Maybe you have the the wrong friends? 😉
Nelson Pass sells very well, thank you (Nelson and Pass are the same person, but you probably know that).
And Self's designs are in much more products than you think, even if his name is not on them, and it is a safe bet that some of your friends really love their Self-designed amps!
Cordell is not a designer of commercial audio stuff as far as I know, but you can be sure that many professional designers know his book and articles by hearth and apply the lessons with trust.
Jan
There could be another effect to take into account. On a plain unwarped disk the tip of the needle describes a plain spiral which (for one single turn) could be approximated by an plain circle (assuming a quiet track). On a warped disk the tip of the needle does not move on a cilindrical surface but rather on a sferical one (the tip moves not only in vertical direction but also in radial direction). So the distance between the rotation axis of the disk and the tip varies and also the momentary value of the tangential speed and the frequency of the reproduced signal (frequency modulation, frequency wobbling). Have not investigated how big this effect will be or if it will be measurable or hearable.
The sales figures say otherwise.
I assume you have heard of inter-winding screens? They are strongly recommended in Audio Power Amplifier Design, despite what you say. I don't think I have ever specified an audio power transformer without such a screen. They are highly important for stopping rectifier RF from being emitted by the power cable.
BTW, it's toroid.
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More, my friend loves nikon/Audio research so I need to go Canon/krell to not copy him. Easy in my case cos I can't afford either.
"Because tube flaws are more human than solid state flaws, which are more amusical. The most important thing is whether what we are hearing is convincingly real or is it merely a convincing representation. Most solid state representation ultimately sounds fake and no discriminating listener can ever close his eyes and believe he is listening to the live event"
The biggest load of utter nonsense on here I think I've read in a long time! Hilarious that you claim to know what constitutes a discriminating listener too. Dear oh dear!.....
The biggest load of utter nonsense on here I think I've read in a long time! Hilarious that you claim to know what constitutes a discriminating listener too. Dear oh dear!.....
There ARE answers. It's just people don't like to admit they prefer the sound of colourations with their music, and that their subjective impressions suddenly become the stuff of 'this IS superior' reality.
Though i have an important collection of vinyls i monthly increase buying mainly second hand lps ( in near mint and as well as near junk conditions, but very cheap...😉), i confess i have no valid reason for my interest ( would not say preference though...😱) for vinyl...
Btw, i find vinyl is a real pain in my finances, considering the cost of a decent cartridge+tonarm+turntable+phono-stage compared to the price of the monthly subscription to streaming services like Apple Music or Tidal which have proved to be able to supply me with an awfully good sounding (... simply out of an ipad headphones output...😀) back up of most of my vinyl "treasures"...🙄
Btw, i find vinyl is a real pain in my finances, considering the cost of a decent cartridge+tonarm+turntable+phono-stage compared to the price of the monthly subscription to streaming services like Apple Music or Tidal which have proved to be able to supply me with an awfully good sounding (... simply out of an ipad headphones output...😀) back up of most of my vinyl "treasures"...🙄
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Yes but I won't. If Mr. Self wants to remain under cover that's his choice. Ask him.
His work for one company is in the open - Google 'class XD'
Jan
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How did the posh Cambridge amp sound ( Offset AB point )? Possibly too neutral ? That would suit what I use. I have been playing with Hypex. Douglas gives us a chance to build without fear. A class D as easy would give me tons fear. The Hypex looks very simple. I suspect I even understand it. I bet I couldn't make one.
what if there is enough feedback from record vibrations to somehow cancel most of room resonances,etc...is needle going up down producing out of phase signal at stereo speakers?
Well then, what have we learnt from 86 pages.
1. People like what they like.
2. Some will justify it with science, some will justify it with marketing rhetoric, some with magic.
3. Vinyl playback is inherently flawed, it's full of low level distortions whose mechanisms are multiple and complex.
4. Digital playback is perfect there are no flaws, it's just perfect.
5. One of these statements is untrue.
Frankly the psychology behind the positions on this thread are more interesting than the proposed science. IMHO.
