Hi Carlos,
"Chipping in", is a common slang term in English. Maybe comes from poker games, where one puts chips into the betting pot. Used as slang, the general meaning is to make a contribution.
Sheldon
"Chipping in", is a common slang term in English. Maybe comes from poker games, where one puts chips into the betting pot. Used as slang, the general meaning is to make a contribution.
Sheldon
Now a different question for Graham.
I've often seen reference to the issue of speaker lead length vs. interconnect length, but not much technical discussion behind it. I know from following the GEM thread and discussions that you have taken unusual pains to control the amp/speaker system interaction. Two general questions:
Is it more an issue at higher frequencies, or does lead inductance audibly affect the amp/woofer interaction to a similar degree?
It seems to my weakly informed intuition that this issue would be important in amplifiers that utilize a fair amount global feedback. Would non-feedback amps, such as a SE or PP tube amps be affected to a similar degree?
Sheldon
Graham Maynard said:
I've often seen reference to the issue of speaker lead length vs. interconnect length, but not much technical discussion behind it. I know from following the GEM thread and discussions that you have taken unusual pains to control the amp/speaker system interaction. Two general questions:
Is it more an issue at higher frequencies, or does lead inductance audibly affect the amp/woofer interaction to a similar degree?
It seems to my weakly informed intuition that this issue would be important in amplifiers that utilize a fair amount global feedback. Would non-feedback amps, such as a SE or PP tube amps be affected to a similar degree?
Sheldon
Hi Sheldon,
Two 'simple' questions but so many variables are involved.
There can be amplifier output inductance. Series output inductance. LS cable inductance.
Class-A and class-AB amplifier types behave differently with regard to LS generated back-EMF.
LS system generated back-EMF can be generated by crossover circuitry as well as drivers/cabinets.
Simple cross-over circuitry tends to have a lower Q and generates less back-EMF.
LS system back-EMF generates voltage across the above inductances which is independent of amplified audio input but wrt to it, and arises at a fractional level before NFB can counter any component caused by amplifier impedance, thus causing high audio frequency error.
Non-global-NFB amps can have high or reasonably low output impedance, this will affect the way they control the loudspeaker and damp back-EMF.
So cable to woofer not likely to be a problem, but woofer back-EMF can cause a class-AB amplifier to generate hf artifacts at the output terminal that will modify mid/high output.
High global feedback generally leads to a need for more stabilisation which can increase amplifier output impedance and the generation of fractional higher frequency back-EMF artifacts.
Lower damping factors at 10kHz wrt 100Hz are indicative of this.
Way back in the 70s Nelson Pass developed a class-A design that had flat damping throughout the audio range - that will still sound good today,
though low output impedance (voltage) amplifiers make loudspeaker systems sound different when compared to high output impedance (current) types.
We just have to make a choice and do the best we can within that choice.
Carlos' amp without a choke is a medium NFB design with flat output impedance across the AF range. It does not follow any design extreme and is a useful middle-of-road approach.
What a carry-on this audio lark is !!!
Two 'simple' questions but so many variables are involved.
There can be amplifier output inductance. Series output inductance. LS cable inductance.
Class-A and class-AB amplifier types behave differently with regard to LS generated back-EMF.
LS system generated back-EMF can be generated by crossover circuitry as well as drivers/cabinets.
Simple cross-over circuitry tends to have a lower Q and generates less back-EMF.
LS system back-EMF generates voltage across the above inductances which is independent of amplified audio input but wrt to it, and arises at a fractional level before NFB can counter any component caused by amplifier impedance, thus causing high audio frequency error.
Non-global-NFB amps can have high or reasonably low output impedance, this will affect the way they control the loudspeaker and damp back-EMF.
So cable to woofer not likely to be a problem, but woofer back-EMF can cause a class-AB amplifier to generate hf artifacts at the output terminal that will modify mid/high output.
High global feedback generally leads to a need for more stabilisation which can increase amplifier output impedance and the generation of fractional higher frequency back-EMF artifacts.
