Foster plate amps and the RH84 monobloks. FH3 with FE126eN^2 + SDX7 sealed in stealthWoofers(tm)
dave
dave
B-2?
yup, mainly to annoy Dave and chris as they both stated that they thought this was a humdinger to me a couple of years ago (and I suspect that they secretly covet the Yamaha B-2 🙂 )
yup, mainly to annoy Dave and chris as they both stated that they thought this was a humdinger to me a couple of years ago (and I suspect that they secretly covet the Yamaha B-2 🙂 )
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just for crazies - would a 2.1 set up be of interest ? Keep those EL-70's in the onken boxes that they work so well in and add a mono supporting woofer based on a 15" Eminence alpha (popular driver for good reasons). With only one required the size of it is less restrictive - you can place it in the space between the EL70's. It has high sensitivity and large area - very likely to sound really good with gobs of trouser flapping 'punch'. In the size of room being used the need for stereo at low frequencies is less than it might be.
Oh, and it might look pretty darn cool too 😀
Oh, and it might look pretty darn cool too 😀
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Ripole woofer "enclosure" doesn't take a ton of room and may have some advantages here - you could probably get away with a 10" driver, and the total "cabinet" would likely take less space than the shipping box. The downside is efficiency ain't great - but this is not a big room.
Localization would dictate a lower xo, which may cause the el70 some strain from 80 to 120hz, but otherwise it would work good I think. Hmmm, in bass, more spots is better, so 1 sub might give a raged response compared to two. Worth considering though.
Hmmm...
So maybe the ticket is 4x EL70s in microTowers + single sub. As I said before, the microTowers really do dig deep. A single sub crossed over at 80 hz would avoid localization and there'd be 3 very solid bass sources in the room.
I have tried this with my crappy (cheap, commercial) HT subwoofer and my microTowers and the results were, well, far more bass than I need. Compared to 2x Mar-Kel70, I would imagine the bass difference would be "night and day".
Okay... So the options are:
1: Use the EL70eN and the SB 8" woofer in some kind of combined enclosure and XO actively at ?Hz
2: Build a microtower with EL70eN in front and EL70 on top and build an ordinary subwoofer and buy a plate amp.
I think the 1st option seems better, but that's just me... The thing is I don't want to use the EL70 for the bass, I want to XO them >100Hz to get more headroom and better midrange/treble.
1: Use the EL70eN and the SB 8" woofer in some kind of combined enclosure and XO actively at ?Hz
2: Build a microtower with EL70eN in front and EL70 on top and build an ordinary subwoofer and buy a plate amp.
I think the 1st option seems better, but that's just me... The thing is I don't want to use the EL70 for the bass, I want to XO them >100Hz to get more headroom and better midrange/treble.
for what it's worth...
...here's my suggestion (just my 2¢ worth) in list form (sorry again Dave, but it gets my idea across):
...here's my suggestion (just my 2¢ worth) in list form (sorry again Dave, but it gets my idea across):
- Using the upward firing/front firing set-up is the closest to what Castle had done in the Harlech, Winchester and Howard loudspeakers
- Use a style such as Bert D, where 2 tunings are used in the same enclosure
- if using any sub(s) I cannot state enough that there is bass localization that almost always occurs. This is why I always suggest 2 subs as a minimum.
- Good quality amps can be had relatively inexpensively. For the subs one could get a "pro audio" class D amp from Parts Express or similar at a low price, depending on the current requirements of the SD7 drivers.
- Cross the drivers at least an octave (or 2) above the fs of the MA drivers, and the same number of octaves below the fs of the SDX7s the same (if possible, but may not need to be strictly followed if using active amplification and asymmetrical adjustable slope crossover ) for the SDX7s.
Just a note, even thought this is the woofer that intrigues me, there are many good woofers out there that could satisfy. If you pick a configuration, you can then explore:
- size;
- driver;
- enclosure type;
- xo (I plan on buying a minidsp very soon);
- xo frequency;
- etc.
So come up with the concept first 😉
1st suggestion: Get the EL70eN into the existing Mar-Kel.
I'm surprised that didn't happen within the 1st 15 min of their arrival.
dave
I'm surprised that didn't happen within the 1st 15 min of their arrival.
dave
I'm afraid I wont be able to do it. Why not?
Because the 12mm particle board and the fact that the screw holes kind of came into the driver hole.
I could try it, but i'm afraid I wont be able to mount the new drivers correctly and I en up with a broken baffle which I can't swap.
