EC8010:
So you're blaming the US for the fact that your students like Big Macs instead of French cuisine?
Okay, I don't like MacDonald's either. Never eat there. I resent the fact that their advertising acts like this company is the All-American Thing and that there is something wrong with you if you don't cram their glop down your gullet.
Did you know that when the Beatles hit America, most Americans had never even heard of MacDonald's? Yet their advertising would haave you believe that it was the first place the Pilgrims went when they hit Plymouth rock. The company is obnoxious.
However, ultimately, your country is responsible for what you eat.
May I point out that the same argument that you used here was used against Elvis those many years ago? Debasing the public taste and all that?
People will buy and eat what they will.
So you're blaming the US for the fact that your students like Big Macs instead of French cuisine?
Okay, I don't like MacDonald's either. Never eat there. I resent the fact that their advertising acts like this company is the All-American Thing and that there is something wrong with you if you don't cram their glop down your gullet.
Did you know that when the Beatles hit America, most Americans had never even heard of MacDonald's? Yet their advertising would haave you believe that it was the first place the Pilgrims went when they hit Plymouth rock. The company is obnoxious.
However, ultimately, your country is responsible for what you eat.
May I point out that the same argument that you used here was used against Elvis those many years ago? Debasing the public taste and all that?
People will buy and eat what they will.
Yes, we're so culturally poor that many countries (like France and Canada) have had to impose legal requirements on broadcast media to insure that their content (by popular demand, no less) would not become nearly 100% American. In the past century, America has given the world jazz and blues. Europe has given the world techno and punk. Thanks, I'll go American on that one.
Frankly, the greatest marketing campaigns in the universe will never convince people to eat stuff they don't like, to see movies that don't appeal to them, to attend concerts playing music they don't enjoy. McD's long-term success is NOT their advertising and product positioning- those are only the means by which they get someone to try their stuff once. What keeps people coming back is that they're providing a product that people want. Nothing kills a bad product faster than good marketing.
And to forestall any personalizing of this, I don't work for Mickey D's and, as a lifelong vegetarian, I don't eat there, either.
Frankly, the greatest marketing campaigns in the universe will never convince people to eat stuff they don't like, to see movies that don't appeal to them, to attend concerts playing music they don't enjoy. McD's long-term success is NOT their advertising and product positioning- those are only the means by which they get someone to try their stuff once. What keeps people coming back is that they're providing a product that people want. Nothing kills a bad product faster than good marketing.
And to forestall any personalizing of this, I don't work for Mickey D's and, as a lifelong vegetarian, I don't eat there, either.
Yes America has given the world Jazz and blues, I like. Black people have provide this music i.e. American minority, and honestly you cannot state that people came back to McD’s because they provide good food.
"Good food" is a subjective judgement- people go back to McD's because they provide something that people like. Cuissses de grenouille may be your idea of good food, but others strongly disagree. (For the record, my favorite two restaurants on Earth are Maison Borie in Lyon and Slanted Door in San Francisco)
Jazz is not strictly a "black" music. Like everything else American, it is a melange of influences from many, many different kinds of people. For every Sidney Bechet, there's a Benny Goodman. For every Art Tatum, there's a Lennie Tristano. For every Sun Ra, there's a Toshiko Akioshi. For every Fats Navarro, there's a Chet Baker. Jews, Japanese, Italians, English... all Americans. It's our strength.
Jazz is not strictly a "black" music. Like everything else American, it is a melange of influences from many, many different kinds of people. For every Sidney Bechet, there's a Benny Goodman. For every Art Tatum, there's a Lennie Tristano. For every Sun Ra, there's a Toshiko Akioshi. For every Fats Navarro, there's a Chet Baker. Jews, Japanese, Italians, English... all Americans. It's our strength.
Yes "good food” is a subjective judgement like the reasons who makes people go back to McDs. And Jazz and Blues were never BORN in Hollywood and without the black minority.
i think that canada (and possibly, france) instituted those legal restrictions on american broadcasting in our country in order to preserve at least some semblance of cultural integrity in the face of the american cultural juggernaut. not necessarily because it is so popular, but because it is so relentless, omnipresent and well funded. there is just no way that the canadian broadcast company can meet the advertising budget of fox, although it can be argued that it is quite capable of meeting or surpassing it in terms of content. also, being an immensely successful 'pitchman' to the lowest common denominators of sex, violence and gluttony should hardly be an accomplishment worthy of trumpeting.
Another interesting point is, how many of your artists are willing go go to a senseless war with a not democratic legitimated president. How many of this american artists are of the same simple minded kind like the "masses" seems to be according to what news from USA says? How many of them trust in a ill person, guided by some kind of pseudo religios Illusion, one who seems to belive he is something like a god?
i have the impression a lot of the amerikan elite thinks another way than media and goverment likes. Ask Patty Smith, Ask Dustin Hoffman (He sayd some interesting words in Berlin yesterday), ask Bob Geldorf...
i have the impression a lot of the amerikan elite thinks another way than media and goverment likes. Ask Patty Smith, Ask Dustin Hoffman (He sayd some interesting words in Berlin yesterday), ask Bob Geldorf...
