Hmm.. the setup file downloads, but when you run the setup it goes looking for an application file on his website, which is no longer there. Not sure how you might get the actual application file, then get the install pointed at the local application file?
On another note, I've been reading Troels Gravesen's website.. whoa that's a lot of info! Thanks to whover that was that suggested checking out his projects (Scott was that you?), lots of cool stuff.
Specifically the TQWT pages... TQWT-
Then I saw these:
DTQWT-mkII
DTQWT-212-mkIII
Which seem to have a similar thing going on as GM was talking about earlier, adding an additional low frequency driver - just not quite in the same way (kind of like an upside down BiB, and not tuned as low with a path length of ~116"), instead giving the low frequency driver(s) their own horn which is then combines with the mid/high horn. Pretty neat! I like the second one, with two drivers.. naturally 🙂
Rather unfortunately, I think they're a bit out of my price range... But I wondered if, as no doubt many others have, if the drivers could be substituted for similar t/s but lower cost options. Or, if anyone has already gone this route (or on a similar build), I'd like to check out their build thread! Maybe something similar but with an Alpair 10.3 or 12p?
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here's 12LTA in roughly 2 cubic foot ~1955 Slimline R-J enclosure. cabinet against wall and about 5 feet off the floor. Mic about 5 feet. (Must be nearly 15 speakers in that room including one close to that mic position)
- look at the "near aperture" plots.. Years ago I ran 2 pairs of R-J style vent 18" cabinets to get a little power in the room. They exhibited that nice easy to measure summed response in the aperture.
a few sine sweeps with Beta 12LTA
"Lemon" aperture/vent
with Diffusicone 12 mounted - you can see the sub-baffle sets on cleats providing two variable length
ducts which exit in front of the speaker then out that aperture. The early commercial R-J had a lopsided
diamond aperture.
- look at the "near aperture" plots.. Years ago I ran 2 pairs of R-J style vent 18" cabinets to get a little power in the room. They exhibited that nice easy to measure summed response in the aperture.
a few sine sweeps with Beta 12LTA
"Lemon" aperture/vent
with Diffusicone 12 mounted - you can see the sub-baffle sets on cleats providing two variable length
ducts which exit in front of the speaker then out that aperture. The early commercial R-J had a lopsided
diamond aperture.
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subjectively - that particular 12LTA sounds horrible - I dropped it a couple of months ago and think the shock literally shook loose a few windings from the coil former as when its tapped, there's a "rattle". Also its boomy - the speaker may be dying. My good 12LTA is in a Karlsonator12.
Here are current links for the two original Audio Engineering papers
Articles by Frank Robbins and William Joseph (William was Jeff Joseph's uncle)
The R-J Speaker Enclosure Audio Engineering (December 1951)
Audio Magazine (December 1951)
Practical Aspects of the R-J Speaker Enclosure (January 1953)
Audio Magazine (January 1953)
I think that 12LTA is toast - it fell about 3ft hitting a pretty solid object - my regular R-J with EV SP15 alnico sounds
pretty good
Articles by Frank Robbins and William Joseph (William was Jeff Joseph's uncle)
The R-J Speaker Enclosure Audio Engineering (December 1951)
Audio Magazine (December 1951)
Practical Aspects of the R-J Speaker Enclosure (January 1953)
Audio Magazine (January 1953)
I think that 12LTA is toast - it fell about 3ft hitting a pretty solid object - my regular R-J with EV SP15 alnico sounds
pretty good
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Freddi, sounds like that 12lta is garbage.. time to cut it in half on a bandsaw and see what it looks like inside.. 😉
No clue how all this works, but on this thread folks want the setup.exe, which I gather is this one, but can't find on my computer, only one l have is 'TransmissionLine.application [6 kb], which I can't upload here: http://www.diyaudio.com/forums/soft...n-line-modelling-software-16.html#post5156656
http://web.archive.org/web/20161026232826/http://www.leonardaudio.co.uk/software/setup.exe
GM
I was able to download the setup file and the application file... but the setup file wants to go find the application file online. And i don't think the application file would run on its own, but i forget if i tried it or not. I'll check again tomorrow on that pc
Nope, running application file does not work either... I'd post the error message, but it's a pretty long text file, no sense cluttering things up here with it.
If anyone does know a way (that isn't insanely complicated and over my head) to make it install without it looking to his website for the files, let me know please. 🙂
I will try to keep an eye on that thread GM posted, but it doesn't look like anyone over there has figured it out yet either.
Transmission Line Modelling Software
Back on topic, I'm still of a mind to use a full range (and the bigger the better, to some degree at least), augmented by a big woofer on the bottom end. Maybe something liek the Alpair 12P would be a better choice than the 12lta? 12lta isn't a budget choice by the time you add a supertweeter and some crossover bits to block the lows for the tweeter, and at least the 12P has a larger Sd than most of the other typical little full rangers since it's an 8", which ought to lend it a more full sound...
