For Sub duty, those Pro amps offer the best bang for the buck, I believe.
About the fan, it is usually very easy to replace a noisy cheap fan with a Noctua fan of the same size. The Noctua's are virtually silent.
Byrtt,
The difference is that Bassboxx pro has the option to include damping material in the simulation when you model the box completely stuffed the size of the box needed is actually much smaller.
If I take the damping out I get this which is much closer to what you had.
Troels did some measurements at the bottom of this page
Port Calculation
It shows that you do need to factor the stuffing into the model if you want the box to behave in a certain way. With a linkwitz transform you can make almost any practical box have whatever Q and response you want with the trade off of maximum spl.
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Crown are good brand. If you don't need the plate amp features just bolt a UCD module and power supply to an aluminium plate, use the connection kit and you are good to go. They are a very easy DIY option.
A 4Ohm woofer is a better choice as it is difficult for many amps to supply the current needed to get more than a few hundred watts at 8 ohms.
A UCD400 is good for about 300 watts at 4 ohm before distortion rises. Maybe about 200 watts at 8ohm.
UCD700 is good to 600W 4 ohm but only 300W 8 ohm.
You can use two modules connected to the same power supply to save money. This is two UCD 400 modules connected to a 1200W power supply. Heatsink is complete overkill but I had it already.
The low noise fans are a good choice for any amp that has a fan built in but even low noise fans can be heard if the rpm is high enough. A bigger fan at low rpm is a better choice if possible although not really an option with a ready built amp.
The cheaper models will probably use a small fan at high rpm to save money.
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The SEAS 10" aluminium woofers are not as low mass at 173g but they have a lot of x-max and x-mech and they can certainly shift some air as they have greater power handling than some of the other hifi type subs. A very flat response for a sub too.
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The SEAS 10" aluminium woofers are not as low mass at 173g but they have a lot of x-max and x-mech and they can certainly shift some air as they have greater power handling than some of the other hifi type subs. A very flat response for a sub too.
X-max is defined as p-p, so one way it would be 14mm right? That would mean you'd start missing some cone area compared to the bigger ones. A duo would be fun on each side but it's too big for me.
Crown are good brand. If you don't need the plate amp features just bolt a UCD module and power supply to an aluminium plate, use the connection kit and you are good to go. They are a very easy DIY option.
A 4Ohm woofer is a better choice as it is difficult for many amps to supply the current needed to get more than a few hundred watts at 8 ohms.
A UCD400 is good for about 300 watts at 4 ohm before distortion rises. Maybe about 200 watts at 8ohm.
UCD700 is good to 600W 4 ohm but only 300W 8 ohm.
You can use two modules connected to the same power supply to save money. This is two UCD 400 modules connected to a 1200W power supply. Heatsink is complete overkill but I had it already.
The low noise fans are a good choice for any amp that has a fan built in but even low noise fans can be heard if the rpm is high enough. A bigger fan at low rpm is a better choice if possible although not really an option with a ready built amp.
The cheaper models will probably use a small fan at high rpm to save money.
This seems like a valid option. Good point about going with a 4 Ohm woofer. I haven't found any third party measurements on the BMS drivers yet. Hard to make up one's mind this way
.The seas is on the high range in inductance.
The BMS exist in 4 ohm as already said, in special order. It's seems a modern driver. I can only see the lack of silicon spider.
Do you want me to call the french (and european) provider to ask them what this "special" term mean ? Should be condition of quantities, or time to provide, or price... Maybe they could ask some more data to bms too (they got some klippel measurement sometime for example for SICA drivers).
The BMS exist in 4 ohm as already said, in special order. It's seems a modern driver. I can only see the lack of silicon spider.
Do you want me to call the french (and european) provider to ask them what this "special" term mean ? Should be condition of quantities, or time to provide, or price... Maybe they could ask some more data to bms too (they got some klippel measurement sometime for example for SICA drivers).
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Yep 14mm would be the usual figure. They are very similar in maximum output compared to the Scan 30W, the SEAS can take more power so it evens out. Yellow is SEAS orange is Scan.
I'm not sure of the price you could get them for so they may not be any more attractive than the other choices, they certainly cost me a lot to ship to Australia from the UK!
They are a very well made driver, I have four in open baffle in the LX521 and they can produce a lot of very low bass in room.
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I think that could be a typo in the datasheet as bassboxx pro has Le listed at 0.6mH and the extended frequency response seems at odds with a driver that has an Le of 3.85 mH.
Yes sorry about not reacting sooner, I did catch that they were available in 4 Ohms. It would be interesting to know more about the availability. I did see the 4 Ohm on a French site, is that the one? One thing is for sure, my French would get me nowhere
.If you can dig up some info it would be awesome. I think realistically speaking 4 ohm would keep things more affordable.
You could also fit two of these in a 40 litre box one on each side to minimise the height requirement as they don't need much space, that would send your Sd in the right direction but the price would possibly be too much
Yes sorry about not reacting sooner, I did catch that they were available in 4 Ohms. It would be interesting to know more about the availability. I did see the 4 Ohm on a French site, is that the one? One thing is for sure, my French would get me nowhere
If you can dig up some info it would be awesome. I think realistically speaking 4 ohm would keep things more affordable.
