In REW, you have to choose the mode REW operates, either using Java or Asio.
On a PC anyway, as the Mac version only has CoreAudio.
Even when using my Yeti USB mic.
On a PC anyway, as the Mac version only has CoreAudio.
Even when using my Yeti USB mic.
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Yep, but the AudioBox doesn't like Java. I can play one sweep, but the second is all garbled up using the WDM drivers in JRiver. If I switch to Open Live in JRiver, and select another output in the PC, as stated by JRiver, I can play, but the recording is non-functional.
It could be a Presonus thing as they never fixed, in over 5years, the drivers that many complained about being flaky, or just didn't work. And now, after saying they were working on a fix for the last 5 years, but never came up with anything, they announced the product is now legacy and will not be supported.
Will never ever buy a Presonus product ever again. A company that has always lied about a faulty product, and now completely dropped it without offering any solution to its customers.
It works ok with a Mac, but that's because I can use it with Mac's own audio drivers. But on a PC, the AudioBox drivers are linked to the box and the interface can not work with other drivers such as Asio4all and others.
The whole thing might be resolved by getting another sound card, or a miniDSP with 8 outs, but I paid more than $500 for my Presonus brick. I'd like to see that I can use it somehow, and I don't feel good trying to sell it to someone else, as they will just have the same trouble as me.
It could be a Presonus thing as they never fixed, in over 5years, the drivers that many complained about being flaky, or just didn't work. And now, after saying they were working on a fix for the last 5 years, but never came up with anything, they announced the product is now legacy and will not be supported.
Will never ever buy a Presonus product ever again. A company that has always lied about a faulty product, and now completely dropped it without offering any solution to its customers.
It works ok with a Mac, but that's because I can use it with Mac's own audio drivers. But on a PC, the AudioBox drivers are linked to the box and the interface can not work with other drivers such as Asio4all and others.
The whole thing might be resolved by getting another sound card, or a miniDSP with 8 outs, but I paid more than $500 for my Presonus brick. I'd like to see that I can use it somehow, and I don't feel good trying to sell it to someone else, as they will just have the same trouble as me.
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Desperate for some sound, I turned off everything and opened DRCDesigner by itself. I let it do the sweeps at 96k and after playing around with the sliders a bit, I got a custom soft based convolution that sounds reasonable.
Imported that in JRiver, and I'm playing music now.
I can't even do sweeps with that setup now. I can only guess what sounds good to my ears and what doesn't.
I'll have to bring the old Mac down and redo the whole thing at some point, but I have now spent my quiet time available, and it might take another week before I get another.
Slowly....
Imported that in JRiver, and I'm playing music now.
I can't even do sweeps with that setup now. I can only guess what sounds good to my ears and what doesn't.
I'll have to bring the old Mac down and redo the whole thing at some point, but I have now spent my quiet time available, and it might take another week before I get another.
Slowly....
Regarding crashes think they caused by wrong unsupported SRC and/or more than two programs trying get exclusive hardware access (WASAPI/ASIO) at the same time. So running both REW and JRiver combination at same time ASIO may not be used in either of the programs but WASAPI set in JRiver can work at my setup.
Running WDM called java inside REW have a feeling why the impulse is so erratic is because of SRC is taking place somewhere or probably some buffer settings inside JRiver is not at default, and that could either be wrong settings in Windows sound system or somewhere down the containers inside JRiver. Could you try setting up as below checklist that target run WDM at 48kHz and ensure no SRC is taking place anywhere.
1. Make shure JRiver and REW programs are closed.
2. In windows sound system under replay devices double click "Presonus Audiobox device" and in advanced tab set format to 24bit/48kHz, and do the same for "JRiver Media Center 21 device".
3. In windows sound system under recording devices double click "Presonus Audiobox device" and in advanced tab set format to 24bit/48kHz.
4. Open JRiver and in "Options" "Audio" "Audio Device" set it to "Presonus Audiobox device [Direct sound] or mayby will work in [WASAPI] too.
5. In JRiver "DSP Studio" set the "Output Format" container as in attachment, and make shure all containers downstream that will be ticked on later is able to handle 48kHz sample rate and now close JRiver.