Lower damping factors at 10kHz wrt 100Hz are indicative of this.
Way back in the 70s Nelson Pass developed a class-A design that had flat damping throughout the audio range - that will still sound good today,
though low output impedance (voltage) amplifiers make loudspeaker systems sound different when compared to high output impedance (current) types.
We just have to make a choice and do the best we can within that choice.
Carlos' amp without a choke is a medium NFB design with flat output impedance across the AF range. It does not follow any design extreme and is a useful middle-of-road approach.
What a carry-on this audio lark is !!!
Thanks Graham,
That helps. Was trying to get some sense of things. At present, my main system is multi-amped, with crossovers done at line level. So, should make things a bit more behaved. At some point, I'll play with the amps close to the speakers - at least the tweeter amp.
Sheldon
That helps. Was trying to get some sense of things. At present, my main system is multi-amped, with crossovers done at line level. So, should make things a bit more behaved. At some point, I'll play with the amps close to the speakers - at least the tweeter amp.
Sheldon
Hi Sheldon,
So you do not have loudspeaker system reactivity for one driver and its section introducing an error voltage upon the drive to other loudspeakers/sections.
When your tweeter amplifier is behind the loudspeaker you could still end up with the pre>to>amp interconnect causing a fractional loss of treble.
That interconnect needs a low impedance drive, and the tweeter amplifier will control better if it runs with a lower, say 600 ohms impedance/resistance, at the input device.
Amplifiers with more than this value of series resistance between the input terminal and the first device can lose treble definition (as Carlos has tested in this very thread above) because the NFB sensing reference point 'seen' by the first device is also in series with that same input circuitry.
So you do not have loudspeaker system reactivity for one driver and its section introducing an error voltage upon the drive to other loudspeakers/sections.
When your tweeter amplifier is behind the loudspeaker you could still end up with the pre>to>amp interconnect causing a fractional loss of treble.
That interconnect needs a low impedance drive, and the tweeter amplifier will control better if it runs with a lower, say 600 ohms impedance/resistance, at the input device.
Amplifiers with more than this value of series resistance between the input terminal and the first device can lose treble definition (as Carlos has tested in this very thread above) because the NFB sensing reference point 'seen' by the first device is also in series with that same input circuitry.
You can not imagine so happy i am to see dear Graham here... teaching me things..
he is someone i have respect, apreciation and confidence.
Also Sheldon....good to have you around...Nando and other folks are welcome as they are friendly and old fellows too.
I am on troubles here, and i had not time (incredible that) to read forum yesterday....late in the nigth i could not login....local problems i think.
I am facing an invasion in some land i have.... land i have received from my daddy and is destinated to my sons...behind the building i live...near the lake....8 portions of land...240 by 380 meters all them together..invaded by people that has not place to leave....hard thing to do... to tell them to go out, when i am not using, not needing the land, but protecting my son's future and protecting what is rigth and fair (?)...i am not sure...people there needing a place to leave....really awfull day.....my family called Police as they were in 40 to 50 produccing noise to intimidated me...holding flags and i was in the middle of the hush with those guys discussing..i was alone till Police, Heavily armed arrived.
The land already cleaned to construct...hehe...and they were asking me to prove that land was mine ...Police arriving they disappeared...all the courageous that were denniying to leave my land gone, as a magic.
Awfull guys!.... hard social problems here.... enormous difference in money..... payment different in a ratio of 30 to 40 times....something that remenber slavery.... they were ready to split that land in 50 or more small parts, to construct with old wood, papper and sheets of metal....i am still feeling sad.
Problem is that i have more than i need...and they have less than they need.... so....hard to make judgements...in my point of view they are not rigth...and i am not rigth to have more than i need too.
Go ahead...please....keep the thread alive....talk about everything and please, sometime comment my amplifier, only to avoid to be completelly out of forum rules...not to be splitted in the name of forum's good organization.
regards,
Carlos
he is someone i have respect, apreciation and confidence.
Also Sheldon....good to have you around...Nando and other folks are welcome as they are friendly and old fellows too.