BMS are responsive to technical queries they have answered all my questions when I have contacted them directly by email. Worth a try if you want to know something that isn't in the datasheet.
@wesayso - i bought a Xli800 for 12" JBL car subwoofer put in 60l sealed box.
The Crown is cheap but it has a fan (at this moment it is silent but running from power on..who knows after 1year if it will be silent?) and i think the input is not filtered RF because I have sometimes problems with noise it picks from computer (although at this moment i can't say exactly it is the Crown fault.. )
The Crown is cheap but it has a fan (at this moment it is silent but running from power on..who knows after 1year if it will be silent?) and i think the input is not filtered RF because I have sometimes problems with noise it picks from computer (although at this moment i can't say exactly it is the Crown fault.. )
Good to know. BMS should be even more responsive if it is asked by a reseller. And reseller should be responsive from french client doing some free advertising on a international forum ^^ I'll call them this very afternoon. Hornresp should be more interresting for siming (phase). I can help.
Wesayo, can you confirm size of box, vented/closed, and prefered f-3/f-6 (personnally i would go 4th bandpass as it filter acousticly distortion and can be tweak to don't need any high pass for over-excursion, in exchange of the 4th order impulse ringing that you should counter act with FIR). Maybe FIR in low range is harder...?
Does mono sub is a eventuality ?
If lows are omni, their distortion signature aren't...All a matter of choice.
Wesayo, can you confirm size of box, vented/closed, and prefered f-3/f-6 (personnally i would go 4th bandpass as it filter acousticly distortion and can be tweak to don't need any high pass for over-excursion, in exchange of the 4th order impulse ringing that you should counter act with FIR). Maybe FIR in low range is harder...?
Does mono sub is a eventuality ?
If lows are omni, their distortion signature aren't...All a matter of choice.
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L26ROY / L26RO4Y. 2 layer copper voicecoil difference => different mms/qes...
I'd like to keep stereo suns to have more chance to get the woofers on both sides help out each line. Bandpass would probably cut the usable range short somewhere, meaning it would be limited in what it can do in the upper ranges or lower ones. Down firing might give a band pass option. I still need to check actual size, one thing is certain, it's small.
Ported is out, unless the port is contributing really low in frequency, FIR filtering is great, but needing less of it is always the better way to go. I'd like to be able to use 20 Hz to ~100 Hz. Not really to play any louder, but to have more headroom and hopefully the ability to smooth out each side separately in timing.
See this graph:
This is what I run now. To keep within limits.
I used to have that rising low end down to ~27 Hz before backing off. This gets me in trouble on some material. I'd like to gain it back as the atmosphere feel it gave was better.
This is what I had before:
Pure subjectively, I liked that one better. I only need a little help, I ran this for quite some time. But I'm close to the limits of what my amp can actually deliver and running out of digital headroom. Next will be exceeding x-max on those tiny 50 subs I use
. No chance I can have this graph and play HT material at the same level as music.
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Simed so much time, and forgot, true 4th bandpass (with front chamber) is not interesting below 30-40hz in such configuration, nothing to gain. Efficiency gain is only around bandpass tuning low corner.
BMS12S305 8ohm measurements :
[Projet LCR] 2 voies BMS 12S305 _ RCF ND650 1.4" - Page 3 - 30074928 - sur le forum Enceintes - 1464 - du site Homecinema-fr.com
Lots of info. First graph is 1w, 25ms windows, closed 40L. Distortion plot is at 114db 400hz around 100w. 550hz hollow is plate vibration (seen on waterfall too). I just translate what is readen, and important.
Measurement download link : http://dl.free.fr/jE6hoviVu
BMS12S305 8ohm measurements :
[Projet LCR] 2 voies BMS 12S305 _ RCF ND650 1.4" - Page 3 - 30074928 - sur le forum Enceintes - 1464 - du site Homecinema-fr.com
Lots of info. First graph is 1w, 25ms windows, closed 40L. Distortion plot is at 114db 400hz around 100w. 550hz hollow is plate vibration (seen on waterfall too). I just translate what is readen, and important.
Measurement download link : http://dl.free.fr/jE6hoviVu
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@wesayso.
Finally pulled myself together and took an impedance plot of my arrays .
The reference resistor was not non-inductive (47 Ohm // 1mH) therefore the drop in the top.
Have just ordered some 20 Ohm non-inductive, so stay tuned.
The plot clearly shows that the volumen is too small, which I already knew, as the dimensions of the alu-tubing couldn't be changed, but otherwise I think it is pretty clean.
No serious abrupt wrinkles, although there are some small and broad deviations.
What do you think?
Finally pulled myself together and took an impedance plot of my arrays .
The reference resistor was not non-inductive (47 Ohm // 1mH) therefore the drop in the top.
Have just ordered some 20 Ohm non-inductive, so stay tuned.
The plot clearly shows that the volumen is too small, which I already knew, as the dimensions of the alu-tubing couldn't be changed, but otherwise I think it is pretty clean.
No serious abrupt wrinkles, although there are some small and broad deviations.
What do you think?