6. Open REW and in "Preferences" "Soundcard" tab set drivers to java, set sample rate to 48kHz, set output device to "JRiver Media Center 21", set input device to "Presonus Audiobox device", set calibration file to Audiobox 48kHz, check in "Mic/Meter" tab that calibration file is none or one that belongs to current mic and now close REW.
7. To check if above works open first JRiver so that its WDM input device is active and then open REW and make a sweep to see if IR goes clean. At my setup looping these two programs i can have a sweep once in a while that fail but then just make a new sweep and it goes clean again, a quality check to see if sweep was good is very clear if one start to first looking at "Distortion" and "Impulse" tabs, and if anything in these two plots looks weird then sweep again.
If above should work then start turning on filters inside JRiver DSP, if not try look at buffer setting inside JRiver, also at "Soundcard" tab inside REW there's a couple of buffer settings to play around with.
Running WDM called java inside REW have a feeling why the impulse is so erratic is because of SRC is taking place somewhere or probably some buffer settings inside JRiver is not at default, and that could either be wrong settings in Windows sound system or somewhere down the containers inside JRiver. Could you try setting up as below checklist that target run WDM at 48kHz and ensure no SRC is taking place anywhere.
1. Make shure JRiver and REW programs are closed.
2. In windows sound system under replay devices double click "Presonus Audiobox device" and in advanced tab set format to 24bit/48kHz, and do the same for "JRiver Media Center 21 device".
3. In windows sound system under recording devices double click "Presonus Audiobox device" and in advanced tab set format to 24bit/48kHz.
4. Open JRiver and in "Options" "Audio" "Audio Device" set it to "Presonus Audiobox device [Direct sound] or mayby will work in [WASAPI] too.
5. In JRiver "DSP Studio" set the "Output Format" container as in attachment, and make shure all containers downstream that will be ticked on later is able to handle 48kHz sample rate and now close JRiver.
6. Open REW and in "Preferences" "Soundcard" tab set drivers to java, set sample rate to 48kHz, set output device to "JRiver Media Center 21", set input device to "Presonus Audiobox device", set calibration file to Audiobox 48kHz, check in "Mic/Meter" tab that calibration file is none or one that belongs to current mic and now close REW.
7. To check if above works open first JRiver so that its WDM input device is active and then open REW and make a sweep to see if IR goes clean. At my setup looping these two programs i can have a sweep once in a while that fail but then just make a new sweep and it goes clean again, a quality check to see if sweep was good is very clear if one start to first looking at "Distortion" and "Impulse" tabs, and if anything in these two plots looks weird then sweep again.
If above should work then start turning on filters inside JRiver DSP, if not try look at buffer setting inside JRiver, also at "Soundcard" tab inside REW there's a couple of buffer settings to play around with.
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Ok, thanks for the help.
I will try your step by step.
Is there a reason why you chose 48k instead of my 96k?
I will try your step by step.
Is there a reason why you chose 48k instead of my 96k?
48kHz because REW is in java mode that is a settings limit and hope/expectation is when no SRC is taking place the route through windows controlled audio that you IR will pass clean.
If these settings will work use them for measurements only when those two programs task on audio hardware. Later when system just used to playback from within JRiver there should be no problem up to 96kHz either via setting WDM route to that or use more easy way ASIO or WASAPI exclusive hardware access.
If ASIO4ALL can help here and route the loop with 96kHz successful i don't know because never had tried it out and seen opportunities.
If these settings will work use them for measurements only when those two programs task on audio hardware. Later when system just used to playback from within JRiver there should be no problem up to 96kHz either via setting WDM route to that or use more easy way ASIO or WASAPI exclusive hardware access.
If ASIO4ALL can help here and route the loop with 96kHz successful i don't know because never had tried it out and seen opportunities.
I had a 12 min window to try your step by step.
Not good.
If I select AudioBox Line 1/2 Direct Sound, there are a lot of pops and clicks and the distortion and impulse look like below.
Using WASAPI crashed JRiver and I had to restart the hole computer to get it back
Using AudioBox Asio, I can get sound if I use Java in REW. It still pops a little but less than with Direct Sound.
