Yep! They go 50-100Hz lower than a single K55, to my ear, when I play with the minidsp. Used very steep crossover slopes and also normal slopes. Some day I could try twin K55. Everything has sounded very consistent with what Radian showed with Dietmar's graphs.
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I tried the K55 as a tweeter in a JBL 14-25 horn. Great sounding midhorn, BTW. Cheap too. Fits well with the shape of the Goto S-150. But I ended up with the Beyma 1" in an Avantgarde Trio tweeter horn, that is a much better sounding tweeter. This is the third tweeter you see.
If not my tube amp starting popping I would have tried the JA6681B as a mid also. I wonder if the JBL 2204H can add anything extra. It could probably give a little nicer midbass around 150Hz. But I could force a future subwoofer to do that.
Sound is really nice for singer song writer music. Rock, and metal is scored for big cone drivers. I used my JBL 2204H up to 2kHz with a ribbon tweeter above yesterday with friends, and it can play everything I would every need for a party. Horns are for afterparty music and lazy Sunday afternoons.
If not my tube amp starting popping I would have tried the JA6681B as a mid also. I wonder if the JBL 2204H can add anything extra. It could probably give a little nicer midbass around 150Hz. But I could force a future subwoofer to do that.
Sound is really nice for singer song writer music. Rock, and metal is scored for big cone drivers. I used my JBL 2204H up to 2kHz with a ribbon tweeter above yesterday with friends, and it can play everything I would every need for a party. Horns are for afterparty music and lazy Sunday afternoons.
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Yes, more than the JBL. The JBL is clear but sort of boring and muffled, as if it was a speaker. Like listening to Nick Drake trapped in a box. And you can't hornload the JBL to increase its vividness, because there would not be the same amount of detail to gain as a compression driver. I feel a compression driver is doing everything in minitature, and a horn just enlarges that that detailed miniature world.
The big advantage of the JBL is that I can play any music, without any harsh sounds, that I can hear on som records. I guess this is what drove Angelo to go with a JBL and TPL-150 - great choices for party music. And then I mean pretty good sounding party music. Not like Cerwin Vega. I should not bash them too much as I am building a lab horn that is similar to a basshorn of theirs.
The big advantage of the JBL is that I can play any music, without any harsh sounds, that I can hear on som records. I guess this is what drove Angelo to go with a JBL and TPL-150 - great choices for party music. And then I mean pretty good sounding party music. Not like Cerwin Vega. I should not bash them too much as I am building a lab horn that is similar to a basshorn of theirs.
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The SD-370 should not exhibit any harsh sounds, at least not in the range up to 1khz.
Phenolic drivers are not known for that.
How clean are the air gaps?
I can ask Dietmar if he heard any harsh sounds with his SD-370.
His whole chain is really revealing so if he did not hear any of that,
than there is something else going on.
Phenolic drivers are not known for that.
How clean are the air gaps?
I can ask Dietmar if he heard any harsh sounds with his SD-370.
His whole chain is really revealing so if he did not hear any of that,
than there is something else going on.
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I am speaking about listening to different genres. Cone drivers will usually play rock and metal music better. The distortion sound from the guitars were recorded from 12" cone drivers, and should also be played back with 12" drivers. For some reason that is true for some electronica music. Some electronica bands use distortion effects on their synths.
For analog music, like singer-song-writers, quartets, MTV unplugged, etc, compression drivers win almost every time. The recording has to have a certain quality for it to be worth increasing the detail with a horn.
Right now I am listening to phenolic and PM-4 polymer diaphragms.
For analog music, like singer-song-writers, quartets, MTV unplugged, etc, compression drivers win almost every time. The recording has to have a certain quality for it to be worth increasing the detail with a horn.
Right now I am listening to phenolic and PM-4 polymer diaphragms.
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Strange.... Have you heard 416s in an Onken W? Have you heard them in that range? I can't imagine that you have, saying that. Or have I misunderstood your post?
sounds quite nice on my headphones - - good to see the old-school horn in this age of shallow waveguide
I have not heard these vintage bass drivers, you meantion, but with bass I don't want an artistic speaker with a beautiful tone - I just want something that works. I gave up on the very acclaimed alnico magnet ATC PA75-314 BASS speakers for this reason. Someone wrote that, yes, in the 70's they were groundbreaking and put British ATC on the map, but today there are much better speakers for bass. Seems like many like these GPA 416, so I could be wrong. What is so magic about them?
So is Dietmar using these drivers with his Sato horn? Is it the standard Sato horn or a bigger version of the original design?
Hey 3GGG, have you received your drivers yet?
Hey 3GGG, have you received your drivers yet?
I don't actually know what Dietmar uses. But he seems to have a big selection of speakers. He strikes me as someone who alternates just for the fun of it.
BTW, Radian,
I am glad I did not drill a whole in my K55's. According to this post by Dietman, he says one have to re-magnetize the K55 after doing so.
Before, you mention Dietmar has the ability to re-magnetize, but it seems also he feels it is a necessity.
I am glad I did not drill a whole in my K55's. According to this post by Dietman, he says one have to re-magnetize the K55 after doing so.
Before, you mention Dietmar has the ability to re-magnetize, but it seems also he feels it is a necessity.
I am not talking about the quality of any Altec speakers.
The opinions I have posted here and in the JA-6681b thread are all in the context
of having a big horn going down as low as possible. Preferably down to
100-150hz where only an additional sub is required.
If I can get the required amplitude at a given frequency from a compression
driver on a good horn there is just no way any 15" cone, no matter the price,
can match it. The control of a compression driver over it's diaphragm is way
ahead of any 15" cone.
I had a small version of an Onken and it was plain awesome. All who had
heard it where just floored at the accuracy and speed in the bass. So I
pretty well know what an Onken can do, but I want the best I can have
for the money I can spend.
Put four SD-370 on a 100hz horn and any Altec 15" does not sound as right in
comparison, on at least 80% of the material played back, no matter what
cabinet is going to be used.
If one is fiddling with compression drivers on big horns there is no need for an Onken.
Look at all the boutiqe Goto installations. Those people can afford any
driver they want, but what are they using down to at least 100hz?
Compression drivers on horns!!!!
Klaus
Re-magnetizing is only necessary if you take an Alnico magnet out of it's
whole magnet structure. By drilling a hole into the middle of the back cup you
are not changing anything concerning the drivers magnet structure.
.
He is retired and has a passion for tube amps and horns. He measures every
thing and is determined to find out why something works or not. He has
equipment that most of us can only dream of. He owns very boutique drivers
like the Line Magnetics 555 to compare what he does on the drivers he
modifies to do a specific task.
I can ask him if his Sato is any variation of the original.
Klaus