One of the acoustical problems identified
Thanks GM, you are challenging my thinking and narrowing down some of the clutter in my mind.
You have worked with arrays, yet if you were to build something today, you would build a three-way horn system, so no comb filtering or early reflections. Why settle for the less of two evils when you can have no evils!
I am not sure if you are refering to the use of Avebury, or my belief that moving a large area of air a little bit will create a lot of reflections. Like I say, I am finding many of the beliefs I have had are indeed flat out wrong! The system you describe is more akin to moving a large volume of air a lot in a controlled direction. Maybe not how all sounds propigate in nature, but those sounds are not confined to little rooms either! Although the human voice does propigate like what you are describing. So... The more I learn, the more I realize I do not know!
Thaks for relighting my hope as your directivity concepts are giving me some ideas about Avebury, and you did mention room damping as another route. Avebury has a directivity issue in conjunction to my room. The issue is the bass from the back of the speaker is not wrapping around the outer edges of the cabinets - it is all wrapping around the inside edges, and crossing in the middle, and interfereing with each other at the couch. There is no bass propagating along the outsides of the room. I have a gut feeling, if I was to even out the bass, I would even out the mid-range. Not sure if this is a winable battle, but certainly a worthy one. Can I somehow direct the bass to the outside edges of the room?
That is the question I will sleep on tonight.
Allen
Thanks GM, you are challenging my thinking and narrowing down some of the clutter in my mind.
You have worked with arrays, yet if you were to build something today, you would build a three-way horn system, so no comb filtering or early reflections. Why settle for the less of two evils when you can have no evils!
I am not sure if you are refering to the use of Avebury, or my belief that moving a large area of air a little bit will create a lot of reflections. Like I say, I am finding many of the beliefs I have had are indeed flat out wrong! The system you describe is more akin to moving a large volume of air a lot in a controlled direction. Maybe not how all sounds propigate in nature, but those sounds are not confined to little rooms either! Although the human voice does propigate like what you are describing. So... The more I learn, the more I realize I do not know!
Thaks for relighting my hope as your directivity concepts are giving me some ideas about Avebury, and you did mention room damping as another route. Avebury has a directivity issue in conjunction to my room. The issue is the bass from the back of the speaker is not wrapping around the outer edges of the cabinets - it is all wrapping around the inside edges, and crossing in the middle, and interfereing with each other at the couch. There is no bass propagating along the outsides of the room. I have a gut feeling, if I was to even out the bass, I would even out the mid-range. Not sure if this is a winable battle, but certainly a worthy one. Can I somehow direct the bass to the outside edges of the room?
That is the question I will sleep on tonight.
Allen
Allen,
(tongue firmly in cheek) time to bring the chainsaw out and take a few walls out? Be sad if you had to cobweb Avebury.
dave
(tongue firmly in cheek) time to bring the chainsaw out and take a few walls out? Be sad if you had to cobweb Avebury.
dave
To me it sounded like I had too much midrange and HF vs mid bass... the speaker sounded big and like it wanted to be played loud (no way like a 6.5 inch cone) - I feel it will shine in a larger space. The bass was a very tight and went quite low. What I was missing was desired mid-range warmth and energy. I listen to a lot of rock/metal - these recordings are usually thin and noisy - probably have to go 2 way...
I shall try again - I have different internal wiring and interconnects now; also a more powerful amp. Will also try your 4 strand version of the interconnect and see if I can gain anything for my prefered musical genres.
- Zia
zman01,
Maybe you should try a BSC filter to balance things out a bit. They can work wonders.
PJN
Maybe you should try a BSC filter to balance things out a bit. They can work wonders.
PJN
The quest for mid-bass warth and energy is on!
Yes, I experience that too. So the Alpair 12 studio monitor that Scott, Chris and Dave designed solves this problem? Do you get more mid-range warmth and energy? What is the trade-off? Do you lose that big sound? Becuase that Big sound is something very special about Alpair 12 that I am not willing to give up, very hard to find in a speaker of its size.
I find that Avebury likes to be played loud also, and I enjoy that, as long as I do not get any distortion...
