Hello again guys!!!!!
Probably you already heard this before but I'm desperate.
Now I am looking for a subwoofer driver for my system.My only porblem is that i live in Romania and I onestly don't know where I could find a cheap driver for about 100-150$. If any of you (romanian) guys can tell me I'll be forever thankfull.
PLEASE!!!!
My only option is a car subwoofer driver but I don't know if that is suitable for a room subwoofer. I was thinking of a JBL GT4-12
or a Magnat Xecutor 1200 because they seem pretty good (at least to me).
Probably you already heard this before but I'm desperate.
Now I am looking for a subwoofer driver for my system.My only porblem is that i live in Romania and I onestly don't know where I could find a cheap driver for about 100-150$. If any of you (romanian) guys can tell me I'll be forever thankfull.
PLEASE!!!!
My only option is a car subwoofer driver but I don't know if that is suitable for a room subwoofer. I was thinking of a JBL GT4-12
or a Magnat Xecutor 1200 because they seem pretty good (at least to me).
That's actually fairly expensive. You can probably take a train to Germany and pay for the ticket with what you save on the price, and have some selection as well. For that matter can't you order by mail from a German source? Or Austria? Maybe even Hungary for that matter.
If you can't find local suppliers then you can get drivers shipped. Before looking at those drivers I'd suggest looking into drivers by Peerless (XLS), Adire (Shiva, Tempest), AE speakers (AV series), Dayton (Titanic). Find out who ships which drivers to your location and get quotes for shipping.
No need to limit yourself to local suppliers. Sometimes it's cheaper to ship than get it from local suppliers anyway.
No need to limit yourself to local suppliers. Sometimes it's cheaper to ship than get it from local suppliers anyway.
Thanks for the replys.
I had no ideea that visaton had a romanian site.
Anyway I have another posible driver
Kenwood KFC-w3009. What do you think about this driver? Did any of you had the chance to listen or work with it?
Plese guys I need some feedback
So let me remind you my options until now:
Magnat Xecutor 1200 with these parameters:
Fs=29 hz Vas(liters) =58 Qts=0.58 Spl=92dB
Kenwood KFC-W3009 with these parameters:
Fs=32 hz Vas(liters) =63.9 Qts=0.42 Spl=93dB
The JBL is out because it sounds a little bit strange...not a very good driver...or at least the salesman told me so...
I had no ideea that visaton had a romanian site.
Anyway I have another posible driver
Kenwood KFC-w3009. What do you think about this driver? Did any of you had the chance to listen or work with it?
Plese guys I need some feedback
So let me remind you my options until now:
Magnat Xecutor 1200 with these parameters:
Fs=29 hz Vas(liters) =58 Qts=0.58 Spl=92dB
Kenwood KFC-W3009 with these parameters:
Fs=32 hz Vas(liters) =63.9 Qts=0.42 Spl=93dB
The JBL is out because it sounds a little bit strange...not a very good driver...or at least the salesman told me so...
I would look to the other suggestions.
That Kenwood is really not suitable to a home stereo subwoofer, given the high Fs. Also, the Xmax is a bit low for home theather applications, unless you just want moderate volumes or have a very small room. The Magnat is much better suited, and actually looks to be a fairly good choice for a sealed box, although the box will be quite large if you want the Qtc to stay low. What's the Xmax on the Magnat? I would probably not use a ported box with the Magnat, but adding in room gain, a sealed will still get you into the 20's quite well.
Aaron Gilbert
That Kenwood is really not suitable to a home stereo subwoofer, given the high Fs. Also, the Xmax is a bit low for home theather applications, unless you just want moderate volumes or have a very small room. The Magnat is much better suited, and actually looks to be a fairly good choice for a sealed box, although the box will be quite large if you want the Qtc to stay low. What's the Xmax on the Magnat? I would probably not use a ported box with the Magnat, but adding in room gain, a sealed will still get you into the 20's quite well.
Aaron Gilbert
So the Xmax of the Magnat driver is 16 mm.
When I went to see the magnat the guy in charge showed me a ported box for this driver.When he started the music I was a little disapointed that the sound was a bit fade.It moved quite a lot but I couldn't sense much Spl, and nothing rattled in the store.So as I understend it would sound much better in a sealed box.
I haven't had the chance to hear the kenwood yet...