Still looking into what kind of enclosure I'd want the FR in, if used with a helper woofer... Need to do some sim work but have not had the chance as of yet. Also debating what would be the best enclosure design for the helper woofer (and thus which woofer to use). Am I going about this the right way, or backwards?!
And is there any use in trying to use something like the K-aperture on the Karlsons or that JBL waveguide whatchamacallit to disperse the sound when there are beaming issues? Or this is more trouble than its worth, or maybe of limited value in a small living room type room (vs a large auditorium or similar)?
If anyone does know a way (that isn't insanely complicated and over my head) to make it install without it looking to his website for the files, let me know please. 🙂
I will try to keep an eye on that thread GM posted, but it doesn't look like anyone over there has figured it out yet either.
Transmission Line Modelling Software
Back on topic, I'm still of a mind to use a full range (and the bigger the better, to some degree at least), augmented by a big woofer on the bottom end. Maybe something liek the Alpair 12P would be a better choice than the 12lta? 12lta isn't a budget choice by the time you add a supertweeter and some crossover bits to block the lows for the tweeter, and at least the 12P has a larger Sd than most of the other typical little full rangers since it's an 8", which ought to lend it a more full sound...
Still looking into what kind of enclosure I'd want the FR in, if used with a helper woofer... Need to do some sim work but have not had the chance as of yet. Also debating what would be the best enclosure design for the helper woofer (and thus which woofer to use). Am I going about this the right way, or backwards?!
And is there any use in trying to use something like the K-aperture on the Karlsons or that JBL waveguide whatchamacallit to disperse the sound when there are beaming issues? Or this is more trouble than its worth, or maybe of limited value in a small living room type room (vs a large auditorium or similar)?
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here's some comments on K12 size run as 3-way in the context of music production vs bass reflex.
High Efficiency Speaker Asylum
for small speakers I would think Alpair 10 and Pluvia 7-11 would be very nice
High Efficiency Speaker Asylum
An externally hosted image should be here but it was not working when we last tested it.
for small speakers I would think Alpair 10 and Pluvia 7-11 would be very nice
Hmm, I thought that (6.5") was the 10.3? The 10.3 as a full range with big woofer (like a 15 or 18") augmenting the lows would also be pretty satisfactory I think... Opinions seem to vary on 10.3 vs. 12P.
And thanks Freddi, that's a rather interesting looking 3 way Karlson...
Either way, I'm still rather open to ideas, and still reading lots of other build threads and learning 🙂
And thanks Freddi, that's a rather interesting looking 3 way Karlson...
Either way, I'm still rather open to ideas, and still reading lots of other build threads and learning 🙂
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Well, starting at 20,000 Hz/8/pi = ~796 Hz = ~13560"/pi = ~5.42" dia., so what's the nearest driver effective dia. and can it handle the power required?
GM
GM
A10x are 5.25” (same size as the Jordan JX92/Ekona). The big bezels on these drivers cause some confusion.
We are working on a big MTM with A10PeN and a pair of A12pWeN. Aiming at something capable of handling most any kind of genre at significant levels.
dave
@ freddi Re Post #312
Interesting use of a fan grille for the mid protection 😉 Is that slot TW a Fostex, or similar ? I installed a number of Fane TW's back in the day on different occasions in various cabs, both slot & top range bullit types. I liked them 🙂 They havn't made them for years now, don't know why, as people would Definately buy them
@ sbcrx007 et al
Keep us posted about Any news on get TL APP to work 🙂
Interesting use of a fan grille for the mid protection 😉 Is that slot TW a Fostex, or similar ? I installed a number of Fane TW's back in the day on different occasions in various cabs, both slot & top range bullit types. I liked them 🙂 They havn't made them for years now, don't know why, as people would Definately buy them
@ sbcrx007 et al
Keep us posted about Any news on get TL APP to work 🙂
Okay, I'll bite... what are we calculating here, like a minimum driver diameter to produce sound from 20k to xover frequency, ~150 hz? I don't have enough background info to follow that calculation... 1/8 pi loading gets you to 796 hz, but 13560" isn't the wavelength... divided by pi again, so going from circumference to diameter presumably... maybe.
I see what you mean, you're talking more like effective diameter vs. nominal advertised diameter...
Sounds like potential for a nice MTM, but I'm not sure I'd call that big.. 🙂
A12pw woofers in MLTL for low end? Hmm. Sounds like it would have a lot more grunt than a lot of other full range setups here, but I'm not so sure it would be enough for my taste (loud & punchy)... That's only about 43in^2 cone area, vs. something more like 79in^2 for a random 12" woofer**, or about 201in^2 for an 18 woofer**.
**Approximations from just a quick calc, not actual catalog data
Judge for yourself. Drawing does not show the base… with that it will be > 1.8m tall.
dave
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