I am really glad you shared this impressions with us, Zia, becuase:
#1 someone elses ears hear what I hear
#2 maybe we can put our heads together and solve this issue.
I have tried the EQ at a gradual slope, centered at 500 Hz, this gives the measured response we are looking for, but to the ear, it sounds "processed" and lacking in depth, maybe an EQ artifact.
Anyway, Zia, I would be interested to know what amps you have used and are using with your Alpair systems. Watt ratings at reasonable distortion levels would help also. If you have this information on another thread, feel free to link us up!
Infact, anyone willing to share their Alpair 12 systems with us would be greatly appreciated! (another thread maybe?)
Thanks a million!
Allen
Yes, I experience that too. So the Alpair 12 studio monitor that Scott, Chris and Dave designed solves this problem? Do you get more mid-range warmth and energy? What is the trade-off? Do you lose that big sound? Becuase that Big sound is something very special about Alpair 12 that I am not willing to give up, very hard to find in a speaker of its size.
I find that Avebury likes to be played loud also, and I enjoy that, as long as I do not get any distortion...
I am really glad you shared this impressions with us, Zia, becuase:
#1 someone elses ears hear what I hear
#2 maybe we can put our heads together and solve this issue.
I have tried the EQ at a gradual slope, centered at 500 Hz, this gives the measured response we are looking for, but to the ear, it sounds "processed" and lacking in depth, maybe an EQ artifact.
Anyway, Zia, I would be interested to know what amps you have used and are using with your Alpair systems. Watt ratings at reasonable distortion levels would help also. If you have this information on another thread, feel free to link us up!
Infact, anyone willing to share their Alpair 12 systems with us would be greatly appreciated! (another thread maybe?)
Thanks a million!
Allen
Not given up yet...
Yes, it is very hard to part with something I have been so passionate about... It is hard to let go, and maybe there is a reason for that, which is why I am not doing it quite yet. Maybe, just maybe, there is something we have not figured out yet.
Here are the two main flaws with Avebury in my room:
#1 Bass modes affecting mid-range balance and clarity
#2 Distortion of Low bass at louder levels
I have not talked much about the distortion of Low bass at louder levels. Quite honestly, I do not know if I am over driving the Alpair 12's or my 40 watt chip amps are not big enough. Like I say, the Alpair's have not popped, but it appears they are moving close to their max X-max. But is that all amp distortion too? It does not do this with test tones. That is why I would like to know what kind of amps people are using.
If it ends up being the case that I am overdriving this system, becuase as both Zia and I have noticed, the Alpairs are "wanting" to be played louder; then I would be better off going with a 2-way system: Alpairs doing the 200 Hz and above and a bass sytem doing the lows. A system like this would have the advantage also placing the speakers where they sound the best to me. However, I am very drawn to the astetic and positive sound attributes of Avebury, I would like to keep them if I can solve these two problems.
We will start with figuring out the case of problem #2, becuase that is a physical limitation of either the Avebury or the amp I am using.
Problem #1 is so big that I need to know if problem #2 can be fixed first .
May the force be with us!
Allen
Yes, it is very hard to part with something I have been so passionate about... It is hard to let go, and maybe there is a reason for that, which is why I am not doing it quite yet. Maybe, just maybe, there is something we have not figured out yet.
Here are the two main flaws with Avebury in my room:
#1 Bass modes affecting mid-range balance and clarity
#2 Distortion of Low bass at louder levels
I have not talked much about the distortion of Low bass at louder levels. Quite honestly, I do not know if I am over driving the Alpair 12's or my 40 watt chip amps are not big enough. Like I say, the Alpair's have not popped, but it appears they are moving close to their max X-max. But is that all amp distortion too? It does not do this with test tones. That is why I would like to know what kind of amps people are using.
If it ends up being the case that I am overdriving this system, becuase as both Zia and I have noticed, the Alpairs are "wanting" to be played louder; then I would be better off going with a 2-way system: Alpairs doing the 200 Hz and above and a bass sytem doing the lows. A system like this would have the advantage also placing the speakers where they sound the best to me. However, I am very drawn to the astetic and positive sound attributes of Avebury, I would like to keep them if I can solve these two problems.
