good luck....
I may have post this info before....but I know when we move the Apogee ribbons speakers ....from spot too spot in a room... are to a new room..an we find noise are buzzing.....the facesa should be removed.... the top an bottem bars that hold down the ribbon skin should pulled off....
Then the screws that hold down the bass skins tuning bars should be backet out.. this well let the ribbon skin shift back-pull free......then screw the tuning bars back down....... top an bottom bars can then be screwed back on....Not Tight..
I know from the weight of these panels ...when moved, can shift the ribbon skin.-.tuning springs... under the bar.. an make noise-buzzing ....or just keeps them from sound as good as thay can.....this is the frist thing to do with a noise or buzzing bass drive.....not just the Stages... any of the Apogee full ribbons.....
just one mans findings
I may have post this info before....but I know when we move the Apogee ribbons speakers ....from spot too spot in a room... are to a new room..an we find noise are buzzing.....the facesa should be removed.... the top an bottem bars that hold down the ribbon skin should pulled off....
Then the screws that hold down the bass skins tuning bars should be backet out.. this well let the ribbon skin shift back-pull free......then screw the tuning bars back down....... top an bottom bars can then be screwed back on....Not Tight..
I know from the weight of these panels ...when moved, can shift the ribbon skin.-.tuning springs... under the bar.. an make noise-buzzing ....or just keeps them from sound as good as thay can.....this is the frist thing to do with a noise or buzzing bass drive.....not just the Stages... any of the Apogee full ribbons.....
just one mans findings
Stands for Stages Samppo.
Those stands look great, can they be purchased from somewhere?
Thanks for the pic.....never seen under the magnets...
killer looking.. dead weight stands.....I have had stock Apogee Stage stands.....never like the sound......been thinking of having longer front legs made out of metal....add longer threaded rods.... on the back for kant adjustments.....
killer looking.. dead weight stands.....I have had stock Apogee Stage stands.....never like the sound......been thinking of having longer front legs made out of metal....add longer threaded rods.... on the back for kant adjustments.....
lucky !
McEnroe: You are extremely lucky that a magnet did not fall off the frame and land on your bass panel ! You never know if any of he magnets are no longer sticking to the frame well.
You should never do that again. Lay the speaker on stands (saw horses), magnet side down and start prying off the magnet frame from below.
McEnroe: You are extremely lucky that a magnet did not fall off the frame and land on your bass panel ! You never know if any of he magnets are no longer sticking to the frame well.
You should never do that again. Lay the speaker on stands (saw horses), magnet side down and start prying off the magnet frame from below.
just a heads up. If U take that magnet assembly off you have lost the bass panel tuning and it will not return by putting the magnet assembly back on. The original tuning of the bass diaphragm is quite sensitive and needs the structural properties of the magnet assembly to hold the tune. The wood frame is not sufficient.
That said, dont panic too much. No old Apogee bass ribbons still have their original tune. The speakers design wasn't quite up to the task of holding that tune over the years and many will find the panel will slap the magnets quite easily as in the case of the Stage its important to keep fundamental resonance high enough to avoid the large movements . As well they really cannot be "re tensioned" into original tune. Yes u can retenson a diaphragm that has gotten a bit loose but it in no way can fall back into original differential tuning as when new. YET despite the less than wonderful news they can still sound quite good if they arent out right damaged. BTW As good as the large tru ribbon MRT is, the Apogee bass panel is actually the tru star of the show in these designs. It is the planer magnetic that all other designers envy believe me.
That said, dont panic too much. No old Apogee bass ribbons still have their original tune. The speakers design wasn't quite up to the task of holding that tune over the years and many will find the panel will slap the magnets quite easily as in the case of the Stage its important to keep fundamental resonance high enough to avoid the large movements . As well they really cannot be "re tensioned" into original tune. Yes u can retenson a diaphragm that has gotten a bit loose but it in no way can fall back into original differential tuning as when new. YET despite the less than wonderful news they can still sound quite good if they arent out right damaged. BTW As good as the large tru ribbon MRT is, the Apogee bass panel is actually the tru star of the show in these designs. It is the planer magnetic that all other designers envy believe me.
lowmass,
It seems to me, the Stage panels could easily be jigged into a fixture that would maintain the frame integrity if removing the Stage magnet assembly. Silicone fix could be applied (and/or other repair) and the magnet assembly reinstalled with no effect on bass panel tension.
As you say though, with years of usage the mylar/aluminum has changed its integrity and original performance is no longer possible.
Dave.
It seems to me, the Stage panels could easily be jigged into a fixture that would maintain the frame integrity if removing the Stage magnet assembly. Silicone fix could be applied (and/or other repair) and the magnet assembly reinstalled with no effect on bass panel tension.
As you say though, with years of usage the mylar/aluminum has changed its integrity and original performance is no longer possible.
Dave.
Hi Davey, I hear ya on the "jig".I supose in theory that could work , however the tunning of that panel is extreemly sensative to even the slightest change in dimension and it doesnt take much to upset it. The Apps have the aluminum in tension. This is different than any other design that typically has the mylar in tension. As result the App diaphragm is less elastic than others. This is part of the reasion for their performance.That said and as you point out its not at all likley that any old Apps have their original tune anyway but they still sound very good. I have tryed retune on some old Stages. Basically I could tighten things up a bit and sort of "fix" an abused diaphram BUT over time these designs loose their perfect tensioning with uneveness and you will have tight spots and looses spots. there will often be sections of the diaphragm that are a bit stretched more than a section next to it so it wont really tension uniformly.