1. People like what they like.
2. Some will justify it with science, some will justify it with marketing rhetoric, some with magic.
3. Vinyl playback is inherently flawed, it's full of low level distortions whose mechanisms are multiple and complex.
4. Digital playback is perfect there are no flaws, it's just perfect.
5. One of these statements is untrue.
Frankly the psychology behind the positions on this thread are more interesting than the proposed science. IMHO.
I really did enjoy all of your responses.
Jan Didden-- I subscribe to your linear audio.
Bob cordell I love his book
Self to me is the single greatest audio pioneer.
I even read the POOGue articles with Rick Miller, I can't remember all of their names. Jan is one of the true pioneers as well.
All those guys improving the Jung superegulator. I loved reading it all.
I wish you guys would stop apologizing for tubes, as though it is so imperfect it is unworthy of the high end.
Most of the serious reviewers must be all wrong with their highly compromised tube gear and expensive turntables and cartridges.
Vinyl reproduction is more colored to some degree but it is also way more honest sound.
We all hope someday vinyl will be surpassed but it has not yet happened.
You know all of those predictions 20 years ago that digital would surpass vinyl.
It still has not happened.
Jan Didden-- I subscribe to your linear audio.
Bob cordell I love his book
Self to me is the single greatest audio pioneer.
I even read the POOGue articles with Rick Miller, I can't remember all of their names. Jan is one of the true pioneers as well.
All those guys improving the Jung superegulator. I loved reading it all.
I wish you guys would stop apologizing for tubes, as though it is so imperfect it is unworthy of the high end.
Most of the serious reviewers must be all wrong with their highly compromised tube gear and expensive turntables and cartridges.
Vinyl reproduction is more colored to some degree but it is also way more honest sound.
We all hope someday vinyl will be surpassed but it has not yet happened.
You know all of those predictions 20 years ago that digital would surpass vinyl.
It still has not happened.
I always think it is more about Science than psychological thing... May be no one has proposed the right Science...
For me I think it is simple. The situation is like this: Circuit (or device) C1 is imperfect from P1 perspective. Efforts can be made to improve P1. When C1 is transformed into C2, P1 is improved, but another imperfection P2 is introduced.
The nature of P1 and P2 is very different. P1 is very obvious while P2 is not. It is then "apple to orange".
Yes, in general, vinyls, tubes, have P1-type flaws... But I don't think it is the flaw that is liked. It is the absence of P2 that is preferred.
Very few sciences that cover perception remain static, especially when concerning how the brain quickly knows it's world. Douglas once said if listening fatigue exists why not in the visual domain? Dam good question. I would suggest the visual has always been full of the need for high bandwidth and has the bandwidth. Music is a man made thing perhaps inspired by bird song ( and space-depth is the forest ). The processing power is just enough that we have to cope. Very likely we have to fashion hi fi to fit the rather poor apperatus called ears. I supplied 2 x KEF T27 to Oxford University for testing to 40 kHz. For some reason KEF would not supply direct. The University people thought hi fi engineers almost stupidly stupid when talking about how we hear. They said the ear is a hopeless device which the brain can sort out. What it prefers is perfection or similar distortions which if not above 3% total are not rejected. At 1% total and the right spectrum will be beyound improvement. Anything else is rejected. 5 th harmonic whilst in music must not be too high. 3 rd gives pace to music if not excessive, thus what said to be bad isn't if slightly high. Lack of second is heard as a dry or bass light sound. That is the typical spectrum of a 1970's amp. One must not forget speakers and sources have plenty of 2 nd, the older sources more so including FM radio that is mostly as it was, albeit not as warm as it once was. People do not like a much second as though. All the same too little is a turn off.