We will start with figuring out the case of problem #2, becuase that is a physical limitation of either the Avebury or the amp I am using.
Problem #1 is so big that I need to know if problem #2 can be fixed first .
May the force be with us!
Allen
Scott designed, dave drew,Chris probably doesn't know what box we talk about.
Search for Doug Ingram, he built DBR (and an OctoKen)
dave
Soem questions answered, more to answer
Thanks Dave, I reveiwed the thread:
http://www.diyaudio.com/forums/full-range/184407-alpair-12-studio-reference-monitors-fired-up-5.html
Found this in Post #43:
So, building a smaller well-designed cabinet for Alpair 12 does not enhance the mid-range, and I can only speculate there would be a loss in scale also.
In the same thread, Dave really stresses that Alpair 12s do break in for a really long time - 300 hours plus some, then some more and yet even more!
It looks like Doug will be installing some cabinets inside some sphere grills, where as I was thinking that the actual cabinet is a sphere! I read somewhere that an egg shaped cabinet is the best cabinet for dispersion and eliminates defractions.
I have also looked into how to build bass traps and where they go in a room. I find it interesting that they go in the very corners I have the back horns of Avebury facing! What that tells me, is I am using a spot in my room to amplify bass that acoustically should be minimized! Ouch! This is one of those cases where the truth hurts! To fix this problem may be as Dave said "time to bring the chainsaw out and take a few walls out?" Keep in mind, I have the speakers in their current positions becuase I like the wider soundscape these positions provide. Now I could install bass traps and acoustic panels on the side walls, however I believe this will just eat up all the bass energy of Avebury. Seems wasteful. What I have experienced with this system it that the bass is best when it can bounce off a back wall and wrap freely around both sides of the cabinet. I am guessing better yet would be less in between the speakers and more on the outsides, room not big enough for this test. I wonder if there is a way to widen the soundscape with the cabinet positions in post #295?
I am also wondering if there is a way to cut out the center section of Avebury (if I do it right, I would salvage my disfusion blocks) and flip the whole thing around, mount the driver on the same side as the horn mouths (like the Changs) build the right triangle behind the driver to get the right volume of space behind it, wolla, front firing Avebury! Of course it might be just as easy to rebuild something as such also. Thoughts anyone?
This stuff sure keeps you on your feet doesn't it - so much to learn!
Allen
Thanks Dave, I reveiwed the thread:
http://www.diyaudio.com/forums/full-range/184407-alpair-12-studio-reference-monitors-fired-up-5.html
Found this in Post #43:
So, building a smaller well-designed cabinet for Alpair 12 does not enhance the mid-range, and I can only speculate there would be a loss in scale also.
In the same thread, Dave really stresses that Alpair 12s do break in for a really long time - 300 hours plus some, then some more and yet even more!
It looks like Doug will be installing some cabinets inside some sphere grills, where as I was thinking that the actual cabinet is a sphere! I read somewhere that an egg shaped cabinet is the best cabinet for dispersion and eliminates defractions.
I have also looked into how to build bass traps and where they go in a room. I find it interesting that they go in the very corners I have the back horns of Avebury facing! What that tells me, is I am using a spot in my room to amplify bass that acoustically should be minimized! Ouch! This is one of those cases where the truth hurts! To fix this problem may be as Dave said "time to bring the chainsaw out and take a few walls out?" Keep in mind, I have the speakers in their current positions becuase I like the wider soundscape these positions provide. Now I could install bass traps and acoustic panels on the side walls, however I believe this will just eat up all the bass energy of Avebury. Seems wasteful. What I have experienced with this system it that the bass is best when it can bounce off a back wall and wrap freely around both sides of the cabinet. I am guessing better yet would be less in between the speakers and more on the outsides, room not big enough for this test. I wonder if there is a way to widen the soundscape with the cabinet positions in post #295?
I am also wondering if there is a way to cut out the center section of Avebury (if I do it right, I would salvage my disfusion blocks) and flip the whole thing around, mount the driver on the same side as the horn mouths (like the Changs) build the right triangle behind the driver to get the right volume of space behind it, wolla, front firing Avebury! Of course it might be just as easy to rebuild something as such also. Thoughts anyone?
