll off about 40-50hz, and I don't need volume, just depth and control. Getting a f3 in room that's in the sub 30 Hz area (but the deeper the better obviously), and maintaining a nice tight bass is my aim. It's a 6x3.5m room, so no huge space to fill.
I should add one final statement... I am not against upgrading the drivers a ways down the line. I'm sure I can always find a use for a couple old sub drivers.
Blue Aran seem rather low on 12" drivers in stock with a Fs below 50hz (correct me if I'm wrong, but wanting deep bass this doesn't to be what I'm looking for) so they're out for the time being.
Falcon Acoustics have 12" Peerless SLS-315 drivers in stock at £76.74 with an Fs of 31hz (datasheet below) which could be a possibility. Their next cheapest 12" is way out of my price league so that's limited my options there.
Thank god I've ordered the amplifier, already have the required minidsp, and have been hoarding wood, or I'd be on the verge of thinking sod it and ordering a BK for £300-400. I really want to take this first step into DIY audio though, so I'm not regretting anything.
I'm still planning on two 12" driver sealed cabinets powered by an A800. My quest for deep, articulate, but not particularly loud bass continues!
Perhaps I should be looking harder at a single 12? I rather like the idea that (again correct me if I'm wrong) I should be able to optimise the frequency response over a wider area of the room with two subwoofers though, as this room has a variety of different listening positions.
It's a bedroom with two sets of speakers and listening is done from anywhere on a super-king size bed. I've one nice set of bookshelves which I will be optimising this all for, and one ancient pair of my first speakers... Some floorstanders that blew my mind 20 years ago, much less so now, but who can throw away their first love hifi speakers eh?
Is it best to keep the drivers the same size? I'd really rather not go for twin 10" subwoofers on my budget, but, well... I'm not the expert.
To save anyone reading back the whole thread, my speakers roll off about 40-50hz, and I don't need volume, just depth and control. Getting a f3 in room that's in the sub 30 Hz area (but the deeper the better obviously), and maintaining a nice tight bass is my aim. It's a 6x3.5m room, so no huge space to fill.
I should add one final statement... I am not against upgrading the drivers a ways down the line. I'm sure I can always find a use for a couple old sub drivers.
Looks like the 15" version of what chris661 had up the top of the page. I'll have a peek about for the T/S specs and sim some stuff - Will PM you once I've figured out what they can do for me.
What were they doing for you?
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hi jjams82
for reference the materials for the sub i built came to <£300 not including speakers and cable. my one piece of advise to you is to use 25mm structural ply(or double up your reclaimed, glue and screw), about £60 per 8x4 sheet, but well worth the money.
pictures on this thread \|/
What are some of the best methods for getting loudspeaker box square
for reference the materials for the sub i built came to <£300 not including speakers and cable. my one piece of advise to you is to use 25mm structural ply(or double up your reclaimed, glue and screw), about £60 per 8x4 sheet, but well worth the money.
pictures on this thread \|/
What are some of the best methods for getting loudspeaker box square
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Warning: 02:30-03:00 mindless ramble follows....
ga77a:
Ta for the link... I'll read it in the morning when I'm a bit more awake.
As far as thickness and wood quality goes: Current plan is to make the basic box out of the reclaimed stuff -there's varying quality but I'm fairly certain I can get enough of the good stuff to make most of the box. It's all 15mm, save for, I think (hope) two bits of 25mm that's tough as nails which I hope I'll have enough of for the baffle side. That'll be glued and screwed with all the bracing etc, then I hope to only glue the engineered flooring (also 15mm) on top, precise enough to look good, if I'm lucky. Perhaps find some really short screws and go get at it from the inside.
So... The thinnest anything will be is 30mm, and anywhere I have to use the worse quality wood, well, I'm not sure - maybe double it up for a total of 45mm thick? That sounds a bit much - I reckon I'll probably just end up going for a lot of bracing in any areas where I don't have enough of the tho quality wood.
