Frugel-Horn Mk3


Paid Member
2020-05-14 5:44 pm
Why don't you like the metal posts? Just preference?

FWIW, I will actually be swapping amps/cable a lot, moving things around, so I do want something easy to live with, and if I break something, allow me to replace.

Honestly, if I am happy to just keep it basic with something like these, should I stop worrying and just got moving on the build ;)



Paid Member
2011-02-04 11:35 am

I unscrewed the metal outer part of one of the binding posts - it measured 4 gms on a precision weighing scale. The inner part looks slightly thinner vs the ones with the plastic red and black bits, but it might be an optical illusion. All in all, the amount of metal is very less in both binding posts / terminals.

It is fairly certain that there will be no audible difference unless there is a bad contact somewhere. Close to 10 years back, in one of my speakers I had a piece of internal hookup wire that did not have a really tight contact with the binding post, and that speaker sounded slightly less loud vs the other one. Once I had it tightened, no difference.

I understand that you prefer less metal in the path, but after a point we need to understand that there will not be any differences. The WBT posts you shared earlier - those look like they have much more metal in them.


Don't sweat it - the ones I see in the pic of Bob's FH3 kit (rectangular terminal cup) work fine. I have used them in multiple projects. You can unscrew them and change the wires inside if you want to. Both these and the round terminals have similar tabs on which you can solder the wire on; you can use FASTON connectors too.
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Being able to hear differences due to too much metal is very impressive, have you ever considered participating in studies into the thresholds of human hearing?

Have you ever considered ceasing baiting people on an almost continuous basis? A number of people are getting very tired of seeing you emerge on threads, apparently for the express purpose of making a supercilious little comment about other members who you have decided hold a different view to yourself.
Replacing strong-magnetic parts to non-magnetic parts.
The sound becomes clearer and less muddy.

I can't comment on the magnetic side, but if you have steel in the signal path, you've got a significantly more resistive component than the majority of brass grades. A small amount given the quantities involved to be sure, but in HE systems, connection losses (most are rubbish -give me properly screwed down lug connection any day) can be an issue. No doubt that's why we've seen a proliferation of copper posts, although given how soft it is, it's probably not ideal if you're likely to be regularly moving components around.
It's an interesting observation, I'm just looking for a possible explanation, like why more metal sounds different, there could be a connection to skin effect too or impedance matching and reflections similar to in cables. The Essex Echo 1995: Electrical Signal Propagation & Cable Theory | It seems some people can hear such effects which makes thresholds of hearing an interesting subject too.
They might be able to. Or they might think they are able to, which in most normal conditions for psychological purposes amounts to the same thing and is fair enough, especially if it makes them feel better (providing they haven't been scammed by fiction, which most reasonable people would consider objectionable).

Hawksford's Essex Echo however is another matter entirely given that it purports to be a scientific / engineering piece. The equations contained are fine, nothing new, but the presentation is very concerning, with insufficient information to make the test setup properly repeatable and at best questionable methodology and a limited range of testing. The interpretation is even more open for critique, since it appears to selectively mix & match aspects of electrodynamics / EM (while carefully omitting other aspects) with classical electrical engineering. Which you can't do -it's either one or the other. Others working in the field (with no connection to audio) have described it as 'garbage', which is difficult to argue with. A sad state of affairs really -Omar is, to put it mildly, a very clever man, but this was not worthy of him in the '80s, it wasn't when it was cranked out again by Stereophile in the '90s, and it isn't now. :sad:

Be that as it may, it may be better to move such debates to a separate thread, since this one is about FH3.
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