This stuff sure keeps you on your feet doesn't it - so much to learn!
Allen
Attachments
Allen,
In a nutshell the A12 DBR monitors don't sound as powerful as the Super Pensils, but they are no slouch - they still have plenty too offer. If I recall correctly, the Pensil's had a bit more 3D sound as well, but it's been a while, so need to try them out again. Doug Ingram was using a Dayton DTA-100 IIRC and that amp is slightly bass heavy and mid/treble is not as refined compared to more renowned (and expensive) class D amps.
I've changed interconnects recently, and the recent ones sound best to me (all 3 I tried are Cat 5 only, different brands 🙂).
In a nutshell the A12 DBR monitors don't sound as powerful as the Super Pensils, but they are no slouch - they still have plenty too offer. If I recall correctly, the Pensil's had a bit more 3D sound as well, but it's been a while, so need to try them out again. Doug Ingram was using a Dayton DTA-100 IIRC and that amp is slightly bass heavy and mid/treble is not as refined compared to more renowned (and expensive) class D amps.
I've changed interconnects recently, and the recent ones sound best to me (all 3 I tried are Cat 5 only, different brands 🙂).
Anyone used Alpair with a good mid-range amp?
<5.0% @50W
In my mind, that is 30 watts RMS/channel, but atleast they are honest about the 50 watt distortion.
This is encouraging, becuase I think it is a matter of finding the right synergy of components to get that mid-range we are all seeking thru the Alpair 12. If it is there, Alpair 12 will reveal it!
So Zia, what amps are you using?
Has anyone tried tuuuube yet? This is costly I am sure, becuase I think a good 60 watt push-pull design would be ideal, if one went this route.
Tube line stage or pre-amp...
I have even thought about going with the bridged dual chip amp for more power. That should put out a solid 60-80 clean watts/channel. I need to run some tests on the ones I've got too, make sure the heatsinks are big enough and the such.
Of course, I can not forget about the DAC, I need that any direction I go! I have some funding aside for it, but the heart has not moved me yet, I want to exhuast the options in front of me first.
I revisited some of the first music and movie clips I played thru Avebury, and it definately has "opened" up! This is encouraging, I still prefer the cabinet positions closer to the side walls, bigger more 3-dimisional presentation despite its lesser 80Hz to 200Hz bass node. I will keep tinkering away!
Allen
Straight from the Dayton DTA100 spec sheet, available from Parts Express:
Power Output:
Power Output:
50 watts RMS x 2 into 8 ohm
Total Harmonic Distortion:
<0.01% @30W
<5.0% @50W
In my mind, that is 30 watts RMS/channel, but atleast they are honest about the 50 watt distortion.
This is encouraging, becuase I think it is a matter of finding the right synergy of components to get that mid-range we are all seeking thru the Alpair 12. If it is there, Alpair 12 will reveal it!
So Zia, what amps are you using?
Has anyone tried tuuuube yet? This is costly I am sure, becuase I think a good 60 watt push-pull design would be ideal, if one went this route.
Tube line stage or pre-amp...
I have even thought about going with the bridged dual chip amp for more power. That should put out a solid 60-80 clean watts/channel. I need to run some tests on the ones I've got too, make sure the heatsinks are big enough and the such.
Of course, I can not forget about the DAC, I need that any direction I go! I have some funding aside for it, but the heart has not moved me yet, I want to exhuast the options in front of me first.
I revisited some of the first music and movie clips I played thru Avebury, and it definately has "opened" up! This is encouraging, I still prefer the cabinet positions closer to the side walls, bigger more 3-dimisional presentation despite its lesser 80Hz to 200Hz bass node. I will keep tinkering away!
Allen
Just by chance I happen upon this thread (been busy lately...), skip to the last page and find myself quoted!
I must preface that my earlier comments were based upon a total of a half hour listening and comparisons, in an average sized bedroom, and that I have not repeated the experience.