If I use AudioBox Asio device, and switch to Asio in REW, when I try to select the WDM, it crashes REW every time.
Next step will be to try my little ART Dual Pre USB soundcard to see if it does the same.
If it works better, I will know it's the crappy implementation in the Presonus box.
Not good.
If I select AudioBox Line 1/2 Direct Sound, there are a lot of pops and clicks and the distortion and impulse look like below.
Using WASAPI crashed JRiver and I had to restart the hole computer to get it back
Using AudioBox Asio, I can get sound if I use Java in REW. It still pops a little but less than with Direct Sound.
If I use AudioBox Asio device, and switch to Asio in REW, when I try to select the WDM, it crashes REW every time.
Next step will be to try my little ART Dual Pre USB soundcard to see if it does the same.
If it works better, I will know it's the crappy implementation in the Presonus box.
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Thanks feedback, sounds as good troubleshoot idea try ART device first.
Regarding Presonus in its a 8 I/O full duplex device it will probably need some good stable connection and bandwidth via USB buss, could it be worth try exchange the USB cable to another one.
As USB cable for audio device, should you ever come by a USB cable made with solid cores by "Audioquest" from their two cheapest series either the black or green colored ones think they worth a listening.
Regarding Presonus in its a 8 I/O full duplex device it will probably need some good stable connection and bandwidth via USB buss, could it be worth try exchange the USB cable to another one.
As USB cable for audio device, should you ever come by a USB cable made with solid cores by "Audioquest" from their two cheapest series either the black or green colored ones think they worth a listening.
Úse the AudioBox and Asio driver within JRiver. Set it's (JRiver Asio driver settings) buffer to the recommended 50 ms. Do you have pops and clicks during play back? I get the occasional pop or click on startup, the Asus Asio drivers I use aren't perfect that way with JRiver.
But never during a song. Only if I switch sample-rate I can get another click.
Set JRivers WMD driver as your default Windows driver (only for measurements).
Use Java in REW, choose the default Windows device option as driver.
Make sure to start JRiver before starting REW.
Still have problems that way?
But never during a song. Only if I switch sample-rate I can get another click.
Set JRivers WMD driver as your default Windows driver (only for measurements).
Use Java in REW, choose the default Windows device option as driver.
Make sure to start JRiver before starting REW.
Still have problems that way?
Yep, I do, following your and Byrtt recommendations.
It always pops when switching sample rate, I expect it.
But I get lots of glitches during a sweep doing it that way. I could do it fine 2 months ago, but it's full of pops now. Nothing has changed in that computer since.
Anyway, I'll need some more quiet time to try and hone in on the problem.
I had to try 5 different USB cables until I found one that worked well with my soundcard. So, hopefully, that one is ok.
I looked up Audioquest here... ahem... the green and cheapest one is $100. Their diamond series USB cable is $1,000... Insane. I will pass.
It always pops when switching sample rate, I expect it.
But I get lots of glitches during a sweep doing it that way. I could do it fine 2 months ago, but it's full of pops now. Nothing has changed in that computer since.
Anyway, I'll need some more quiet time to try and hone in on the problem.
I had to try 5 different USB cables until I found one that worked well with my soundcard. So, hopefully, that one is ok.
I looked up Audioquest here... ahem... the green and cheapest one is $100. Their diamond series USB cable is $1,000... Insane. I will pass.
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I still think you should enlarge your Asio buffer in the Presonus suite, Audiobox, whatever it's called. You're having buffer problems with Asio.
So that should be about 42 ms at 48000 sample rate?
And what is your buffering in JRiver Asio Device properties set at?
And what is your buffering in JRiver Asio Device properties set at?
50ms.
if I did it right of course.. I think I did 🙂
Should be more than enough for a quad i5.
I can get lower than that using a DAW with multiple tracks...
if I did it right of course.. I think I did 🙂
Should be more than enough for a quad i5.
I can get lower than that using a DAW with multiple tracks...
I run a Xeon 1650v2 and have it set at 100 ms. If it helps my playback I don't care about the slight delay. I have the buffer on my driver set to 60 ms. JRiver had nothing in between 50 and 100. I'm interested in smooth playback. This measured cleanest for me.
Longer buffer settings in JRiver did not work, 50 ms was less clean.
