Craig
how heavy? There are real vibration insulators used in photonics and other sensitive app out there that would probably beat cork and sorbotane and make a killer platform.
how heavy? There are real vibration insulators used in photonics and other sensitive app out there that would probably beat cork and sorbotane and make a killer platform.
Are you guys using the 2sk170 or the smd jfets provided with the diyaudio store kit? Has anyone compared noise perf?
@gataku: they are quite heavy. Suspect there are more formal solutions and am always interested in ones that are reasonably priced. But these are working splendidly. Again, the trick for my VPI is putting the same isolators under both the table and the motor.
As regards the 170s versus 209s 6L6 is the one to provide a comprehensive answer. Having asked him and others I get the impression that the 2SK209GRs are the best choice for most of us. The 170s are difficult to obtain in matched sets and require some alterations to resistor values that many of us would find bothersome. Have built 3 P3s, all with 209s, and they work splendidly.
Now I would do two things differently on the 4th build.
First, I would carefully match the 209s. They come off the strip with high variance. Having measured 100 of them, I got 3 sets of 8 that had Idss values within a .4mA range. You want to match 8 so that both boards are the same for soundstage production.
Secondly, I would use a SMD heat gun to mount these SMDs. Just picked up one after seeing Mend It Mark use one repeatedly on SMDs. RHThatcher has told me he uses one and finds the process "too cool." I am waiting for the first "snap in place." And anything "too cool" at my age is worth the effort...
As regards the 170s versus 209s 6L6 is the one to provide a comprehensive answer. Having asked him and others I get the impression that the 2SK209GRs are the best choice for most of us. The 170s are difficult to obtain in matched sets and require some alterations to resistor values that many of us would find bothersome. Have built 3 P3s, all with 209s, and they work splendidly.
Now I would do two things differently on the 4th build.
First, I would carefully match the 209s. They come off the strip with high variance. Having measured 100 of them, I got 3 sets of 8 that had Idss values within a .4mA range. You want to match 8 so that both boards are the same for soundstage production.
Secondly, I would use a SMD heat gun to mount these SMDs. Just picked up one after seeing Mend It Mark use one repeatedly on SMDs. RHThatcher has told me he uses one and finds the process "too cool." I am waiting for the first "snap in place." And anything "too cool" at my age is worth the effort...
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@mhenschel: used the Peak Transistor Analyzer (a "too cool" device for sure) and established ranges of .5mA (I think -- am in Phoenix now and my equipment is in the mountains) and, after measure, dropped the SMDs in a pill tray marked with the mA values (4.1, 4.15, 4.2, etc.). Takes hours to do but you get good at it. Now have this tray for future builds with 3 transistor types. You do computer trace contours with the Pearl and the picture shows the matching accuracy completely. If you check out the BA2018 thread (last ten pages or so) I provided photos and descriptions.
Just got this Bakon:
https://www.amazon.com/dp/B0CG7KT1TY?ref=ppx_yo2ov_dt_b_fed_asin_title
Know nothing about it but after seeing Mark use one constantly, felt it was worthwhile learning. Will let you know but my next projects start in May when I get back to Flagstaff.
Just got this Bakon:
https://www.amazon.com/dp/B0CG7KT1TY?ref=ppx_yo2ov_dt_b_fed_asin_title
Know nothing about it but after seeing Mark use one constantly, felt it was worthwhile learning. Will let you know but my next projects start in May when I get back to Flagstaff.
Agree with @Craigl59 ´s post after yours, and check #4.440.
I´m going to try a build with paralleled 2SK2145 = 8 fet´s pr. channel instead of 4..... of course matched to the smallest degree.
Will do an update post on that later (maybe in 2025).
As to my post #4.460..... If in doubt about noise floor and the ability of the Pearl-3, just listen to this
It may surprise you, that it´s actually a live recording. 😉
https://www.dropbox.com/scl/fi/ygno...ey=xq8sjyhlzjv5r56ry3t3xpw0v&st=45e2rqqg&dl=0
EDIT: Apologize for some crap in the right channel. Has something to do with a bad 3,5mm mini jack connection to
the input of the onboard soundcard of the PC. You´ll get the impression of the noise flor though. Will try to replace it with a new
recording later.
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@Boydk: Blown away for a second time -- even better than your first DBX. This shows a repro quality I term "natural realism" that is found all of the time on R2R tape. The good news is that my VPI/Hana ML match is now approaching this P3 level of quiet -- although the Hana is a much brighter cartridge.