I have to say at this point that I have much more listening time in and many more hours on the all the drivers in question. The Saburos that I had really liked now sound shrill for music but great for the cinema application that they are primarily for. I moved the A12s from the DBR monitors over to the OktoKen that Dave designed, but I still prefer to call them "Deathstars".
"In the same thread, Dave really stresses that Alpair 12s do break in for a really long time - 300 hours plus some, then some more and yet even more! " I'd agree!
My initial response was that they were much tighter sounding and lacked space and bass depth compared to the DBR. Well, I've been listening to them daily for quite a few months now and I am really impressed. Maybe my ears have changed or the drivers have continued to open up even more, but the sound great now. Plenty of deep and well controlled bass, lots of midrange detail and nice treble. It really is amazing just how much big sound these small speakers put out! They don't sound remarkable at low volumes, what does? but at moderate levels they come to life, and then just a little louder and they really come alive. I get afraid to really push them loud, bu the do go plenty loud for my living room.
Yes, these will be going into a spherical shell as I am building a repro of the Clairtone Project G. I have been working on my pattern and mold for the shells and am just about ready to layup some laminates. I will post updates soon.
As for amps, these drivers are very revealing of everything upstream, recording, player, and amp. I do not claim that any of my amps are high end or even the best choice for these drivers. I simply use what I have on hand, which at the moment is an older Sony HT receiver. The Dayton is my sons's and he uses it as a desktop amp. He drives his Saburos through a Marantz HT receiver. Sorry, no model number on hand while I write...
I'd be happy to answer more questions if anyone likes.
I must preface that my earlier comments were based upon a total of a half hour listening and comparisons, in an average sized bedroom, and that I have not repeated the experience.
I have to say at this point that I have much more listening time in and many more hours on the all the drivers in question. The Saburos that I had really liked now sound shrill for music but great for the cinema application that they are primarily for. I moved the A12s from the DBR monitors over to the OktoKen that Dave designed, but I still prefer to call them "Deathstars".
"In the same thread, Dave really stresses that Alpair 12s do break in for a really long time - 300 hours plus some, then some more and yet even more! " I'd agree!
My initial response was that they were much tighter sounding and lacked space and bass depth compared to the DBR. Well, I've been listening to them daily for quite a few months now and I am really impressed. Maybe my ears have changed or the drivers have continued to open up even more, but the sound great now. Plenty of deep and well controlled bass, lots of midrange detail and nice treble. It really is amazing just how much big sound these small speakers put out! They don't sound remarkable at low volumes, what does? but at moderate levels they come to life, and then just a little louder and they really come alive. I get afraid to really push them loud, bu the do go plenty loud for my living room.
Yes, these will be going into a spherical shell as I am building a repro of the Clairtone Project G. I have been working on my pattern and mold for the shells and am just about ready to layup some laminates. I will post updates soon.
As for amps, these drivers are very revealing of everything upstream, recording, player, and amp. I do not claim that any of my amps are high end or even the best choice for these drivers. I simply use what I have on hand, which at the moment is an older Sony HT receiver. The Dayton is my sons's and he uses it as a desktop amp. He drives his Saburos through a Marantz HT receiver. Sorry, no model number on hand while I write...
I'd be happy to answer more questions if anyone likes.
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Wow - 24 guage copper sounds diferent?
What brands and what do you like about the recent one? What does it "sound" like? I am using CAT5E Coleman cable from a local hardware store. I will need to look up what kind of insulation it has.
Allen
What brands and what do you like about the recent one? What does it "sound" like? I am using CAT5E Coleman cable from a local hardware store. I will need to look up what kind of insulation it has.
Allen
An honor, Douglas
Thank You, Douglas, I am really glad you found this thread!
I have to agree with you in all respects. Alpair 12 does not like low levels at all! They do loud great - and as I have posted above, I believe my amps fun out of juice before the speakers bottom out. I will let everyone know when I figure this out.
What size is your listening rooms for both Aplair monitors and your Saburos?
I really look forward to seeing your rendition of the Clairtone Project G. It is good to see the work of someone who is a passionate about building fine things. Those guitars are impressive!
Allen
Thank You, Douglas, I am really glad you found this thread!