I am on troubles here, and i had not time (incredible that) to read forum yesterday....late in the nigth i could not login....local problems i think.
I am facing an invasion in some land i have.... land i have received from my daddy and is destinated to my sons...behind the building i live...near the lake....8 portions of land...240 by 380 meters all them together..invaded by people that has not place to leave....hard thing to do... to tell them to go out, when i am not using, not needing the land, but protecting my son's future and protecting what is rigth and fair (?)...i am not sure...people there needing a place to leave....really awfull day.....my family called Police as they were in 40 to 50 produccing noise to intimidated me...holding flags and i was in the middle of the hush with those guys discussing..i was alone till Police, Heavily armed arrived.
The land already cleaned to construct...hehe...and they were asking me to prove that land was mine ...Police arriving they disappeared...all the courageous that were denniying to leave my land gone, as a magic.
Awfull guys!.... hard social problems here.... enormous difference in money..... payment different in a ratio of 30 to 40 times....something that remenber slavery.... they were ready to split that land in 50 or more small parts, to construct with old wood, papper and sheets of metal....i am still feeling sad.
Problem is that i have more than i need...and they have less than they need.... so....hard to make judgements...in my point of view they are not rigth...and i am not rigth to have more than i need too.
Go ahead...please....keep the thread alive....talk about everything and please, sometime comment my amplifier, only to avoid to be completelly out of forum rules...not to be splitted in the name of forum's good organization.
regards,
Carlos
Graham Maynard said:
Thanks Graham,
The fog is slowly lifting.
You touch on an issue that is probably well understood in pro applications, but I only see occasional reference to it for home audio - namely the issue of interconnect termination. I take your answer to mean that long interconnects should be driven by a low impedance source, but also that they should be terminated by a low impedance. So if the amp has a typical input impedance of 20k and the preamp or driver has an impedance of 50 ohms or so, then we should add a resistor to ground at the amp end of 600 to 1000 ohms. If you are using something like the GEM, with a 600 ohm input impedance, then the termination resistor is not required. I assume that the low impedance to ground should also help in noise pick up issues with longer interconnects. Sorry if this seems elementary, just wanted to confirm.
For the topic, Carlo's nice simple amp would be a good candidate for multi amping, because it can be configured for a variety of voltages. 🙂
Sorry to hear about your troubles Carlos. Life is not so black and white as we believed as kids, and it's not so easy to pick one right answer that has no wrong in it. That's why I worry when we have world leaders who say "I sleep very well". That can only mean that their vision is narrow.
Sheldon
Hi Sheldon.
If the pre-amp has a low output impedance the amplifier input impedance does not need to be low, or terminated by a 600 ohm resistor.
600 ohm as used in studios (with 600 ohms step up/down matching transformers for tube circuits) limits cable induced amplitude cut and phase shift at higher audio frequencies, and - as you say - helps reduce interference field pick-up.
If you take a traditional SS amp with 10k to 47k input impedance - it will be more hissy when music is not playing, more susceptible to pick up voltage field interference (fridge clicks etc), and the amp will blast very loudly as the centre pin of a phono plug is inserted or removed when compared to an amp having a 600 ohm input.
Sheldon wrote > For the topic, Carlo's nice simple amp would be a good candidate for multi amping, because it can be configured for a variety of voltages. <
I agree, and cheaper, more rugged devices could be used for sub or bass channels too.
When I simulated the circuit it performed well through a wide range of quiescent bias currents, so the same circuit could be used with top spec devices running in class-A to drive say a ribbon tweeter !!!
Carlos, did you notice much difference in sound when you set the quiescent current bias at different levels ?
If the pre-amp has a low output impedance the amplifier input impedance does not need to be low, or terminated by a 600 ohm resistor.
600 ohm as used in studios (with 600 ohms step up/down matching transformers for tube circuits) limits cable induced amplitude cut and phase shift at higher audio frequencies, and - as you say - helps reduce interference field pick-up.