Reckon that sounds ok?
I'm aiming for sealed unless I can't get the loe frequency extension I want within my budget, then I'd consider ported. Or maybe one 10" sealed for sort of 35-50hz ish, then a ported 12 (or 15?) crossed over to handle the real lows... This is rather getting away from my original plan though - two simple sealed 12's, punchy as possible for pure hifil rather than cinema. Perhaps I'd be better with two 10's indeed, That's still more cone area than the single 12 that does plenty well enough in my living room. Keep it simple, dumbass - first speaker build after all!
I don't even know what I'm rambling about now. Semi asleep.
I'm also planning on making them down firing, since my GF has bought her cat with her. I don't trust/know it well enough to stick two expensive drivers on show for her to get her claws into if she likes the smell of it.
time to hit submit and hope it erreaorppo''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''' Woah, fell asleep there. Feck it, it's giong onooii... SOMNOT REPLU!!!
ga77a:
Ta for the link... I'll read it in the morning when I'm a bit more awake.
As far as thickness and wood quality goes: Current plan is to make the basic box out of the reclaimed stuff -there's varying quality but I'm fairly certain I can get enough of the good stuff to make most of the box. It's all 15mm, save for, I think (hope) two bits of 25mm that's tough as nails which I hope I'll have enough of for the baffle side. That'll be glued and screwed with all the bracing etc, then I hope to only glue the engineered flooring (also 15mm) on top, precise enough to look good, if I'm lucky. Perhaps find some really short screws and go get at it from the inside.
So... The thinnest anything will be is 30mm, and anywhere I have to use the worse quality wood, well, I'm not sure - maybe double it up for a total of 45mm thick? That sounds a bit much - I reckon I'll probably just end up going for a lot of bracing in any areas where I don't have enough of the tho quality wood.
Reckon that sounds ok?
I'm aiming for sealed unless I can't get the loe frequency extension I want within my budget, then I'd consider ported. Or maybe one 10" sealed for sort of 35-50hz ish, then a ported 12 (or 15?) crossed over to handle the real lows... This is rather getting away from my original plan though - two simple sealed 12's, punchy as possible for pure hifil rather than cinema. Perhaps I'd be better with two 10's indeed, That's still more cone area than the single 12 that does plenty well enough in my living room. Keep it simple, dumbass - first speaker build after all!
I don't even know what I'm rambling about now. Semi asleep.
I'm also planning on making them down firing, since my GF has bought her cat with her. I don't trust/know it well enough to stick two expensive drivers on show for her to get her claws into if she likes the smell of it.
time to hit submit and hope it erreaorppo''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''' Woah, fell asleep there. Feck it, it's giong onooii... SOMNOT REPLU!!!
in the link my post is the last one, see pics.
personally i have 15"s(1 firing down and 1 firing out) and think they sound good(30hz no problem), but some would say its better to have 2x 10"
i think 15mm x2 glued and screwed will be fine.
i have many years experience in construction industry, if you need any advise give me a shout.
good luck and post pics of your creation
regards
gaz
personally i have 15"s(1 firing down and 1 firing out) and think they sound good(30hz no problem), but some would say its better to have 2x 10"
i think 15mm x2 glued and screwed will be fine.
i have many years experience in construction industry, if you need any advise give me a shout.
good luck and post pics of your creation
regards
gaz
She got it because I thought it's better than just storing the setup in the garage
Didn't have the heart to get rid of it.
I really like favela jazz + d'n'b combo sometimes, goes so nice together with a beer in the sun.
Hoping this quarantine stuff blows over soon so I can invite friends and neighbours for a Beer+BBQ, put my big speakers on the terrace and pump out some dub/reggae choons.
jjams, 100 quid for a couple 15" is a no-brainer. for a sealed box you want max membrane area + xmax combo you can get for the money. You got the DSP thing to help get into the low stuff anyway, your biggest concern is power, but anything over 100 clean watts should get you in a good place.
