I have done just a measurement because I did read a gap between speaker and baffle horn throat extent hf and damping resonances, it also removes horn like sound, I have test it and I see with foam or such I can make respons very nice until 3.5 Khz. I have not use filtering, it is straight on output amp.
Afcourse this idea is from the edgar horn papers where it is also tested with good results, special with a dome mid/high it is promissing..
regards
Afcourse this idea is from the edgar horn papers where it is also tested with good results, special with a dome mid/high it is promissing..
regards
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Thanks, yes I want to go up to K-tube at 3.5 Khz, but I think also 2.5 is also fine, di think about buy a BMS 4540ND comression driver for the K-tube, I am curious how much efficienty I get left over then.
Plan was to go to a full throat like SD speaker, and a adaptor from square to round for the speaker with a gap, I see this is interesting also for the sound, from hars to smooth what is afcourse my goal.
regards
xrk971, this has nothing to do with a traditional one-way HiFi construction such as a single 5-inch driver in a good big baffle. Fullrange should not be a contradiction to multi-way. Fullrange is solely a characterization of an electroacoustical device and a premise for HiFi. I consider this Synergy stuff bad, and i wonder if its popularity here has something to do with the .com at the end of our name. Commerce is wonderful, mercy for all of us, but please with intelligence and honesty.
dot com is the compulsory attitude to do something.
Many along this board, ehm...forum- trade the term fullrange for full frequency capable speakers, probably in opposition to subwoofers. Some don't even know woofers exists, as there are subwoofers, midrange and tweeters.
Many along this board, ehm...forum- trade the term fullrange for full frequency capable speakers, probably in opposition to subwoofers. Some don't even know woofers exists, as there are subwoofers, midrange and tweeters.
Like I said, I don't make the forum rules. I asked the moderators if it should go in Multiway and they said since the XO is low, it is technically a FAST, and FAST has been assigned to Fullrange forum, right or wrong.
Not sure where you come from saying that Synergy is bad - that is probably the opposite feeling of all who have heard one. It is one of the BEST sounding speakers ever designed. What's not to like? Wide bandwidth, point source, low distortion, controlled directivity, high SPL capability, phase coherent (if you worked at it), able to produce square waves (SH50 and Bwaslo's Cosyne), and on. Most of all, it is a total package that is a challenge to make so great for DIY to try and crack it. If you don't like how it sounds, that is your minority opinion.
Puhleez save it for your soapbox.
hey X are you holding out on the rest of us and have a commercial interest/venture that your not telling us about?
(where's this dot com at the end of your name coming from?)
or is this guy on "grasso" !?
(where's this dot com at the end of your name coming from?)
or is this guy on "grasso" !?
Sorry to invit myself in the party, doing what i'm about to say it has not to be done ^^
Grasso, since you want to argue about what must be done how, all the complain you're talking here about "what should be where", should be in forum site/Forum problems section. To me, you're flooding here. Please, keep coherent with yourself ^^
Can we let place in this thread for the interesting stuff for people interested by it ?
If it is just for general discussion, there's a section too on the forum, or if it is personal, personal message still exist, or, you can just add another thread about your vision of the difference between multi-way and fullrange, and it would be interesting as clearly stated.
For example, i have send you a PM about this kind of attitude 3 days ago without answer.
Thanks !
EDIT : if you want to answer, please, by PM. There's not any use for those discussion here.
Grasso, since you want to argue about what must be done how, all the complain you're talking here about "what should be where", should be in forum site/Forum problems section. To me, you're flooding here. Please, keep coherent with yourself ^^
Can we let place in this thread for the interesting stuff for people interested by it ?
If it is just for general discussion, there's a section too on the forum, or if it is personal, personal message still exist, or, you can just add another thread about your vision of the difference between multi-way and fullrange, and it would be interesting as clearly stated.
For example, i have send you a PM about this kind of attitude 3 days ago without answer.
Thanks !
EDIT : if you want to answer, please, by PM. There's not any use for those discussion here.