I have to agree with you in all respects. Alpair 12 does not like low levels at all! They do loud great - and as I have posted above, I believe my amps fun out of juice before the speakers bottom out. I will let everyone know when I figure this out.
What size is your listening rooms for both Aplair monitors and your Saburos?
I really look forward to seeing your rendition of the Clairtone Project G. It is good to see the work of someone who is a passionate about building fine things. Those guitars are impressive!
Allen
Thanks, Allen. Nice to report to someone who actually knows what a G is!
I'll get that other info to you when its not bedtime.
I'll get that other info to you when its not bedtime.
I'm not using the Alpair 12s in the DBR monitors anymore, they are in the Octoken "Deathstars". My DBR monitors sit empty and forlorn in a storage room in the basement.
The rooms are odd shapes and sizes. I hope that the descriptions are adequate.
The Alpairs are in a main floor livingroom which is a kind of semi-open floor plan. The audio/video stuff is against a freestanding masonry fireplace which is about 9' wide and faces into a space that is about 15' x 15'. On one side is the entrance area, which is about 7' wide and about 10' long. On the other side is a kind of alcove about the same size. The whole space is kind of zig-zag shaped with the entrance side being in line with the fireplace and the alcove is in line with the opposing wall.
The Saburos are in a basement recroom where my son has set up a cinema. The screen is 6' tall x 10' wide. There are actually three Saburos now, the original two flank the screen, and a he subsequently built a third as a center channel, and it sits horizontally below the screen. It sits on a stand which angles is slightly up to the listener/ viewer. For the rear channels there are some CHR-70 driven pensil style cabinets. I forget exactly which model, sorry. He recently added a sub woofer and acoustic baffles to the set up. The room is about 16' x 19', with the screen across the short side. One of the long sides has an opening about 12' long which open up a "L" leg of the room. Watching movies on this cinema really reduces the motivation to go out to the movies, playing blurays here has better picture and sound quality than most cinemas.
Bring on the THX!
I have always loved console audio designs. Audio is furniture! I only have had the honor to see pictures of Project G and wondered how good something so cool looking sounds. The fact the your version is using Alpair 12s, makes me think the you could very well out due the original. I hope you keep your thread going...
Wow, I would say! I wish my dad would have let me build something like that in his basement! I got the usual, "Allen, turn that $#%& down!" Of course I was playing it loud and at 11 PM, my parents put up with more then most when it come to audio! Kept me out of trouble though!
So the "Deathstars" are indeed Spherecal shaped Octokens! I can not wait to see pictures of this build! Did you notice if that shape helped with dispersion and cabinet defractions? Might be hard to disern as it sounds like your alpairs are ever evolving like mine.
Thanks for the room dimisions. That room would work great for Avebury! Do the "Deathstars" fill it up quite well? How big is your sweet spot? Do you feel the need to add say a "Sunstar" subwoofer? I will warn you, I do ask alot of questions at times! It seems that you do have some power to drive these on hand.
May the force be with you!
Allen
Does your living room look like this?
I have always loved console audio designs. Audio is furniture! I only have had the honor to see pictures of Project G and wondered how good something so cool looking sounds. The fact the your version is using Alpair 12s, makes me think the you could very well out due the original. I hope you keep your thread going...
Wow, I would say! I wish my dad would have let me build something like that in his basement! I got the usual, "Allen, turn that $#%& down!" Of course I was playing it loud and at 11 PM, my parents put up with more then most when it come to audio! Kept me out of trouble though!
So the "Deathstars" are indeed Spherecal shaped Octokens! I can not wait to see pictures of this build! Did you notice if that shape helped with dispersion and cabinet defractions? Might be hard to disern as it sounds like your alpairs are ever evolving like mine.
Thanks for the room dimisions. That room would work great for Avebury! Do the "Deathstars" fill it up quite well? How big is your sweet spot? Do you feel the need to add say a "Sunstar" subwoofer? I will warn you, I do ask alot of questions at times! It seems that you do have some power to drive these on hand.
May the force be with you!
Allen
Does your living room look like this?