Sorry about that last post - I was slowly falling asleep as I wrote it... Last thing I did was realise i was starting to make no sense and hit "submit reply".
@ga77a - Ta for the info / offer of more construction advice. I like your "tetrahedron" by the way
@Studley - Sorry for not getting back to you yet - major busy time in work, and at home. Fields have been ploughed and sown, my car has developed a problem I've not had time to fix yet because always tired from work, and house problems have taken up the rest of my time. No awake sane time to check T/s on 'em etc, no time to do jack. I'll pop you a quick PM after posting this just to get started.
I've a minor problem in that my GF* is at very high risk of all this corona stuff (organ transplant as a baby), so I've been avoiding everyone and everything. Driving a long way to get speakers may or may not be a wise idea... I'm already leaving parcels where they're dropped off in the greenhouse for a day or two. It's a long story but that's as short as I can make it.
Oh, and my only reliable car is the broken one. Christ - farm life. Great eh.
*She makes up for all that by having a WAF of "doesn't care what I put wherever I want for audio." Every time I read WAF I think to myself "you married someone who won't let you pursue your passions in life? That's the wrong woman!"
@KaffiMann - "better than just storing the setup in the garage" - Hell yeah it is!!
I've got a Behringer A800 sitting in its box saying "need input" every so often and begging for something to power - it claims 2 x 400 into 4ohm - 2 x 220 into 8ohm. Now, if that's marketing lies from Behringer or not, and how clean it really is, all remains to be seen - what I do know is that it's relatively inexpensive, and isn't fan cooled. I'm sensitive to "what's that noise coming from... wait... over there?.." type stuff. Anyways, I digress - those 15's may not be so good until I get my reliable car (a 2 seater petrol eating convertible with bugger all space) sorted out, and it's a bank holiday, and the whole GF thing...
So far, I'm only into this project for:
Amp - £140
miniDSP - £75
Wood - £0
Screws - £?? - had them for years in a box.
Speaker cable, terminal plates etc: £?? no idea but not much.
I might be starting to find the value in DIY.
@ga77a - Ta for the info / offer of more construction advice. I like your "tetrahedron" by the way
@Studley - Sorry for not getting back to you yet - major busy time in work, and at home. Fields have been ploughed and sown, my car has developed a problem I've not had time to fix yet because always tired from work, and house problems have taken up the rest of my time. No awake sane time to check T/s on 'em etc, no time to do jack. I'll pop you a quick PM after posting this just to get started.
I've a minor problem in that my GF* is at very high risk of all this corona stuff (organ transplant as a baby), so I've been avoiding everyone and everything. Driving a long way to get speakers may or may not be a wise idea... I'm already leaving parcels where they're dropped off in the greenhouse for a day or two. It's a long story but that's as short as I can make it.
Oh, and my only reliable car is the broken one. Christ - farm life. Great eh.
*She makes up for all that by having a WAF of "doesn't care what I put wherever I want for audio." Every time I read WAF I think to myself "you married someone who won't let you pursue your passions in life? That's the wrong woman!"
@KaffiMann - "better than just storing the setup in the garage" - Hell yeah it is!!
I've got a Behringer A800 sitting in its box saying "need input" every so often and begging for something to power - it claims 2 x 400 into 4ohm - 2 x 220 into 8ohm. Now, if that's marketing lies from Behringer or not, and how clean it really is, all remains to be seen - what I do know is that it's relatively inexpensive, and isn't fan cooled. I'm sensitive to "what's that noise coming from... wait... over there?.." type stuff. Anyways, I digress - those 15's may not be so good until I get my reliable car (a 2 seater petrol eating convertible with bugger all space) sorted out, and it's a bank holiday, and the whole GF thing...
So far, I'm only into this project for:
Amp - £140
miniDSP - £75
Wood - £0
Screws - £?? - had them for years in a box.
