Compact Bookshelf Build - Options / Recommendations

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#43
planet10 said:
Alpair 5.2/3, FF85wk with a few tweaks, thise ¾” dome/dustcaps are very effective.

And even the much larger A10.3 is really close (not as good a dispersion, not something you really care about given your situation.

dave
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I looked at the frequency response curve for the A10.3 and don't think I would like it at all. There is a very sharp rise of 10db from 5KHz up to a peak at 9.5KHz and then a big drop off from there back down 10db at 20KHz.

Frequency response for the SBA tweeter in my Piccolos over that same range is very flat at +/- 1 db.

Full range drivers just can't compete with well-designed tweeters at the high end. They are no longer operating in pistonic mode and instead are relying on cone surface break up to create the high frequencies. Not a compromise that interests me. I know that many people are very satisfied with full range drivers, but I don't see how they can possibly deliver the exceptional high-end performance that I get now with the SBA tweeters.
 
#45
classicalfan said:
Another candidate that you might want to look at is the Continuum II. It's a closed box and is reported to do very well close to walls, since it was originally designed as a Studio Monitor. Size fits well within your requirements.

https://meniscusaudio.com/product/continuum-ii-loudspeaker-kit/
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Very interesting, so I searched China's version of eBay for the mid-woofer. It looks awfully like the Audex170G4 that Aurum Cantus used in several models including the Leisure2MkII. I listened to the Leisure2 and Leisure6 about fifteen years ago in Beijing. The inexpensive 2's short ribbon did not quite meet the mid; the 6's with long ribbon were very expensive, and indeed most excellent. I'd consider this kit if available (and 100hz is low enough).
 
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#46
I will give a strong shout out to the Continuum. They beat out many, many designs to be my desktop speakers for the last 5 years. I liked many others but the Continuums came out on top. The low crossover probably helps with the nearfield integration and the sealed bass is satisfying and never boomy regardless of placement. It can't play super loud because of bass considerations and I do like to feed it with a fair amount of watts, usually ncore 400's, but other than those caveats they're great. The midrange is magic, I'm really suprised the ac130 is not used as a dedicated mid more often. Definitely a speaker that is more than the sum of its parts and less than $400 a pair!
https://meniscusaudio.com/product/continuum-ii-loudspeaker-kit/
 
#47
The Loudspeaker Kit or Wagner (same place) may have something.
http://www.theloudspeakerkit.com/
https://www.wagneronline.com.au/

BTW, the Soprano is a nice little speaker and even though it has a rear port, I use it close to the back wall. Maybe a tad small for your needs. If you live close to Newcastle NSW, I could demo. Any of Jeff Bagby's would be a good choice and even though I design and build my own, I have tried 2 of his designs to check them out.
 
#48
Stick to a Purify design - not necessarily a TG design.That driver is miles ahead of anything mentioned here, which is basically all yesterday' s news, harsh and rude as that may sound.
Look into the Purify build thread here on Diya: with a bit of LF correction you can reach distortion free 40 Hz@ 94db/m in just 7 liters. None of the contenders here come even close. Lars Riisbo, its designer will be helpful to get you on your way.
 
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#49
classicalfan said:
I looked at the frequency response curve for the A10.3 and don't think I would like it at all. There is a very sharp rise of 10db from 5KHz up to a peak at 9.5KHz and then a big drop off from there back down 10db at 20KHz.

Frequency response for the SBA tweeter in my Piccolos over that same range is very flat at +/- 1 db.

Full range drivers just can't compete with well-designed tweeters at the high end. They are no longer operating in pistonic mode and instead are relying on cone surface break up to create the high frequencies. Not a compromise that interests me. I know that many people are very satisfied with full range drivers, but I don't see how they can possibly deliver the exceptional high-end performance that I get now with the SBA tweeters.
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In my experience English full-range drivers often have a taller peak ~5-8khz than vintage German ones, but it is a common problem. I consider my one vintage Wharfedale 8", old Lowther PM6A (rolled whizzer), and new Michael's/Hifi-Bird/Isred ("drum paper") all to be ear-bleeding on-axis. The PM6A facing upward with a makeshift 360-degree omnidirectional reflector (after Harman Kardon X 360 which used custom PM6) still sounded piercing and unrealistic. HOWEVER, this peak helps to give them a very palpable dynamic realism that is missing from more "correct" speakers. Listening off-axis (possibly the old English way??) is not a solution because >10khz then vanish killing precise imaging and air (of course vintage predates stereo). So what to do? I have two work-arounds. One is to find complementary drivers when stacked neutralize the individual driver's shortcomings, 1+1 > 2. The soundstage thus obtained is more like musicians are present life in the room, which works well for smaller ensemble music. The other trick is to apply a simple 1st-order notch filter as if the full-range driver were two drivers, one LP (inductor) and the other HP (capacitor) in parallel into the driver's +. The 1st-order XO math works very well in predicting the notch; should a sharp valley results, resistors can be parallelled to fill it. This sounds complicated but really isn't! (Q: what happens to phase?)

Note: 1st-order LP -3dB@f1=160hz*ohm/mH, HP -3dB@f2=160khz/ohm/uF, slope -6dB/octave i.e. halved, notch at their geometric mean sqrt(f1*f2). 1st-order XO is simply f1=f2.
 
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#50
Boden said:
Stick to a Purify design - not necessarily a TG design.That driver is miles ahead of anything mentioned here, which is basically all yesterday' s news, harsh and rude as that may sound.
Look into the Purify build thread here on Diya: with a bit of LF correction you can reach distortion free 40 Hz@ 94db/m in just 7 liters. None of the contenders here come even close. Lars Riisbo, its designer will be helpful to get you on your way.
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Link? Issue is just need full design specs, which might be the issue.
 
#59
As I began reading I was immediately thinking of the Continuum II also. I've only had the original version and also heard some say they like the new tweeter better than the RS28a. I've only heard it in near wall placement on stands, desktops, bureaus and bookshelves from 6 to 12 feet away with or without a subwoofer and it amazed me everywhere it landed. With regard to whether it's a big enough mid, I actually liked their low end so much I found I lowered my crossover to the sub to 60 hz from 80 hz so the sub didn't interfere at all. I love them with a sub but I don't feel it to be a requirement. If one day placement allows there is even a floor standing TL design that's been very well received and Jeff called "Continuums with bass". Parts in the basement to build my own set and a gifts for at least one other person and I will definitely build the II version to compare.
 
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