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I think Grasso789 is of the type who think a cable covered with teflon sounds better, I agree with him that a open baffle can sound very good, but only when use it for low sound levels, or big speakers, but then we need a 3 way XO.
I see a horn where the speakers are inside positioned with a singel point effect like the synergy does, for me this is wast of energy to struggle over what it is, the trynergy is just a blended horn, for me this means a full range and the result is what counts, learning new ways to make a horn also.
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I Kees52, i did not mean an open baffle but just a good 5 inch driver electrically well driven and equalized in a generously multi-faceted baffle in a sealed enclosure. That is much more fullrange in the KISS philosophy than this construction is. It also looks cheap, chemical and weak, using foam boards. Tom Danley, the inventor of Synergy, seems to be much better in getting along with people with minimum effort than in constructing well-sounding stuff. I do not need to get along with all people but only with right ones.
I did have some stuff on youtube in the open baffle time, I am amp maker and speakers is quite new, so ai am curious and test some ideas, stranges ones I do like most.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DFVxB7Ff-iI
and a new all plate follower hybrid (total feedbackless).
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mAYXzegWnn4
But this is offtopic afcourse.
So horn go on with it and a K-tube.
Those are nice drivers but is much bigger than a 3.5in and will require a bigger horn. Sd is 50cm2 vs 36cm2 on 3.5in drives like TC9 or 10F.
Tangband is 4 inch, so a bigger horn is not a problem because I use it different, like with k-tube. this tangband can stand a higher compression also it is low qts.
I was planned to make other horns, maybe a low and a high compression version to test. now I did use 25 cm2 throat and 1800 cm2 mouth 220 hz and 53 cm long, I have to include the wall placement or even corner, because that is the only available place.
corner or wall loading and throat dimensions are really changing, I did read when use a speaker use whole surface of Sd in throat for max bandwidth while hornresp says a higher compression give more extention.
I prefered the w4-1320si bamboo one from waterfall, but was hesitating with this one ^^
Back of the cone got damping layer and surround junction with cone too, inductance a bit lower (neo motor), beautiful speaker.
Back of the cone got damping layer and surround junction with cone too, inductance a bit lower (neo motor), beautiful speaker.
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The bamboo version has more flat HF respons above 10 Khz. Not bad eather, but cone rigidness is very important for a horn, to prevent cone breakup in HF.
Have some measurements done, and now I go outside, enjoy the first sunny 25 oC.
As you see until 4 Khz, it do well, then I see a dip because of throat waves make acoustical short circuit?.. Horns are not made for wideband, 4 Khz is already very impressive. but I do agree this respons is not bad.
After listening the visatons have resonances and do not sound as well as a more expensive one do, so I buy myself two tangbands.
last sim has impuls, distortion and fase included the first picture is a 1000 hz tone and distortion, who is not really seen except when loud, but I do not go so far protecting my ears and nabure...
I did use a 15 ohms and a 4.7 uF cap parallell and then in series with the speaker, when using a analog crossover use a 18 ohms resistor on that output, when a active amplifier this is not needed.
regards
As you see until 4 Khz, it do well, then I see a dip because of throat waves make acoustical short circuit?.. Horns are not made for wideband, 4 Khz is already very impressive. but I do agree this respons is not bad.
After listening the visatons have resonances and do not sound as well as a more expensive one do, so I buy myself two tangbands.
last sim has impuls, distortion and fase included the first picture is a 1000 hz tone and distortion, who is not really seen except when loud, but I do not go so far protecting my ears and nabure...
I did use a 15 ohms and a 4.7 uF cap parallell and then in series with the speaker, when using a analog crossover use a 18 ohms resistor on that output, when a active amplifier this is not needed.
regards
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If you look well the dip on 4.6 Khz is not moved to 15 Khz, Hmm why because I have only make the square to round and have a gap with damping material between speaker surround and baffle throat.
another peak is now on the low part, so it is quite interesting to play with damped gap's.
regards
another peak is now on the low part, so it is quite interesting to play with damped gap's.
regards