That's why I ran the loop back test. The Asus ST is a PCI card. The wasapi performed without flaws but was not as easy to use together with SP/DIF and 8 channels so I cleaned up the settings till I hit a sweet spot for the Asio driver. It's still not ideal and every once in a while JRiver crashes (hangs at buffering) while switching bitrate.
Might have to try and get Wasapi to work somehow to get rid of all the faults. If it can work. I still haven't tried every combination of settings.
Longer buffer settings in JRiver did not work, 50 ms was less clean.
That's why I ran the loop back test. The Asus ST is a PCI card. The wasapi performed without flaws but was not as easy to use together with SP/DIF and 8 channels so I cleaned up the settings till I hit a sweet spot for the Asio driver. It's still not ideal and every once in a while JRiver crashes (hangs at buffering) while switching bitrate.
Might have to try and get Wasapi to work somehow to get rid of all the faults. If it can work. I still haven't tried every combination of settings.
It would be nice to see both ART and Presonus audio devices loop benchmarked just from REW with no other audio programs open and in princip it should work both with java and ASIO but in java mode to stop any Windows SRC set windows sound system to same rate as inside REW. If that simple setup show any flaws we can forget any other sound programs to do well if simple loop can't communicate clean in IR and HD plots.
There's a lot of opinions and guides to tweak Windows OS to perform better Audio stream, have you anytime done some tweaking in power management profile and in device manager ticked off power management for USB roots.
When you talk about 2 months ago it did fine, to that can i ask is we talking about the special loop running both REW and JRiver at same time or are we just talking playback from JRiver or REW benches, also JRiver have gone from version 20 to version 21 and I'm still at version 20 even i bought the version 21 at discount some time ago, when did you upgrade yours and also when did you install the two expensive VST FIR EQ third party plugins into JRiver, could it be worth uninstall those two third party plugins inside JRivers containers and see what happen.
Audioquest are not cheap but interesting sound even we talk data buss transfer here, the last one i bought was a 0,75 meter from green series at €35 from a webshop located in Netherlands. You absolutely right their diamond series is insane lets totally forget them, a shame that cable cost is $100 in Taiwan had we known in past TC9 shipment could have had one included.
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I just did a quick test and the ART interface didn't get all crazy on me. I had 4 sweeps done with Java, and I was ready to save them, then, foolishly, I switched to Asio and it crashed REW. Lost the sweeps and my quiet window time.
But I think I have some problems, whether it is cable related, PC settings or even speaker cabinet problems.
I'll start again from scratch, delete all programs, reset all settings and build it up again.
I'll also take my enclosures to the small audio room and test them there with the Mac system.
Thanks for the offer! But don't worry, I'll get this sorted out! At some point! Hopefully for Xmas! and Chinese New Year's winter vacation here!
But I think I have some problems, whether it is cable related, PC settings or even speaker cabinet problems.
I'll start again from scratch, delete all programs, reset all settings and build it up again.
I'll also take my enclosures to the small audio room and test them there with the Mac system.
Thanks for the offer! But don't worry, I'll get this sorted out! At some point! Hopefully for Xmas! and Chinese New Year's winter vacation here!
It should not be punished as foolish make a shift between java and ASIO and then crash : (
Windows would normal accept a program via ASIO take exclusive control for hardware device but not two programs can have exclusive control at same time. Have you any task that in background continually access either via ASIO or Windows sound system your audio hardware, stuff as a background service "JRiver as Media Center/Media Server" "rewire VST host" "Convolver DSP system plugin" "ASIO4ALL", and they are the real reason for the craches and erratic IR and HD that show up for Presonus in REW simple loop back mode.
If you end up a new OS install wish you have best process.
Windows would normal accept a program via ASIO take exclusive control for hardware device but not two programs can have exclusive control at same time. Have you any task that in background continually access either via ASIO or Windows sound system your audio hardware, stuff as a background service "JRiver as Media Center/Media Server" "rewire VST host" "Convolver DSP system plugin" "ASIO4ALL", and they are the real reason for the craches and erratic IR and HD that show up for Presonus in REW simple loop back mode.
If you end up a new OS install wish you have best process.
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