The thing is when I did the driver cutout the driver seemed to fit very well. Then when I mounted the drivers I remember atleast one screw that was almost completely in the driver hole (poor design of the EL70 in my opinion). And I don't know how good it is to screw, unscrew and screw again in my poor 12mm particle board 🙁
just cut a new baffle...
... and glue and screw it to the existing one. Cut the hole as small as possible. Then drill the screw holes and mount some sort of threaded insert into the screw locations....
... and glue and screw it to the existing one. Cut the hole as small as possible. Then drill the screw holes and mount some sort of threaded insert into the screw locations....
Granted the margins between screw hole and diameter of inner cut-out on the EL70, and several other of Mark's designs are rather tight (little Alpair6 even more so), and yes the core on 12mm PB won't survive doing that too many times
Since these boxes may well be replaced soon, and unless you fully chamfered the back side of the driver cutouts, you could just rotate the driver 45deg and install new drivers at offset angle. Fill the old screw holes with plumber's putty, etc.
Soon enough you'll need to build a new pair of boxes using the plywood baffles - got any ideas?
I've already indicated that option #2 might surprise you, and there's no reasons of course that you still couldn't add a woofer
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This was my reaction, too. And this time, send the screws in on a bit of an angle so they grab as much wood as possible. Not a crazy angle, but enough that they don't just slide past or break through the edge of the driver hole. Angled screws don't look as good, but they hold a hell of a lot better in this scenario. Something tells me the "looks" of your Mar-Kels are not the first priority 😉 😛
You can also take some big washers and use them as clamps with the screws installed outside of the bezel. Procedure is a but different depending on whether the drivers are rebated or not.
dave
dave
One fix that I have used for hole issues in MDF or particle board enclosures is to cut a short piece of square hardwood dowel and glue this piece inside the box behind the breakout. Fill the hole on the outside of the box and then retap your holes and your screw will have a firm grip.
Swapping drivers in my Mar-Kel70 worked just fine 🙂
Have you ever heard the song called Hurtigrute with Kari Bremnes? If not you should listen to it. In that song I can see the cones move quite a bit but no sound comes. Analyzed the track in MasVis (a program) and that song contains a lot of deep bass that my Mar-Kel70 wont play.
So, what I want to achieve with my new speakers is to play those huge drums my Mar-Kel70 wont play, and a little more physical impact.
I can also increase my budget if necessary to ~$230 per driver if it is worth the extra cost.
Any recommendations for drivers/cabinets?
Have you ever heard the song called Hurtigrute with Kari Bremnes? If not you should listen to it. In that song I can see the cones move quite a bit but no sound comes. Analyzed the track in MasVis (a program) and that song contains a lot of deep bass that my Mar-Kel70 wont play.
So, what I want to achieve with my new speakers is to play those huge drums my Mar-Kel70 wont play, and a little more physical impact.
I can also increase my budget if necessary to ~$230 per driver if it is worth the extra cost.
Any recommendations for drivers/cabinets?
That's the cone unloading below tuning. The frequencies in that track are well below the box tuning. Did your analyzer tell you what frequencies they are? That would help with suggestions. If they were 30hz, no biggie. If they were 20hz or possibly less, you need some powerful woofage.
I think you've received some good advice so far. I will again throw out the suggestion for the SB acoustics woofers. I will again (as much as I appreciate CrisB's opinions) disagree with a castle build. You're young, so am I, I know what you're looking for, and 4 EL70s won't bring it. I will again say that a sat sub with your existing speakers may be an excellent option. Particularly if that bass is lower 20s or teens. Then you SHOULD go with dedicated subs, or a very capable FAST.
I think you've received some good advice so far. I will again throw out the suggestion for the SB acoustics woofers. I will again (as much as I appreciate CrisB's opinions) disagree with a castle build. You're young, so am I, I know what you're looking for, and 4 EL70s won't bring it. I will again say that a sat sub with your existing speakers may be an excellent option. Particularly if that bass is lower 20s or teens. Then you SHOULD go with dedicated subs, or a very capable FAST.
I don't know exactly what the frequencies are, but this is an analyze of the song in the program MasVis.
An externally hosted image should be here but it was not working when we last tested it.
If you see the normalized average spectrum there's a peak at ~27-29Hz which I guess is the percussions in this song.
I don't really need to go as low as 20Hz. I'm fine with reasonable output at around 30Hz. I feel my Mar-Kel70 rolls off pretty quick below ~45Hz. It would be awesome to move that rolloff to ~30Hz instead.
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