What I have found that helps the Stages bass panels output put.. are the changes that George Short at North Creek has made in the crossover.....much beeter bass on these older panels
But this is old news....
lowmass......I am looking a old pr of the Caliper sig....can there bass panal be re-tension.
An can you tell me what the wire mod is for the Caliper stock MT.....thanks
But this is old news....
lowmass......I am looking a old pr of the Caliper sig....can there bass panal be re-tension.
An can you tell me what the wire mod is for the Caliper stock MT.....thanks
James, interested to hear details about your panels!
tyu, All the Apps bass panels have same basic tensioning system so they can be "re tensioned" but as mentioned thats no garontee of a good outcome as it depends on how much damage the panel has and that can often be impossable to tell by looking.
Im not familiar with the "wire mod". If you can give me some details I may be able to get a fix on what that is and advise from there.
ALL dont be afraid to experament with your Apps a bit. especially with Xovers. With speakers like this even 1/2 db change in the midrange area can take them from good to great in a particulat listening environment. Rakes, traps, levels all mrt adjustments that can make usable improvments. Fall back to stock now and then to get bak to reality
.
As well the exact rolloff of the bass panel can have HUGE effect on slam attack power response. These are VERY tunable systems that are best taylored to each room indavidually and because the drivers are so well behaved over such wide freq range its easy to play with. Small changes are the key.
tyu, All the Apps bass panels have same basic tensioning system so they can be "re tensioned" but as mentioned thats no garontee of a good outcome as it depends on how much damage the panel has and that can often be impossable to tell by looking.
Im not familiar with the "wire mod". If you can give me some details I may be able to get a fix on what that is and advise from there.
ALL dont be afraid to experament with your Apps a bit. especially with Xovers. With speakers like this even 1/2 db change in the midrange area can take them from good to great in a particulat listening environment. Rakes, traps, levels all mrt adjustments that can make usable improvments. Fall back to stock now and then to get bak to reality
.As well the exact rolloff of the bass panel can have HUGE effect on slam attack power response. These are VERY tunable systems that are best taylored to each room indavidually and because the drivers are so well behaved over such wide freq range its easy to play with. Small changes are the key.
All I can find is that the Caliper sig....MT has its top feed coming from the crossover...done by foil....I have read that thay came up with a wire feed...now I know I can just run a wire where the foil was-is....but thay talket as if this made a big diff in getting better sound.....I just wonted to know if anyone new... what the Apogee mod was.
Boy your are right...any thing can change the sound of these Apogee ribbons.... changing the way the MT is monted top an bottem ....is one way to get much better sound.....
Adding a zobel to the Stage bass panels.....gives better sound over all..
thanks for your input...........
Boy your are right...any thing can change the sound of these Apogee ribbons.... changing the way the MT is monted top an bottem ....is one way to get much better sound.....
Adding a zobel to the Stage bass panels.....gives better sound over all..
thanks for your input...........
Well, if we really want to get obsessive about it, the position of the moon could change the tension on Apogee panels. We have real-world humidity, temperature, Pink Floyd, etc, etc, operating on these speakers all the time.
A jig doesn't have to be fancy. Just a simple flat surface that will maintain the panel without twisting, and a block (or two) mid-way of each side of the inner opening.
I'm fairly sure if the magnet assembly of a Stage was removed and reinstalled the bass panel tuning/tension would not be altered significantly enough to worry about.....or at all.
The concept is simple here: We're trying to facilitate a repair of some sort to the Stage woofer setup without having to incur the cost of complete woofer panel replacement.....which, by the way, doesn't exist anyway.
If there is actual damage to the woofer ribbon transducer, then that's obviously a different issue.
This is a DIY forum. I encourage users to go forth and DIY repair Stage speakers.
Cheers,
Dave.
We have real-world humidity, temperature, Pink Floyd, etc, etc, operating on these speakers all the time.A jig doesn't have to be fancy. Just a simple flat surface that will maintain the panel without twisting, and a block (or two) mid-way of each side of the inner opening.
I'm fairly sure if the magnet assembly of a Stage was removed and reinstalled the bass panel tuning/tension would not be altered significantly enough to worry about.....or at all.
The concept is simple here: We're trying to facilitate a repair of some sort to the Stage woofer setup without having to incur the cost of complete woofer panel replacement.....which, by the way, doesn't exist anyway.
If there is actual damage to the woofer ribbon transducer, then that's obviously a different issue.
This is a DIY forum. I encourage users to go forth and DIY repair Stage speakers.
Cheers,
Dave.
I agree with Davey, The frameworks of the stage are well made, removing the magnet assembly if carefully done won't effect the tuning, most problem will be breaking the glue apart that holds it in place and not pulling pieces of mdf off.
TYU I think the wire has to do with the returns on mrt's they replace the ali foil returns in the original construction , not sure if this is a valid improvement, unless the returns are shot, after all the ribbons themselves are ali foil, ali to ali makes sense, copper on ali creates oxidation faster. Just my opinion of course.
Al
TYU I think the wire has to do with the returns on mrt's they replace the ali foil returns in the original construction , not sure if this is a valid improvement, unless the returns are shot, after all the ribbons themselves are ali foil, ali to ali makes sense, copper on ali creates oxidation faster. Just my opinion of course.
Al