At the moment we need some new laws against american information on TV - to ensure the news say more than what they are told by Mr. Bush´s propaganda agency.
1984.
JAZZY FRANKY.
Hi,
While some of the "not Black" jazz musicians are undoubtedly great musicians,most of them didn't have that little something that the Black jazz musicians have.
Call it a sense for rythm or whatever...to my ears this is the magic I hear in black music,it is rythmically correct no matter how seemingly complex things get.
That's a bit shortsighted, wouldn't you say?
Punk is as good as dead and I don't think techno will last another ten years either.
Sy,
Am I to understand you don't appreciate les cuisses? What about escargots?
Naturally being a vegetarian has its' limitations and I certainly wouldn't enforce any meal on someone.
Here these are delicacies however.
Some people don't like oysters either...😉
P.S.May I recommend "des oeufs d'oursins" next time you're in Lyon?
Cheers,😉
Hi,
While some of the "not Black" jazz musicians are undoubtedly great musicians,most of them didn't have that little something that the Black jazz musicians have.
Call it a sense for rythm or whatever...to my ears this is the magic I hear in black music,it is rythmically correct no matter how seemingly complex things get.
That's a bit shortsighted, wouldn't you say?
Punk is as good as dead and I don't think techno will last another ten years either.
Sy,
Am I to understand you don't appreciate les cuisses? What about escargots?
Naturally being a vegetarian has its' limitations and I certainly wouldn't enforce any meal on someone.
Here these are delicacies however.
Some people don't like oysters either...😉
P.S.May I recommend "des oeufs d'oursins" next time you're in Lyon?
Cheers,😉
How trite and predictable ...
The "peace" thread turns to hollow cries of American cultural imperialism, with the obligatory "reminders" that it is American minorities that provided the good bits of American culture.
(sigh) There's nothing new under God's old sky.
The "peace" thread turns to hollow cries of American cultural imperialism, with the obligatory "reminders" that it is American minorities that provided the good bits of American culture.
(sigh) There's nothing new under God's old sky.
joe dick said:
There is also the problem that american companies often refuse
to sell single TV series or films, but require that the buyer buys
a whole package including a lot of stuff they don't really want.
however, having had to pay for that other stuff, they are more
or less forced to show it for economical reasons.
The sad thing here in Sweden is that while we still have our two
state-owned TV channels, these have, in my opinion, lowered
their average program quality since we got commercial TV
channels. It seem they feel they have to send a lot of crap
programs to compete with the commercial channels. They still
have a decent amount of good programs, though.
I think, by the way, that we should be careful to point out that
this discussion is rather about certain american companies and
not the US foreign policy, which this thread was really about.
There are companys behaving bad also in European countries,
but the american ones are usually much bigger and more
aggressive in marketing.
Frank: No, I don't eat les cuisses for ethical reasons. My point was not about my own tastes, it was that people who DO eat animals by and large don't share the French taste for the creepy-crawlie ones. I understand that oysters have the texture of phlegm- lovely. Though I shouldn't talk, since I adore truffles, the smell of which drives my wife out of the house.
Joe and till: In order for me to understand your argument, I'd have to believe that US companies purchase the bulk of advetising on French radio. They don't. I've heard French rap- after that experience, I am going to be difficult to be persuaded by arguments about "cultural integrity."
And, till, though I didn't vote for him nor do I support the vast majority of his policies, Bush was elected in accordance with the rules of our Constitution. Calling that "not democratic" is incorrect- it IS democratic republicanism (lower case, not party names). Bush won the majority of democratically elected electoral college votes.
I don't take seriously the political rantings of actors and pop musicians, no matter which side they're on.
Joe and till: In order for me to understand your argument, I'd have to believe that US companies purchase the bulk of advetising on French radio. They don't. I've heard French rap- after that experience, I am going to be difficult to be persuaded by arguments about "cultural integrity."
And, till, though I didn't vote for him nor do I support the vast majority of his policies, Bush was elected in accordance with the rules of our Constitution. Calling that "not democratic" is incorrect- it IS democratic republicanism (lower case, not party names). Bush won the majority of democratically elected electoral college votes.
I don't take seriously the political rantings of actors and pop musicians, no matter which side they're on.
Re: How trite and predictable ...
Yes, that is the point! you just look at it a different way to the rest of the world, and that is the problem!mirlo said:
Re: Homogenizing the World
For Years the USA has been one of the best, and some times the ONLY, Nation(s) to have the means to deal with these types of situations. Unlike many other countries, We will play as a "Team Player" when it is possible to do so, but We will also have the will(And the means) to "Go it alone" if need be. We will ask for help, But We do not need permission to do what We feel is correct for Our countries interests. If this sounds "Bostfull", Too Bad!
I for one, am sick of the USA bashing done by the very people We have saved from the "Gates of Hell" time, and time again. Only to be thanked by Them putting down the very people Who fought and gave Their lives to free strangers.
