600 *REAL* watts amp?

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#21
Real Watts?


Well, my experience is as follows....

Years ago a very large car power amplifier of a major brand was repaired and tested where I worked. It was at the time the largest power amplifier for car stereo. We used a bank of 6 large car batterys and a 200 amp battery charger to power this beast.
It delivered almost half of its rated power into a two ohm load. We added more batterys without any difference in power. We were able to secure another amplifier (new) for test purpose and the result was the same. Additional tests were carried out on different brands with the same results.

I would have to say that the output claims were figured on paper figuring that no one would really take the time to truly test them.
After all its easier to say you have a 600 watt amplifier for example than to prove it.

So far to this day I and others have conducted tests on car systems only to find the claims were just that with nothing to back them up.

Put a gold or silver colored sticker on the outside of the amp and give yourself another 100 watts, after all its dream land right?
 
#22
sr20dem0n said:
Somehow I doubt you're not clipping the headunit. You do know that the internal amp in most headunits starts to clip around half volume right?
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It does, but with the bass turned up. The way I have it is the bass is turned down all the way (less bass content, less clipping), and im filling it in with the sub. I don't have a scope, but according to my hearing, it's not clipping.
 
#23
burnedfingers said:
Real Watts?


Well, my experience is as follows....

Years ago a very large car power amplifier of a major brand was repaired and tested where I worked. It was at the time the largest power amplifier for car stereo. We used a bank of 6 large car batterys and a 200 amp battery charger to power this beast.
It delivered almost half of its rated power into a two ohm load. We added more batterys without any difference in power. We were able to secure another amplifier (new) for test purpose and the result was the same. Additional tests were carried out on different brands with the same results.

I would have to say that the output claims were figured on paper figuring that no one would really take the time to truly test them.
After all its easier to say you have a 600 watt amplifier for example than to prove it.

So far to this day I and others have conducted tests on car systems only to find the claims were just that with nothing to back them up.

Put a gold or silver colored sticker on the outside of the amp and give yourself another 100 watts, after all its dream land right?
Click to expand...

What brands were you testing? I've benched all of my amps and they all have put out at least rated power, if not more. One of my amps is rated at 135x2 @ 12.5v and 185x2 @ 14.4v and actually benches at 220x2 @ 12.5v and 250x2@14.4v. I've seen bench tests of many many car amps in the last few years, and apart from the flea market and walmart brands, just about all of them put out at least rated power.
 
#24
hipyo said:
ok safecracker where in the world did u get real rms watts? I didnt ask for that I don't see it in any of my posts so can we just stick the topic and the contest that has no prize?
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Like I said before, what impedance do you need this power at?

Nobody can give you a recommendation until we know the answer to this question, unless it's something like a JL or PG which puts out a [relatively] constant power at multiple impedances.
 
#25
What sort of 'real' Watts do you want then ?
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That's what I am trying to figure out, lol. Now you guys make everything sooo difficult! All I was saying is that for him to find an amp that will put out 600 REAL watts not peak, rms he is NOT going to find one at any impedence for $50 or less. Now he may find a used PEAKING pyramid for that price but I think inflation has gone up even on them...😀
 
#26
ok to answer ur guys questions I would like for the amp to amp to put out 600 watts at 4 ohms i doubt that for cheap so 2 ohms would be fine if i bridge them, but if i bridge them i wont need a 600 i would only need 300 right? because the subs can only handle 300 each also can some just start finding some cheap amp and posting them?? the 600 real watts u guys should not worry about because im am sure there is no way to get 1 for my specs but if it comes up i would like for it to peak power at probly 13.4 volts thats wut my power supply pushes out. please put some amps up that are reliableif no one can find anything higher than then put ones under 300 i dont want to bridge it but if i have to then i will
 
#29
hipyo said:
ok then which brand has the cheapest but reliable and doesnt lie about there wattage? OTHER THAN EBAY!
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I'd have to say Profile, they aren't all that great, but from what I hear they do rated power (or close to) and are reliable. You can find them at www.millionbuy.com for cheap, I would stick to the CA or AP lines.

Also, I don't think you know what bridging is....at all. Your post was so hard to follow I had to read it 3 times and still don't understand what you were trying to say. What impedance are your subs (also, single or dual voice coil), that's the simplest way to get to the answer we need.
 
#30
something like a Rockford p3001 300Wrms at 2 ohms canadian full retail $299.99.
I really like RF amps personally(own 2) other decent brands to look at are
JL
JBL
Kicker
MTX
Memphis

Some ok ones
Pioneer
Kenwood
Sony

There may be others I forgot to mention.
 