If you take a traditional SS amp with 10k to 47k input impedance - it will be more hissy when music is not playing, more susceptible to pick up voltage field interference (fridge clicks etc), and the amp will blast very loudly as the centre pin of a phono plug is inserted or removed when compared to an amp having a 600 ohm input.
Sheldon wrote > For the topic, Carlo's nice simple amp would be a good candidate for multi amping, because it can be configured for a variety of voltages. <
I agree, and cheaper, more rugged devices could be used for sub or bass channels too.
When I simulated the circuit it performed well through a wide range of quiescent bias currents, so the same circuit could be used with top spec devices running in class-A to drive say a ribbon tweeter !!!
Carlos, did you notice much difference in sound when you set the quiescent current bias at different levels ?
Thinking about the 'Brown Microphone Amplifier' in post #242 above (which is said to have had the gain of two triode stages)
that was the 'solid state' of 85 years ago.
I constructed a microphone using the carbon rod from a battery and a large tin when I was 11. You could hear a fly's footsteps in earphones after it recovered from being swatted and put on the tin. (My first 'electronics'.)
that was the 'solid state' of 85 years ago.
I constructed a microphone using the carbon rod from a battery and a large tin when I was 11. You could hear a fly's footsteps in earphones after it recovered from being swatted and put on the tin. (My first 'electronics'.)
Losses in details and audio brigth when bias was increased
Better point was 88 miliamps as total iddle consumption...output stage was draining something around 50 miliamps.
Bias increased above 100 miliamps started to mute the high frequencies....and going further i had audio compression. because those TIP transistors i think
regards,
Carlos
Better point was 88 miliamps as total iddle consumption...output stage was draining something around 50 miliamps.
Bias increased above 100 miliamps started to mute the high frequencies....and going further i had audio compression. because those TIP transistors i think
regards,
Carlos
That is interesting Carlos.
As with other designs you find that changing the bias current also changes output device characteristic controlled circuit operation,
so it just goes to show that neither theoretical 'improvements' nor a simulator can be used to predict what actually sounds best for any real-world listening situation.
Every little change must be check tested, and amplifiers need to be A-B compared using human ears, NOT instruments.
I don't doubt that the 'thd' of your Dx amplifier could be reduced to between one tenth and one hundredth of its present figure, but this would mean using circuitry you have already found makes it sound worse ........
As with other designs you find that changing the bias current also changes output device characteristic controlled circuit operation,
so it just goes to show that neither theoretical 'improvements' nor a simulator can be used to predict what actually sounds best for any real-world listening situation.
Every little change must be check tested, and amplifiers need to be A-B compared using human ears, NOT instruments.
I don't doubt that the 'thd' of your Dx amplifier could be reduced to between one tenth and one hundredth of its present figure, but this would mean using circuitry you have already found makes it sound worse ........
That THD distortion reduction normally sounds not good.
Symassym is one exception.
I do think....or i can say that i am sure...that the only method able to avoid errors is the AB controled test...blind method....made with a lot of care not to be fooled...we are, we, humans, all time long, crazy to fool ourselves...because of brands, amplifiers size, because THD is low, because simulation results was wonderfull....well...we go to listen with some partial judgment already made.
So...having some "belief" in advance...well..for sure you have some tendence.... not a fair result of your evaluation will come to your mind....blind and controled....and simultaneous switching...the same speaker...the same position...the same music...switching fast...not time interval.....and change the music...both amplifiers with same peak power level...the same speaker again...swithing....this is something that will make you perceive things... and only sound will be judged..not the pretty design, the design complexity, because pretty, because complicated, because expensive, because you have designed, so...yourself....your personality, your beliefs jump out of the evaluating system..only sound will decide...not your personal values, preferences and beliefs ...but you cannot know what amplifier is playing.
You will see, or perceive, so many insights, so many surprises that the work lost to assemble a good evaluation place... the speaker, the switching and the work lost to prepare.... also the one that will help, as you cannot know what is going on...only ear my dear...ear my dear...only ear my dear.
You may think those results as unbelievable..you will repeat them many times...and this will show you that you had "some spected results"....You will listen, will know, as some stupid and simple designs behaving, sonically, much better than expensive and sophisticated ones.