When I went to see the magnat the guy in charge showed me a ported box for this driver.When he started the music I was a little disapointed that the sound was a bit fade.It moved quite a lot but I couldn't sense much Spl, and nothing rattled in the store.So as I understend it would sound much better in a sealed box.
I haven't had the chance to hear the kenwood yet...
Playing around a bit with winisdpro I found that amazing the kenwood seems to have more spl and flater response then the magnat.
The kenwood is in a 70 liter box and a port tunned to 31 Hz and the magnat is in a huge closed box at 115 liters.
Is this right? Am I using the sim well? Here is the pic with the sim.The next one is with the t/s parameters of the drivers that I know and introduced in the progam data base.Maybe you see something wrong, and can tell me.And in this situation (that everything is right) which driver should I choose?
The kenwood is in a 70 liter box and a port tunned to 31 Hz and the magnat is in a huge closed box at 115 liters.
Is this right? Am I using the sim well? Here is the pic with the sim.The next one is with the t/s parameters of the drivers that I know and introduced in the progam data base.Maybe you see something wrong, and can tell me.And in this situation (that everything is right) which driver should I choose?
Attachments
You need to correct Qms on the Magnat.
It's throwing off the SPL displayed on your graph, which is about 5-6 dB lower than it should be. In terms of maximum output, the Magnat will be close to 3 dB higher than the Kenwood, due to the much higher Xmax, of course assuming you have the power to utilize that extra excursion. Correct the negative Qms and it should look much better.
Now you could use the Magnat in a ported box, but the box would be truly enormous. That Kenwood doesn't look too bad in the ported box, so long as you aren't expecting much output at 20 Hz.
Aaron Gilbert
It's throwing off the SPL displayed on your graph, which is about 5-6 dB lower than it should be. In terms of maximum output, the Magnat will be close to 3 dB higher than the Kenwood, due to the much higher Xmax, of course assuming you have the power to utilize that extra excursion. Correct the negative Qms and it should look much better.
Now you could use the Magnat in a ported box, but the box would be truly enormous. That Kenwood doesn't look too bad in the ported box, so long as you aren't expecting much output at 20 Hz.
Aaron Gilbert
well my goal was to get as low as posible (at least 25Hz 🙁(( ) but I'll have to settle for 30Hz.So in this conditions and because I have to get the maximum Spl you recomend the Kenwood?
WAIT!
Please retry your simulation. The parameters of the Magnat are WRONG.
I see a negative Qms and a Qes that is lower than Qts (same problem). Both parameters are wrong. Qms should be higher than 1 (probably higher than 4), and Qes will be higher than Qts.
Grtz, Joris
P.S. the SPL given in your parameters differs too much from the SPL in the curve
P.S. II : it's not the SPL at 1 Watt that tells you how loud it will play, but the Xmax, power and cone-area together.
Please retry your simulation. The parameters of the Magnat are WRONG.
I see a negative Qms and a Qes that is lower than Qts (same problem). Both parameters are wrong. Qms should be higher than 1 (probably higher than 4), and Qes will be higher than Qts.
Grtz, Joris
P.S. the SPL given in your parameters differs too much from the SPL in the curve
P.S. II : it's not the SPL at 1 Watt that tells you how loud it will play, but the Xmax, power and cone-area together.
No.
The Magnat will both get lower and play louder, due to the much greater Xmax. I only recommend the Kenwood if box size is the primary concern.
I believe that once you correct the parameters in the simulation of the Magnat, the Magnat will provide more efficiency and output below 25 Hz, even in a sealed box vs. the Kenwood in a vented. A final option would be to use the Kenwood, but in a much larger box, and tune it to a lower frequency, say 20 Hz. Just play around with the simulations, altering box size and tuning frequency, and you will see what I mean when you observe the effects on the frequency response.
Aaron Gilbert
The Magnat will both get lower and play louder, due to the much greater Xmax. I only recommend the Kenwood if box size is the primary concern.
I believe that once you correct the parameters in the simulation of the Magnat, the Magnat will provide more efficiency and output below 25 Hz, even in a sealed box vs. the Kenwood in a vented. A final option would be to use the Kenwood, but in a much larger box, and tune it to a lower frequency, say 20 Hz. Just play around with the simulations, altering box size and tuning frequency, and you will see what I mean when you observe the effects on the frequency response.
