Haha, well... It's hard because the signal is so low. One could run a buffer that can easily do the slew (Dr. Seuss does this). After that the easiest thing would be a transformer, and then amplify it with RIAA applied. At least that's on my to do list...
BTW I did a modification to my preamp's PSU, thinking about this topic in the thread. I reduced the noise significantly, and my pops and clicks are not nearly as offensive. I believe Max Headroom was correct for how the issue relates to what we hear, as to why we should care.
Yes. I provided the technical input, direction and impetus. Walt took it from there and did a wonderful over view of the subject. Any subjective descriptions were primarily WJ's. Though we talked a bit about how and why of the sound characteristics. Some predated by J.P.Moncreif (IAR Berkeley, Calif) who originally brought the DA issue re audio to me and had done some correlation tests to sound.
THx-RNMarsh
I think Max has the answer. a clean short transient is prefered to one which gets stretched/bloated via added distortion harmonics. ..... something to that effect.
But on another note.... those articles on cartridge mistracking et al.... how depressing the distortion levels are. Looking at just tracing distortion is a downer.... up to 10-20% for moderate vel (12). So many sources and forms of distortion -- and very high amounts. Why any one thinks LP system sounds great has always eluded me. Never sounded like actual real music sounds to me.... only HiFi.
I can understand why many thought 1% thd was a threshold to detect. Not to mention the high speaker distortions.
THx-RNMarsh
Richard- You should play with this app and see what your distortion thresholds are https://www.quantasylum.com/content/Home/tabid/40/Post/342/ABX-Testing-and-Distortion They may be much higher than you think.
Thank you. I actually was asking if that’s you in the picture (right Bill)
A good analysis on this.
(you only have to read the numerical examples and the associated diagrams 🙂)
http://www.helices.org/auDio/turnTable/baerwald.pdf
George
It will be nice if you make a recording at the output of your preamplifier from the same vinyl track with the noisy PSU and with the clean PSU, to compare the two and analyze what does change.
George
With high concentration, I was able to pass 12-bit degradation, at 100%, but only with some kind of music. Namely Telarc, Ravel, Pantomime (Jarvi), for the reason it contains very low volume level music. For a usual pop or jazz, even 8-bit is difficult to get 😀
I am sure that Big Names here will never try it.
I did say Tracing distortion and not tracking distortion, I think. But tracking distortion by itself is .3 to 2.5% approx for 8 inch arm. There are so many isolated sources of distortion.... tracing and tracking are two. Not to mention the cart vs veloc itself and sylus shape, weight etal. Its a bloomin night mare of distortions.
been there done that. Had rabco straight line arm, Lab100 Garrard TT, thorens TT with SME2012 arm, Grace unipivot arm and various combinations of headshells, damping, wiring, TT mods, vacum hold down.... you name it. MM and MC... pre and pre-pre and on and on. Done. It all sounds poor IMO. [Not that I cant try to enjoy the music though... listen in spite of what i hear].
THx-RNMarsh
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Ive been there too... new toy now to do it again. I said for me it was <.05% thd. But with lower distortion (masking) speakers and excellent headphone maybe better -- offset by aging now so who knows. When I get around to it.... but if has never been tried - ever- to find their limits in their system with their speakers etal, they should do the tests needed. Later they can do same test to see if they have really improved their system.
12 bit is pretty good (100% too) for that test with music, I would think. What do your speakers or headphone thd contribute? hard to hear much below the source distortion.
THx-RNMarsh
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Next you tell us you did this in the 70's with LP's as the source material. Just what speakers/source did you use to not mask .05% and on what basis and with what controls did you determine it was not masked? And a good search will not find you ever praising an LP without qualifying it as just "Hi-Fi"?
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So it has no relevance to actual music, masking thresholds, etc. Speakers significantly below -66db over a wide frequency range?
I dont care about your definitions --- I just wanted to know if I could detect it. and i was using speakers. midrange freq only. MY system and my ears.... let me know that I needed at least this level of thd in amps. Music might be different, I agree. but then lower distortion speakers would have helped as well. maybe if I had the system I have now but with better ears, who knows. Anyway, it is WAY below what ever LP System produces.
Seems Demian also does very well. I am in my condo without access to a good system so cant redue tests in any form at this time. But if I remember this i will see where i am at now. How do you do on this or any other particular test we can compare.
THx-RNMarsh
Seems Demian also does very well. I am in my condo without access to a good system so cant redue tests in any form at this time. But if I remember this i will see where i am at now. How do you do on this or any other particular test we can compare.
THx-RNMarsh
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