For sure, you will bust, explode, detonate a lot of Myths, including that one you may think that your judgement is fair....negative...not fair...we do not judge nothing fair.... we need a method to control us....our will...beliefs, decisions.
Man!.... i do those testing since 1981, because of Suonno magazine...so..you see how long i am suspecting about people's evaluation and searching for fair testing methods...you can see that some distortions are in 20 Kilohertz...people go and measure them in lower frequencies to offer good numbers...people go manipulating everything to show a good figure..people is terrible...we are terrible...so, the need to test under controled sittuations is needed..you cannot imagine how much i could see (listen) and perceive those years.
regards,
Carlos
Symassym is one exception.
I do think....or i can say that i am sure...that the only method able to avoid errors is the AB controled test...blind method....made with a lot of care not to be fooled...we are, we, humans, all time long, crazy to fool ourselves...because of brands, amplifiers size, because THD is low, because simulation results was wonderfull....well...we go to listen with some partial judgment already made.
So...having some "belief" in advance...well..for sure you have some tendence.... not a fair result of your evaluation will come to your mind....blind and controled....and simultaneous switching...the same speaker...the same position...the same music...switching fast...not time interval.....and change the music...both amplifiers with same peak power level...the same speaker again...swithing....this is something that will make you perceive things... and only sound will be judged..not the pretty design, the design complexity, because pretty, because complicated, because expensive, because you have designed, so...yourself....your personality, your beliefs jump out of the evaluating system..only sound will decide...not your personal values, preferences and beliefs ...but you cannot know what amplifier is playing.
You will see, or perceive, so many insights, so many surprises that the work lost to assemble a good evaluation place... the speaker, the switching and the work lost to prepare.... also the one that will help, as you cannot know what is going on...only ear my dear...ear my dear...only ear my dear.
You may think those results as unbelievable..you will repeat them many times...and this will show you that you had "some spected results"....You will listen, will know, as some stupid and simple designs behaving, sonically, much better than expensive and sophisticated ones.
For sure, you will bust, explode, detonate a lot of Myths, including that one you may think that your judgement is fair....negative...not fair...we do not judge nothing fair.... we need a method to control us....our will...beliefs, decisions.
Man!.... i do those testing since 1981, because of Suonno magazine...so..you see how long i am suspecting about people's evaluation and searching for fair testing methods...you can see that some distortions are in 20 Kilohertz...people go and measure them in lower frequencies to offer good numbers...people go manipulating everything to show a good figure..people is terrible...we are terrible...so, the need to test under controled sittuations is needed..you cannot imagine how much i could see (listen) and perceive those years.
regards,
Carlos
One real life example to make easier your understanding related what i mean.
Real life thing that happened...how people fool themselves.
A friend was visiting Volkswagen shop when i bougth my 16 valves car.
He was very well impressed how the power appeared over 5000 rpm.
In a month he returned to me with informations he found that 16 valve engines produces Carbon inside, pré ignition, detonations....well, he told that because he was informed that...from a good Aircraft engineer....those ones mount and dismount jet motors...a good one!
Well...i told him...but i am not an Enginneer that is able to dismount engines...that this depends from the motor ignition timing, the fuel is very important, the injection or carburetor, the spark plug dissipation capacity...well....not connected to 16V engines.... the compression ratio is important too...and you can have low and high compression 16V engines.
He continued to accept that 16 motor engines are problematic.
Yesterday he came to show me a new Toyota he bougth...a 2002 model, ahahahah...a 16 Valve engine there.
And i told him...hummm..... 16 valve, as you told me will produce carbon.
Do you know what he told me:
The Toyota mechanic told me that Toyota 16V engines do not produce carbon!!!!!
You see how much we can be fair..when the car is ours...the amplifier also beeing ours...our design...our friend design.... or pretty....or expensive, or famous.
hehe...not carbon only in your motor man!
Is he an idiot!...no...no ...no!..he is a normal human...alike you and me.
regards,
Carlos
Real life thing that happened...how people fool themselves.