As you note, the audience noise at the end is a shock as the recording is so naturally quiet.
Dont't know the singer -- She is?
As you note, the audience noise at the end is a shock as the recording is so naturally quiet.
Dont't know the singer -- She is?
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She´s a Norwegian girl by the name of Unni Wilhelmsen. The LP is a live concert named "Unni synger (sings) Wilhelmsen"
The link in #4.467 is now deleted. Here´s the new one:
https://www.dropbox.com/scl/fi/9cmp...ey=jpy11e55akjghxlm9ygfziemj&st=mcsvbejr&dl=0.
And here´s a couple more favourites, just because I´m in the mood and excited about the Pearl-3 😛 😎
https://www.dropbox.com/scl/fi/nwi3...ey=9s4q4cifr2vory9b1nqrxwn5q&st=l355kwyk&dl=0
https://www.dropbox.com/scl/fi/s4bv...ey=jwjg5y9p1dziq7tphhjuqby5z&st=gmll93j5&dl=0
Enjoy 👍
Ohhh yeahh 😉
He drove back to Belgium, plugged it in, and after a couple of days, his first comment was, that he probably needed to listen
to all his vinyls over again. That´s a bit of thumbs up to Wayne for a cool construction. Of course, this was built into Gianluca´s
beautiful enclosures, so on top of the sound, it also looks really good in his setup 👍👍
We are speaking noise and vibration isolation here.
A relatively heavy base that rest on spring isolator pads works well.
Visualize a moderately heavy butcher block that rest on isolation pads made of a layer of cork and a layer of closed cell neoprene/EDPM. What vibration frequencies that pass thru the neoprene layer will be attenuated by the cork and vise versa. The "heavy" mass sitting on top reduces the magnitude of motion.
This can be diy at not too high a price at IKEA or ebay.
I don't have any issue in soldering smd, I now have a microscope and have lots of fun doing it. Matching them sound like a much bigger nightmare.
I bought some 6ma quads 2sk170gr.
I am thinking finding the right sounding caps is going to be a real challenge given the board size. On the hypnotize MC riaa the sonic difference between caps far surpasses the difference between different ICs.
@DualTriode Yes am using large butcher blocks and the aforementioned cork pads and all works splendidly. Have a ton of the round springs no longer used and find they are too "jiggly" for the VPI weight. Thanks for the suggestions.
@Craigl59
eons ago, before sorbothane became an audiophile thing, I replaced the thin masonite under my Ariston RD11s with a plywood plate sitting on soft "English" squash balls.
Even under the relatively light weight of the Ariston the squash balls eventually squished (squashed?) I switched them out for rubber feet. I really couldn't discern a difference either way.
eons ago, before sorbothane became an audiophile thing, I replaced the thin masonite under my Ariston RD11s with a plywood plate sitting on soft "English" squash balls.
Even under the relatively light weight of the Ariston the squash balls eventually squished (squashed?) I switched them out for rubber feet. I really couldn't discern a difference either way.
The cork and closed cell EDPM layers are also springs, but they are not made from coiled wire.
DualTriode: Terminology aside, my VPI setup is complete and it sounds better than good. Attacked are two jpegs that show sorbothane half balls will not work with the feet and motor; thus they were not used many years ago. The items now in place remove all noise and the music comes through superbly well.
Attachments
This type of isolation pad is used in HVAC applications. Here is another option for purchasing. https://www.supplyhouse.com/Bluefin-VPRC-200-Rubber-Cork-Anti-Vibration-Pad-2-x-2-x-7-8
@bentconvert: So where are you when I'm ordering, fellow (LOL). Great price! And here's another for those looking for a nice method to hold speaker wire up off of the floor:
https://www.homedepot.com/p/Grip-Rite-3-in-PROLOK-Rebar-and-Mesh-Chair-GRPROLK43B/204768996
There's more than a lifetime's worth here; but buy a package and become the local supplier to your audio buddies.
https://www.homedepot.com/p/Grip-Rite-3-in-PROLOK-Rebar-and-Mesh-Chair-GRPROLK43B/204768996
There's more than a lifetime's worth here; but buy a package and become the local supplier to your audio buddies.
back in the day we specified isolation devices from a company called Vibron to quiet big power transformers, motors etc.
I think these are the guys... https://kineticsnoise.com/
I think these are the guys... https://kineticsnoise.com/