#31
OK The subwoofers that I have are two 300 watt max single coil@ 4 ohms.

I have been looking around and I can't find any amps that have peak at 4 ohms......

I don't want to bridge (when you take 2 subwoofers and hook them up together then feed it in to the amp Parallel) because I can only get a 300 watt amp.

That would leave me with 150 watts per subwoofer. I have found a cheap amp I don't believe it is very good, but just look at for me please it's cheap.

http://shop4.outpost.com/product/4353105?site=sr:SEARCH:MAIN_RSLT_PG

Can You Read It Now??
 
#34
xplod1236 said:
I have 15 wrms all the way around (front ~5.5" and rear 6x9s) plus around 600 wrms for the sub, and I get enough output on the freeway, even with the windows down (not clipping the h/u). It's great to have a stock setup like that. (I'll get the dB meter out tomorrow and see how loud it goes.)
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It can do 110 dB peaks without clipping. On one song, I got it up to 112 dB, but the clipping was audible. Add in the sub, and the levels go to 120+ dB. This is loud enough for driving, even with the windows down.

I know that this is off-topic, but I said that I would post some numbers, so I did.
 
#36
Ok, you have two single 4ohm subs, there are only two ways to hook it up optimally. First is to run each sub on it's own bridged pair of channels (either a 4ch amp with each pair of channels bridged to 1 sub, or a pair of 2ch amps, each one bridged to one of the subs), second is to wire them in parallel and use a mono amp. For the first one, you would look for a 4ch amp that did somewhere around 300x2 @ 4ohm bridged, the pair of 2ch amps would be a waste so don't bother looking at that, and for the second one you would look for a mono amp that did around 600x1 @ 2ohm.


But you also mentioned that they were 300 watts peak each, what's the rms rating on them? If that truly is the peak rating and the rms rating is more like 100 watts each, then you would be looking for a 200 watt amp, not a 600 watt amp.
 
#37
AudioFreak said:


The point being that RMS watts don't exist. There are RMS volts, RMS current and AVERAGE watts.
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🙄

Yes you're right, and techincally those aren't 4ohm subs either, in fact they only have a 4ohm impedance at 2 small points in their entire impedance curve, the rest of the curve they're either slightly below or well above their 4ohm nominal rating. But it's convention, we treat them like they have a constant 4ohm resistive load because it makes the math easier when wiring, solving for power, crossovers, etc. Technically there's no such thing as RMS power either, but when you take the RMS voltage, square it, and divide it by the nominal impedance, you get a form of power, which by convention we call RMS power. It's the only way to get around all of the marketing ******** that plagues this industry with false claims and, in other words, blatant lies. Technically it's not proper terminology, but it's convention, and it's the easiest way to keep newbies in the hobbie from getting confused and distracted by all of the retarded "peak" and "max" claims that are 10x higher than reality.
 
#38
OK I am going to need for you to explain the 4 ch set-up again kinda fuzzy sounds like I have 4 subs and making them parallel....

The mono would work, BUT I would need a 300 watt mono because when you bridge you are sending out how much the amps sending out so 600 would blow my subs out.

I think I'm going with the Profile 600 watt x 2 channel. That one is 200 watts peak at 4 ohms. and its only like $75.

I don't remember the RMS of the subs sry...

I am so lost with that post above this.... 😕
 
#39
http://jbl.com/car/products/product_detail.aspx?prod=GTO301.1&cat=AMP&ser=GTS

294 wrms at 2 ohms, so you would need to wire the subs in parallel (bridge them, as you called it).

sr20dem0n, about the low (~6) damping factor, JBL does measure it differenty.

Effective Damping Factor: This replaces the old “Damping Factor” spec, which was originally used to indicate how much control an amplifier could exert over the speaker’s moving cone. It’s a hotly debated topic. If you’re used to seeing damping factor specs of 500 or even 1000, you’ll be surprised to find that nearly every amplifier available for use in cars will have a spec between 6 and 7. Why, you ask? Because amplifiers have gotten much better over the years and they all have relatively low output impedance and that’s the characteristic upon which the damping factor spec is based. Effective Damping Factor better indicates the difference in audible performance between amplifiers than the old spec. In other words, it’s really difficult to hear the difference between a damping factor of 500 and a damping factor of 1000. Now that difference will be expressed more accurately as the difference between, say, 6.39 and 6.85.
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