A friend was visiting Volkswagen shop when i bougth my 16 valves car.
He was very well impressed how the power appeared over 5000 rpm.
In a month he returned to me with informations he found that 16 valve engines produces Carbon inside, pré ignition, detonations....well, he told that because he was informed that...from a good Aircraft engineer....those ones mount and dismount jet motors...a good one!
Well...i told him...but i am not an Enginneer that is able to dismount engines...that this depends from the motor ignition timing, the fuel is very important, the injection or carburetor, the spark plug dissipation capacity...well....not connected to 16V engines.... the compression ratio is important too...and you can have low and high compression 16V engines.
He continued to accept that 16 motor engines are problematic.
Yesterday he came to show me a new Toyota he bougth...a 2002 model, ahahahah...a 16 Valve engine there.
And i told him...hummm..... 16 valve, as you told me will produce carbon.
Do you know what he told me:
The Toyota mechanic told me that Toyota 16V engines do not produce carbon!!!!!
You see how much we can be fair..when the car is ours...the amplifier also beeing ours...our design...our friend design.... or pretty....or expensive, or famous.
hehe...not carbon only in your motor man!
Is he an idiot!...no...no ...no!..he is a normal human...alike you and me.
regards,
Carlos
Something i have made about A to B comparison
http://www.diyaudio.com/forums/showthread.php?postid=601741#post601741
If interested in the subject, the above will explain what i mean with those terms.
regards,
Carlos
http://www.diyaudio.com/forums/showthread.php?postid=601741#post601741
If interested in the subject, the above will explain what i mean with those terms.
regards,
Carlos
My experience is that whatever change is made, our ears/brain take some time to be accustomed to "the new situation"
Maybe first the next day you can judge if it was a good change, and if your ears feel content with the sound
A-B testing isnt worth much in quality testing on very subtle changes, and blindtesting is the absolute worst in this respect
Carlos, I dont hope I believe in what ever is convenient like you say, but I do know those who do - hell, maybe we all do that
Maybe first the next day you can judge if it was a good change, and if your ears feel content with the sound
A-B testing isnt worth much in quality testing on very subtle changes, and blindtesting is the absolute worst in this respect
Carlos, I dont hope I believe in what ever is convenient like you say, but I do know those who do - hell, maybe we all do that
tinitus said:My experience is that whatever change is made, our ears/brain take some time to be accustomed to "the new situation"
Maybe first the next day you can judge if it was a good change, and if your ears feel content with the sound
A-B testing isnt worth much in quality testing on very subtle changes, and blindtesting is the absolute worst in this respect
Carlos, I dont hope I believe in what ever is convenient like you say, but I do know those who do - hell, maybe we all do that
I don't think it's always a matter of convenience or desire. The issue is that what we hear (the physical process) and what we perceive (physical hearing integrated into our thoughts and feelings) are different. The same sounds under the same conditions are mostly "heard" the same, but may be perceived differently, because our brain is in a different state - different day, different company, different experiences just prior to listening, and so many other things.
Our thoughts can certainly color our perception. The only way to account for this is blind testing. Now, it may well be that quick A/B testing is not adequate to pick out subtle things. Maybe it sounds good at first, but for some reason we can't identify it irritates us after a while. That's fine and it doesn't invalidate blind A/B tests. No reason in principle a blind test can't take place over hours or days. If you are saying that you must see the component or know what is inside to make a valid comparison, then I say you are merely comparing your own internal perception as colored by your expectation. You are not testing the effect of the component on the actual sound.
Sheldon
I like the first part, which I find is very true
As to testing - if you dont know what to listen fore, you cannot identify it at all
Blindtesting can easily be done deliberately to confuse - after a very short while you really cant hear anything - your mind is completely confused and cant detect the tiny subtle things
As to testing - if you dont know what to listen fore, you cannot identify it at all
Blindtesting can easily be done deliberately to confuse - after a very short while you really cant hear anything - your mind is completely confused and cant detect the tiny subtle things
Sheldon said:
This is so.