Ultimate, Maybe. Best I've seen Yet.
Sustainable, Don't know. If We don't get rid of all of the wanna' be euro-trash thinking Liberals........Doubtfull.
As for Our system, It's really simple(When not corrupted from it's intended form by the above^^)........It's called freedom.
Lets see............... been here for just about 227 years ........Yet.........Worlds lone superpower.........
Powered air flight............................... Space flight including landing Men (Not just Man) on the moon .................. The transistor, the Integrated circuit & computers ...................... A.C. power .................... Motion pictures(Bad choice!) and T.V. (second bad choice!) .................SAVING EUROPE TWICE IN ONE 50 YEAR SPAN! ................................The list goes on and on.......
Why, if We are so screwed-up, do We manage to always do things no one else can do??? HHHUUUMMMMM??????
Some one has to Be the "Top Dog" in the pound.
You guys just don't "Cut the Mustard".
traderbam said:
For Years the USA has been one of the best, and some times the ONLY, Nation(s) to have the means to deal with these types of situations. Unlike many other countries, We will play as a "Team Player" when it is possible to do so, but We will also have the will(And the means) to "Go it alone" if need be. We will ask for help, But We do not need permission to do what We feel is correct for Our countries interests. If this sounds "Bostfull", Too Bad!
I for one, am sick of the USA bashing done by the very people We have saved from the "Gates of Hell" time, and time again. Only to be thanked by Them putting down the very people Who fought and gave Their lives to free strangers.
traderbam said:
Ultimate, Maybe. Best I've seen Yet.
Sustainable, Don't know. If We don't get rid of all of the wanna' be euro-trash thinking Liberals........Doubtfull.
As for Our system, It's really simple(When not corrupted from it's intended form by the above^^)........It's called freedom.
traderbam said:
Lets see............... been here for just about 227 years ........Yet.........Worlds lone superpower.........
Powered air flight............................... Space flight including landing Men (Not just Man) on the moon .................. The transistor, the Integrated circuit & computers ...................... A.C. power .................... Motion pictures(Bad choice!) and T.V. (second bad choice!) .................SAVING EUROPE TWICE IN ONE 50 YEAR SPAN! ................................The list goes on and on.......
Why, if We are so screwed-up, do We manage to always do things no one else can do??? HHHUUUMMMMM??????
Some one has to Be the "Top Dog" in the pound.
You guys just don't "Cut the Mustard".
RAP.
Hi,
Agreed,that is a joke just as a lot of other cultural travesty for commercial reasons.
Most artists tend to be left wing I'd say?
Sure,don't let anyone tell you what to eat.Pretty kosher in my book.
BTW,I think that very few frogs are eaten outside the restaurant anyway.
Cheers,😉
Hi,
Agreed,that is a joke just as a lot of other cultural travesty for commercial reasons.
Most artists tend to be left wing I'd say?
Sure,don't let anyone tell you what to eat.Pretty kosher in my book.
BTW,I think that very few frogs are eaten outside the restaurant anyway.
Cheers,😉
As far as i know he "won" the election in a courthouse...
I don´t listen to stuff like that - not from france, germany or USA. If you really want to make the point, the nation who has the largest cultural horizont shall rule the world, i put against you Jazz and blues: J.S.Bach, Beethoven, G.P. Telemann, Hegel, Kant, Nietsche, Schiller, Goethe...
I have northing against amerika or his culture. I belive the time of national cultur has gone. There is a lot of influence from "old european" culture on culture in both amerikas. But: my goal is not everyone should speak english (and don´t know Nietsche and Hegel...), I would have no problem if everyone would speak german or french now. (only one - i would have to learn much more french)
eating frogs - better to kill an arab than to eat a frog ? better to kill an afghani than to eat an animal ?
Bush <=> Caligula.
Bush <=> Caligula.
HMMM...
Hi,
Isn't it so that throughout the U.S. you also encounter different cultures?
From state to state and even within the same state?
While things change over time all over the world, I would like to preserve the worthwhile traditons of people,be that in the U.S.,Brazil or Europe for that matter.
There is always something worth preserving ans IMHO the globalisation of commerce will open the market for these cultural product worldwide...this isn't a bad thing IMO.
Languages can be a barrier, it is up to the individual to make the effort and cross that barrier.
English may be the language of choice for commerce and all things technical...just don't tell the French I said so.🙄
Ciao,😉
Hi,
Isn't it so that throughout the U.S. you also encounter different cultures?
From state to state and even within the same state?
While things change over time all over the world, I would like to preserve the worthwhile traditons of people,be that in the U.S.,Brazil or Europe for that matter.
There is always something worth preserving ans IMHO the globalisation of commerce will open the market for these cultural product worldwide...this isn't a bad thing IMO.
Languages can be a barrier, it is up to the individual to make the effort and cross that barrier.
English may be the language of choice for commerce and all things technical...just don't tell the French I said so.🙄
Ciao,😉
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