Fran, I will use the Jelco lift with a modified /higher base mounted on the TT. I am busy with a plinth for the Lenco L78 and it will have two tonearms on, the Schroeder with a MC cart and the Lenco arm which I upgraded with a new armwand and Cardas wire, Shure M97Xe.
Attachments
Hi Hansrudolf,
Magnets were 3/8 x 1/4 inch N52. Happy listening, Ernst
Thank you very much! So I hope I'm not too far away with 10 mm dia. /10 mm long (could be they are a bit weaker than N52).
Greetings. Hansrudolf
A little help if you please
I've finished the majority of work on my version of the "clone" and have it temporarily mounted on a REK O KUT table.
The problem I'm having is when I set the weight of the tonearm it changes from the outside of the record (1.8g), to heaver near the spindle (3.5g).
I think I recall someone else having this trouble, but can't seem to find that post.
The only thing I can think of is that the lower magnet is somehow causing this? (Not perfectly aligned with the tonearm magnet?)
Any ideas and/help would be appreciated.
Also when I change the gap of the magnets I also need to change the counter weight location. Does this happen with everyone else?
Thanks,
Ron
I've finished the majority of work on my version of the "clone" and have it temporarily mounted on a REK O KUT table.
The problem I'm having is when I set the weight of the tonearm it changes from the outside of the record (1.8g), to heaver near the spindle (3.5g).
I think I recall someone else having this trouble, but can't seem to find that post.
The only thing I can think of is that the lower magnet is somehow causing this? (Not perfectly aligned with the tonearm magnet?)
Any ideas and/help would be appreciated.
Also when I change the gap of the magnets I also need to change the counter weight location. Does this happen with everyone else?
Thanks,
Ron
Ron,
I cannot comment yet, my tonearm is not mounted yet. Try rotating the bottom magnet housing in small increments and see if you do get an improvement. Secondly, make the bottom magnet spherical, I would say 3-5 degrees. Hope you solve the problem! Happy listening!!! Ernst
I cannot comment yet, my tonearm is not mounted yet. Try rotating the bottom magnet housing in small increments and see if you do get an improvement. Secondly, make the bottom magnet spherical, I would say 3-5 degrees. Hope you solve the problem! Happy listening!!! Ernst
Ernst,
Your build is exceptional, very beautiful, I'm jealous.
Rotate! Brilliant! I'll give it a try and post back how/if it worked!
I have no way other than a file/grinder to change the shape of the magnet. 🙁
Thanks
Ron
Your build is exceptional, very beautiful, I'm jealous.
Rotate! Brilliant! I'll give it a try and post back how/if it worked!
I have no way other than a file/grinder to change the shape of the magnet. 🙁
Thanks
Ron
"Out of the Frying Pan............"
Thanks to Ernst, I was able to find and correct the tracking weight, or VTF problem I was having. The upper and lower magnets were not aligned vertically. The lower hole was off by about 2mm. I now get a only small differences on VTF from the outside to the inside of the LP.
Out of the frying pan and into the fire; I just can't seem to get the anti-skating to work at all. The tonearm tries to skate freely across the record when lowering the needle. I twist the knob and the string twists up which raises / lowers the tonearm distance to the bottom magnet and then tracking force is all screwed up again, which effects the anti-skating............
I'm so frustrated I could just toss it in the trash.
Frank you were right, it's not as easy as it looks. LOL
Sorry to ramble here. Has anyone else had this much difficulty ? Perhaps the tolerances just have to be closer than I can accomplish without proper tools. A Lathe comes to mind. Where's my hammer?????????
Ron
Happy Fathers Day to all!
Thanks to Ernst, I was able to find and correct the tracking weight, or VTF problem I was having. The upper and lower magnets were not aligned vertically. The lower hole was off by about 2mm. I now get a only small differences on VTF from the outside to the inside of the LP.
Out of the frying pan and into the fire; I just can't seem to get the anti-skating to work at all. The tonearm tries to skate freely across the record when lowering the needle. I twist the knob and the string twists up which raises / lowers the tonearm distance to the bottom magnet and then tracking force is all screwed up again, which effects the anti-skating............
I'm so frustrated I could just toss it in the trash.
Frank you were right, it's not as easy as it looks. LOL
Sorry to ramble here. Has anyone else had this much difficulty ? Perhaps the tolerances just have to be closer than I can accomplish without proper tools. A Lathe comes to mind. Where's my hammer?????????
Ron
Happy Fathers Day to all!
Antiskate
I don't know if this will help but I'm just going to throw this out there. Is the suspending thread formed from more than one filament twisted together? If it is then possibly if it was twisted in the other direction it may help the situation. I don't know if I am being clear enough for you to understand what I'm getting at.