This happens at the limits of our perceptions.
At the boundary where it is very difficult to get a 'clear perception' or any perception at all.
Not only in hearing, but also in percept with our eyesight.
Think of a dark night.
You are on your way home.
Maybe you have seen a horror movie .. a real scary one.
Or as young, you had gather with comrades to tell scary stories.
And you have to pass through a dark forest on your path home.
Now those trees and bushes waving in the wind in the very dark night will make you scared. Looks like bandits or some who are out to get you. They are ready to attack where you hurrying home alone barely see anything in the black of the night.
In full daylight where your eyes have no problem to see those bushes
there is nothing scary about them.
Same thing is with our ears.
When we are at the limits of what ears can actually catch,
our brain will fill in 'the gaps'.
Using expectations and memories and associations you have stored in your brain cells .... memory bank.
What associations you will be fed depends on your feelings and mod.
So the endresult .. your impression can be very different.
We can say, at the limits of you ability to sense stimuli from your 5 senses,
the final result can be more or an imaginary 'reality'
instead of the real thing.
Even when seeing something clearly ... we can get different impression from same sight. If we put ourselves into an imaginative state.
But what they eye catches and you sight impression will be more in line in this case,
even if the resulting feeling can be different, depeding on circumstances.
Same thing when you enter into a room, from a hot steambath ( sauna).
It feels cold.
But when you arrived from the cold weather from outside
into this un-dressing room, it was a warm feeling.
Yet, in the reality, the temperature of room hasn't changed.
It may even be warmer than before (because of hot air steams).
lineup
Dx amplifier...dx amp...my amplifier was tested using A to B method
So...we are all talking about on topic things...good for us.
Sheldon, Tinitus and Lineup, you are all cooperating with some interesting details to this study, as nothing is finished related researched....i am always on the run searching for better method, the more perfect sound (to my ears).
The environment...the Psychological ambience.... the company you have, your psychological moment is very important as Sheldon told us.
You are rigth also Tinitus...brain adjust everything, filling gaps and correcting Eq unballances.... introducing Bass where you have not.... we can focus and the first seconds are very important, as the ear+ input brain could not be adjusted...so....the rational part of your brain, your conscience...that thing that make you feel and perceive yourself as an biologic unit that can sense the world using sensors...that part will receive non filtered sound...so...switching A to B...you will have something not adjusted in the first moments.
I think, if you go too long you will be hardly confused.....reason why, now a days i use to make fast testings ....and i go changing music to avoid those "adjustments"
Also Lineup talking about the images we have about our previous life experiences...as he install the ambience inside a system, where you have many references to analise.
Lovely posts you have made.... very cooperative and turning this thread more rich.... in special everybody listening and respecting other friends experiences, the way must be done, as no one of us can guarantee what is absolutelly rigth.
regards,
Carlos
So...we are all talking about on topic things...good for us.
Sheldon, Tinitus and Lineup, you are all cooperating with some interesting details to this study, as nothing is finished related researched....i am always on the run searching for better method, the more perfect sound (to my ears).
The environment...the Psychological ambience.... the company you have, your psychological moment is very important as Sheldon told us.
You are rigth also Tinitus...brain adjust everything, filling gaps and correcting Eq unballances.... introducing Bass where you have not.... we can focus and the first seconds are very important, as the ear+ input brain could not be adjusted...so....the rational part of your brain, your conscience...that thing that make you feel and perceive yourself as an biologic unit that can sense the world using sensors...that part will receive non filtered sound...so...switching A to B...you will have something not adjusted in the first moments.
I think, if you go too long you will be hardly confused.....reason why, now a days i use to make fast testings ....and i go changing music to avoid those "adjustments"
Also Lineup talking about the images we have about our previous life experiences...as he install the ambience inside a system, where you have many references to analise.
Lovely posts you have made.... very cooperative and turning this thread more rich.... in special everybody listening and respecting other friends experiences, the way must be done, as no one of us can guarantee what is absolutelly rigth.
regards,
Carlos
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