Aaron Gilbert
Thanks for telling me obout the t/s parameters of the magnat driver.It turns out that my winisdpro might not work good.I did some simulations with winisdbeta at the volumes and tunnings that the producers recomend so,here they are.
It turns out that the Magnat is a little better than the kenwood.
I still don't know what to chose...But I am thinking of going to the stores and have them make me a test.I have some good low and very low bass tracks and maybe this would help.If you have any ideas or sugestions please let me know.
It turns out that the Magnat is a little better than the kenwood.
I still don't know what to chose...But I am thinking of going to the stores and have them make me a test.I have some good low and very low bass tracks and maybe this would help.If you have any ideas or sugestions please let me know.
Attachments
Need a larger box.
The shape of the response curve for the Magnat indicates to me that you need to enlarge the box significantly and tune lower. How did the simulation come out with the Magnat in a sealed box? It should be about the same as what I see in this latest picture. The smaller your box is, the less effect the port has. By my calculations, you are trying to add a port to a box which is less than half the size of an ideal sealed box for that woofer, and so you are achieving little. Make the box about 120 liters or larger, tune to 20 Hz, and see how much better things look. Make the box 200 liters and that Magnat will give you extension well below 20 Hz.
There's only so much you can do with woofers having a high Fs and/or high Qts.
Aaron Gilbert
The shape of the response curve for the Magnat indicates to me that you need to enlarge the box significantly and tune lower. How did the simulation come out with the Magnat in a sealed box? It should be about the same as what I see in this latest picture. The smaller your box is, the less effect the port has. By my calculations, you are trying to add a port to a box which is less than half the size of an ideal sealed box for that woofer, and so you are achieving little. Make the box about 120 liters or larger, tune to 20 Hz, and see how much better things look. Make the box 200 liters and that Magnat will give you extension well below 20 Hz.
There's only so much you can do with woofers having a high Fs and/or high Qts.
Aaron Gilbert
Hy guys the version of winisd I used was the last and i had those problem...
Anyway I finally had the money, and the nerve to buy the Magnat. I made a box just for test(i got prety much equivalent for mdf), that is very close to what the producer recommends and to tell u the truth i was a bit disapointed.It has indeed a very powerful kick (every thing rattles) but i think it lacks something I have no ideea what to call it...perhaps delay...
I mean it makes boom instead of booooooom.
Here is a pic of my mad dog how I call it. Remember that it is just a test box that disapointed me and I'll try to figure out what to do...
Anyway I finally had the money, and the nerve to buy the Magnat. I made a box just for test(i got prety much equivalent for mdf), that is very close to what the producer recommends and to tell u the truth i was a bit disapointed.It has indeed a very powerful kick (every thing rattles) but i think it lacks something I have no ideea what to call it...perhaps delay...
I mean it makes boom instead of booooooom.
Here is a pic of my mad dog how I call it. Remember that it is just a test box that disapointed me and I'll try to figure out what to do...
Attachments
Forgot to tell you the dimenions of the box...
So here they are 50,7x45x42 cm.
Internal volume is 41*38*46 cm and this includes the port volume and the driver so the net volume is smaller.
The port is a plastic pipe that has a diameter of 10 cm and is 32cm long.
Perhaps it is a small box for this driver...
So here they are 50,7x45x42 cm.
Internal volume is 41*38*46 cm and this includes the port volume and the driver so the net volume is smaller.
The port is a plastic pipe that has a diameter of 10 cm and is 32cm long.
Perhaps it is a small box for this driver...
Attachments
Tell us all the T/S parameters on this driver and I can simulate it to see what is good box size...
Red, your disapointment could be a few things:
1) unrealistic expectations
2) room acoustics
3) poor design (box size and tuning)
4) poor integration
My guess is that it's probably a combination of everything except #1
So we need TS parameters to see if you got the design right firstly. Then we need to know how you are integrating it (crossover point, type, etc). Then we need to know where you have placed it in the room. Get this stuff right with the ugly box, then build a nice one when you are first happy with the sound 😉
1) unrealistic expectations
2) room acoustics
3) poor design (box size and tuning)
4) poor integration
My guess is that it's probably a combination of everything except #1
So we need TS parameters to see if you got the design right firstly. Then we need to know how you are integrating it (crossover point, type, etc). Then we need to know where you have placed it in the room. Get this stuff right with the ugly box, then build a nice one when you are first happy with the sound 😉
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