I don't know if this will help but I'm just going to throw this out there. Is the suspending thread formed from more than one filament twisted together? If it is then possibly if it was twisted in the other direction it may help the situation. I don't know if I am being clear enough for you to understand what I'm getting at.
Thanks to Ernst, I was able to find and correct the tracking weight, or VTF problem I was having. The upper and lower magnets were not aligned vertically. The lower hole was off by about 2mm. I now get a only small differences on VTF from the outside to the inside of the LP.
Out of the frying pan and into the fire; I just can't seem to get the anti-skating to work at all. The tonearm tries to skate freely across the record when lowering the needle. I twist the knob and the string twists up which raises / lowers the tonearm distance to the bottom magnet and then tracking force is all screwed up again, which effects the anti-skating............
I'm so frustrated I could just toss it in the trash.
Frank you were right, it's not as easy as it looks. LOL
Sorry to ramble here. Has anyone else had this much difficulty ? Perhaps the tolerances just have to be closer than I can accomplish without proper tools. A Lathe comes to mind. Where's my hammer?????????
Ron
Happy Fathers Day to all!
Ron,
Take a look at my post #801 Adjuster detail. I modified the design of the anti-skating wheel and magnet gap adjustment to permit magnet gap adjustment without changing the anti-skate twist setting. By implementing this adjuster you can set the anti-skate force to what you want and then set the magnet gap with a vertical only adjustment of gap. This worked out better for me than any other arrangement. Good luck.
BillG
LFM,
Thanks for the thoughts and help, yes the string is made up of many filaments, way to think outside the box. I'' replace the string with a new one just to be sure.
BillG,
Thanks for pointing me to #801, that would work very well. I think because my "string" is so short < 1 cm it effects the anti skate dramaticly when anything is adjusted.
As I recall, Frank recomends the gap on the magnets to be about the thickness of a credit card. right?
When adjusting the gap / antiskate / VFT, is the correct order: Gap / antiskate / VTF?
It seems like I have forgotten everything and am starting from the beginning...
Thanks for the help guys.
Ron
Thanks for the thoughts and help, yes the string is made up of many filaments, way to think outside the box. I'' replace the string with a new one just to be sure.
BillG,
Thanks for pointing me to #801, that would work very well. I think because my "string" is so short < 1 cm it effects the anti skate dramaticly when anything is adjusted.
As I recall, Frank recomends the gap on the magnets to be about the thickness of a credit card. right?
When adjusting the gap / antiskate / VFT, is the correct order: Gap / antiskate / VTF?
It seems like I have forgotten everything and am starting from the beginning...
Thanks for the help guys.
Ron
Ron,
Look at 799, it is the reply that gave rise to 801 for the adjuster detail. 799 also discusses the issue of what to use for the suspension thread. You may find that different "thread" material such as the braided square cross section line of a gauge selected to put you in the ball park with the least required number of twist turns of the thread will help to make your clone more tractable.
rgds,
BillG
Hi Ron,
I was out of town for a week, so excuse my late interference 🙂 . The diameter of the thread in conjunction with the inherent stiffness of the thread-material and -geometry chosen ought to render a skating compensation force that is sufficient for one gram of VTF for each full turn of the thread. Try something like a 0.3 -0.4mm diameter...
The magnet gap can easily adjusted independently of the skating force without having to resort to Bill's adjuster. Just "hold" the screw that the thread is attached to(like an Allen head grub screw) with the Allen key(with one hand), then turn the "antiskating disc" in which the screw is sitting(with the other hand). The screw will travel up or down, depending upon the turning direction, therefore raise or lower the armwand/magnet assembly, closing or widening the gap between the magnets.
Perfect perpendicularity of the thread/magnet/magnet alignment is a MUST, otherwise the VTF and/or the azimuth will vary across the record(said that many times 🙂
What makes this so difficult is that many easily(ebay) available magnets are not even close to "flat" or even round. Carefull when you grind them, NeFeB dust is toxic(lung, liver) once inside your body...
Cheers,
Frank
I was out of town for a week, so excuse my late interference 🙂 . The diameter of the thread in conjunction with the inherent stiffness of the thread-material and -geometry chosen ought to render a skating compensation force that is sufficient for one gram of VTF for each full turn of the thread. Try something like a 0.3 -0.4mm diameter...
The magnet gap can easily adjusted independently of the skating force without having to resort to Bill's adjuster. Just "hold" the screw that the thread is attached to(like an Allen head grub screw) with the Allen key(with one hand), then turn the "antiskating disc" in which the screw is sitting(with the other hand). The screw will travel up or down, depending upon the turning direction, therefore raise or lower the armwand/magnet assembly, closing or widening the gap between the magnets.