Speaker cable, terminal plates etc: £?? no idea but not much.
I might be starting to find the value in DIY.
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Hope that life thing works out for you.
Having someone that can tolerate a bit of "silly hobbies" is pure gold.
There's 4 x Beyma 12BR70 available in the bluearan shop, spec says xmax at 8mm. But it does not matter which driver it is, you want xmax + membrane area first and foremost. If it's also a driver with low fs, that's a bonus but it's not that important for your use.
Having someone that can tolerate a bit of "silly hobbies" is pure gold.
There's 4 x Beyma 12BR70 available in the bluearan shop, spec says xmax at 8mm. But it does not matter which driver it is, you want xmax + membrane area first and foremost. If it's also a driver with low fs, that's a bonus but it's not that important for your use.
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Well, this past Sunday I went on an essential journey North East a little, which as luck would have it, went not fast from the home of Studley.
So it seemed to make sense to pick up those two JBL 15's.
They're still in quarantine still, GF situation as it is. Thanks Ian for being so excellent about that btw, and any other day I'd have been begging to hear your system - I've never heard electrostats before.
I believe I now have just about all the pieces in place for this project. I'm sure there'll be something I haven't thought of but should be able to scrounge from the farm - it's dam well close enough for jazz though.
Time to start properly designing a cabinet I think.
Only regret so far is that the slightly cheaper Behringer KM750 also puts out an alleged 2x400 into 4Ω, is also fanless, but has input sensitivity switches. I noticed too late that the miniDSP 2x4 only puts out .9v per RCA and it'd have been nice to be able to adjust the amplifier input sensitivity to compensate as well as possible. Ahh well, If I ever decide to make a pair of 10" or 12" subs for elsewhere in the house... Or bridge-power 800w into one of these 15's downstairs for, according to the most basic online box calculator I have bookmarked, an f3 of 20hz in a 211l Butterworth B4 Ported cab (whatever one of those is)... I can buy that one and swap it out for this A800, if it's even a noticeable problem?
It'll be slow going on this now, back in work today at some point, but I'll pop some pics up here and there on the way so people can tell me if I'm making any idiotic moves.
Anyways, my main question is answered. I've put £315 into this project so far (not including screws and speaker cable) but I hope, so long as I don't make a hash of these boxes, I might be outperforming a £300 B.K. XLS200? Touch wood. Either way, it's been fun learning about it, and there's plenty more learning to come.
So it seemed to make sense to pick up those two JBL 15's.
They're still in quarantine still, GF situation as it is. Thanks Ian for being so excellent about that btw, and any other day I'd have been begging to hear your system - I've never heard electrostats before.
I believe I now have just about all the pieces in place for this project. I'm sure there'll be something I haven't thought of but should be able to scrounge from the farm - it's dam well close enough for jazz though.
Time to start properly designing a cabinet I think.
Only regret so far is that the slightly cheaper Behringer KM750 also puts out an alleged 2x400 into 4Ω, is also fanless, but has input sensitivity switches. I noticed too late that the miniDSP 2x4 only puts out .9v per RCA and it'd have been nice to be able to adjust the amplifier input sensitivity to compensate as well as possible. Ahh well, If I ever decide to make a pair of 10" or 12" subs for elsewhere in the house... Or bridge-power 800w into one of these 15's downstairs for, according to the most basic online box calculator I have bookmarked, an f3 of 20hz in a 211l Butterworth B4 Ported cab (whatever one of those is)... I can buy that one and swap it out for this A800, if it's even a noticeable problem?
It'll be slow going on this now, back in work today at some point, but I'll pop some pics up here and there on the way so people can tell me if I'm making any idiotic moves.
Anyways, my main question is answered. I've put £315 into this project so far (not including screws and speaker cable) but I hope, so long as I don't make a hash of these boxes, I might be outperforming a £300 B.K. XLS200? Touch wood. Either way, it's been fun learning about it, and there's plenty more learning to come.