The Great Distortion Delusion | Stereophile.com
Here is a bit of silly nonsense where some good ideas are being rejected ( discuss ? ). It's someone trying to make the facts fit his way of thinking ( me too I know ). MP3 proves mostly we don't hear as hi fi people" want " to believe. An analogy would be only water made from hydrogen and oxygen is good to drink. Wine not as it not anything like water of any sort. If you have ever drunk real water made that way you won't like it much and your body even less ( give that some thought ). Low distortion used with some care is not as bad as lab water, equally it's not greatly important as long as talking class A amplifiers and even others if care taken with the design ( Leak Delta 70 was not bad ). If you like, perfectionist hi fi needs musical fruit concentrate to work when as we usually buy these days. Many here pretend needs to exist that might not impress musicians much, but what do they know. What mostly matters is no boxes for speakerws and no gross timing errors or higher odd harmonics the music didn't have. Phase shifts are best avoided between 250 Hz and 7 kHz. The brain will not hear phase shift in an obvious way. It will reduce time spent listening at realistic vollume ( 90 dB ). Quad or Magnepan speakers should be OK. The Maggies are OK on loud rock music as a bonus. 4 x 2 foot is a likely mimimum speaker baffle size. It should offer 40 Hz and be - 12 dB at 30 Hz if EQ used. 1 x 18 inch 1 x 12 inch full-ish range and tweeter will meet that spec and give easy 115 db at 2 metres from very few watts. Be careful. 12 Lta ( or Fane ) is a good enough device if carefully filtered mechanically and phase plug fitted, it will give 6 kHz without too many problems. I used ply + MDF of 1 inch ( 2 x 12 mm ). Although my Maggies are better they do not have propper stereo. Some distortion from a paper cone is OK as a trade off. My neighbours are remarkable people and let me use them full tilt any time I like ( measured above 115 dB peaks that do not sound loud, 90 dB typical ). I also have Dynaco A 25's which I use for mini PA for old peoples dances etc ( my lady friends clients ). A25's will fill a village hall and not over power anyone. They only sound very good when used that way, they need a big space to not hear the boxes.
Here is a bit of silly nonsense where some good ideas are being rejected ( discuss ? ). It's someone trying to make the facts fit his way of thinking ( me too I know ). MP3 proves mostly we don't hear as hi fi people" want " to believe. An analogy would be only water made from hydrogen and oxygen is good to drink. Wine not as it not anything like water of any sort. If you have ever drunk real water made that way you won't like it much and your body even less ( give that some thought ). Low distortion used with some care is not as bad as lab water, equally it's not greatly important as long as talking class A amplifiers and even others if care taken with the design ( Leak Delta 70 was not bad ). If you like, perfectionist hi fi needs musical fruit concentrate to work when as we usually buy these days. Many here pretend needs to exist that might not impress musicians much, but what do they know. What mostly matters is no boxes for speakerws and no gross timing errors or higher odd harmonics the music didn't have. Phase shifts are best avoided between 250 Hz and 7 kHz. The brain will not hear phase shift in an obvious way. It will reduce time spent listening at realistic vollume ( 90 dB ). Quad or Magnepan speakers should be OK. The Maggies are OK on loud rock music as a bonus. 4 x 2 foot is a likely mimimum speaker baffle size. It should offer 40 Hz and be - 12 dB at 30 Hz if EQ used. 1 x 18 inch 1 x 12 inch full-ish range and tweeter will meet that spec and give easy 115 db at 2 metres from very few watts. Be careful. 12 Lta ( or Fane ) is a good enough device if carefully filtered mechanically and phase plug fitted, it will give 6 kHz without too many problems. I used ply + MDF of 1 inch ( 2 x 12 mm ). Although my Maggies are better they do not have propper stereo. Some distortion from a paper cone is OK as a trade off. My neighbours are remarkable people and let me use them full tilt any time I like ( measured above 115 dB peaks that do not sound loud, 90 dB typical ). I also have Dynaco A 25's which I use for mini PA for old peoples dances etc ( my lady friends clients ). A25's will fill a village hall and not over power anyone. They only sound very good when used that way, they need a big space to not hear the boxes.
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