Perfect perpendicularity of the thread/magnet/magnet alignment is a MUST, otherwise the VTF and/or the azimuth will vary across the record(said that many times 🙂
What makes this so difficult is that many easily(ebay) available magnets are not even close to "flat" or even round. Carefull when you grind them, NeFeB dust is toxic(lung, liver) once inside your body...
Cheers,
Frank
DUMKOPF am I for not realizing how simple independence of the two adjustments could be achieved. Make me wear a duncecap for a week or two Frank. I still like my adjuster. Bill.
Bgruhn,
You can have that "cap" when I'm done with it. LOL😛
Thanks Frank for your generous (as always) input and hard earned insight. I understood the mechanical functioning of the anti-skate wheel/knob, my problems were of my own making. (most of them are) The magnets were not aligned well and it went "south" from there. Just got worse and worse.
After staying away from "the project" for a few days and thinking about it. I'm sure that the shortness of my string is the main problem. I used the multi-filament that Mr. Davidson uses. Alas, I am not in his league when it comes to metal work. I used too much super glue and it ran down the entire string making it stiff as heck. I think I'll rebuild the pillars out of wood (I like that look) and need the extra string length.
Wish me luck. 🙂
Thanks for all the help fellas.
Ron
You can have that "cap" when I'm done with it. LOL😛
Thanks Frank for your generous (as always) input and hard earned insight. I understood the mechanical functioning of the anti-skate wheel/knob, my problems were of my own making. (most of them are) The magnets were not aligned well and it went "south" from there. Just got worse and worse.
After staying away from "the project" for a few days and thinking about it. I'm sure that the shortness of my string is the main problem. I used the multi-filament that Mr. Davidson uses. Alas, I am not in his league when it comes to metal work. I used too much super glue and it ran down the entire string making it stiff as heck. I think I'll rebuild the pillars out of wood (I like that look) and need the extra string length.
Wish me luck. 🙂
Thanks for all the help fellas.
Ron
Just a half drop of SuperGlue is all that's needed on top of the knot. More is not good as all you want to do is keep that knot's fibers from separting.
Reminded me of a commercial I saw as a kid:
Brylcreem Commercial- YouTube
JD
Reminded me of a commercial I saw as a kid:
Brylcreem Commercial- YouTube
JD
JD,
Yep, I too am old enough to remember without looking at youtube...." A little drop 'ell do ya".
LOL, I had some very old superglue. it saturated the string before I knew what happened.
After spending about 2 hours trying to tie the knots in that stuff with the fibers flying all over the place I wasn't going to retie it again. I was wrong. The string was too short too. I'm in the process of remaking the gallows. This time with greater concern for accuracy.
Ron
Yep, I too am old enough to remember without looking at youtube...." A little drop 'ell do ya".
LOL, I had some very old superglue. it saturated the string before I knew what happened.
After spending about 2 hours trying to tie the knots in that stuff with the fibers flying all over the place I wasn't going to retie it again. I was wrong. The string was too short too. I'm in the process of remaking the gallows. This time with greater concern for accuracy.
Ron
Must be my month to post
May I present to my fellow admirers of Mr. Schroeder work, my humble version the the AWESOME tonearm! 😱
After almost ditching it in the trash, I went back to the beginning and started again. this time measuring everything with my digital calipers.
I am SOOOOO glad I didn't give up. The sound stage is so wide it's almost unbelievable! .................I heard bongos on a Jefferson Starship album I've never heard before. Extremely clean, crisp and analogue. 😀
I played "The Eagles Greatest Hits" for my 25 year old daughter and she said it sounded like it does when it's live music. She has never heard an LP before.
A Giant THANK YOU to Frank for all you help and patience with us.
Another great big thanks to all my friends on DiyAudio too.
Very Happy Man.....Wifee too!😉
Ron
May I present to my fellow admirers of Mr. Schroeder work, my humble version the the AWESOME tonearm! 😱
After almost ditching it in the trash, I went back to the beginning and started again. this time measuring everything with my digital calipers.
I am SOOOOO glad I didn't give up. The sound stage is so wide it's almost unbelievable! .................I heard bongos on a Jefferson Starship album I've never heard before. Extremely clean, crisp and analogue. 😀
I played "The Eagles Greatest Hits" for my 25 year old daughter and she said it sounded like it does when it's live music. She has never heard an LP before.
A Giant THANK YOU to Frank for all you help and patience with us.
Another great big thanks to all my friends on DiyAudio too.
Very Happy Man.....Wifee too!😉
Ron