Attachments
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The drawing is pretty close, just flip the whole thing left to right. Both the entrance and the alcove open to rooms back of the line for the fireplace, but that detail really only effects me an my family. The audio/video stuff is against the back of the fireplace, which opens up to the dining room on the other side.
As for my son's HT set up, he is 21, finishing university, and lets us watch films. I have had to reel him in from making the whole room a dedicated HT room!!! When I was young I was always being told to "Turn it down!" by my parents. Now I'm being told to "Turn it down!" by my kids! Can't win.
The Deathstars are not actually spherical, but they approximate it. I could easily have made the sides circular, and the bevel for the fonken bass slots would have brought the shape much nearer to a sphere. Did you see them? http://www.diyaudio.com/forums/full-range/193334-begginings-my-clairtone-globes-3.html
Comparisons and descriptions of dispersion and cabinet defractions are only relevant when there is a reference point. I only had one valid reference point (the DBR monitors) and that is gone. Gone for many months now. I can sit anywhere in the room and enjoy the sound, but they sound is best in the area comprising the living room itself. I feel that the sweet spot is fairly large. The speakers are about 6-7' apart, they are sitting atop some older speakers that aren't much good for anything else than that now.
Maybe one day I will make some Aveburys, but for now my plate is full!
I hope that this helps.
As for my son's HT set up, he is 21, finishing university, and lets us watch films. I have had to reel him in from making the whole room a dedicated HT room!!! When I was young I was always being told to "Turn it down!" by my parents. Now I'm being told to "Turn it down!" by my kids! Can't win.
The Deathstars are not actually spherical, but they approximate it. I could easily have made the sides circular, and the bevel for the fonken bass slots would have brought the shape much nearer to a sphere. Did you see them? http://www.diyaudio.com/forums/full-range/193334-begginings-my-clairtone-globes-3.html
Comparisons and descriptions of dispersion and cabinet defractions are only relevant when there is a reference point. I only had one valid reference point (the DBR monitors) and that is gone. Gone for many months now. I can sit anywhere in the room and enjoy the sound, but they sound is best in the area comprising the living room itself. I feel that the sweet spot is fairly large. The speakers are about 6-7' apart, they are sitting atop some older speakers that aren't much good for anything else than that now.
Maybe one day I will make some Aveburys, but for now my plate is full!
I hope that this helps.
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A quick hello!
Thanks for the link, Doiglas, I really enjoyed it! "octo" = eight, I get it now! It is great to see a fellow workworking artist in action! Thank for all your listening impressions, as they are helping me and hopefully others to move our projects forward. I am short on time at the moment but will post the latest happenings with Avebury when I get a chance.
Thanks for the link, Doiglas, I really enjoyed it! "octo" = eight, I get it now! It is great to see a fellow workworking artist in action! Thank for all your listening impressions, as they are helping me and hopefully others to move our projects forward. I am short on time at the moment but will post the latest happenings with Avebury when I get a chance.
Attachments
Allen,
Douglas's wood work is very nice indeed, and I decided to go build the A12 Studio Ref Monitors after taking feedback on listening impressions from him and forum member Wushuliu.
However, currently it looks like I am the only one using these boxes! 🙂
Pushed my ones close against the back wall... getting nice balanced sound. If I get too happy with this setting, might get to lazy to put them back in the Super Pensils. Maybe time to build a "Octoken" 😀 - just kidding, might be easy for Douglas, not for me.
I have used the A12 with tubes and Class D. The tube amps I have are a bit underpowered for the A12 (play loud enough for me though), and hopefully will be able to put together a Tubelab pp within the next 2 weeks - that will give me a nice reference point. My Hifimediy T4 sounds decent too, and can't wait to try out a Hypex.
-Zia
Douglas's wood work is very nice indeed, and I decided to go build the A12 Studio Ref Monitors after taking feedback on listening impressions from him and forum member Wushuliu.
However, currently it looks like I am the only one using these boxes! 🙂
Pushed my ones close against the back wall... getting nice balanced sound. If I get too happy with this setting, might get to lazy to put them back in the Super Pensils. Maybe time to build a "Octoken" 😀 - just kidding, might be easy for Douglas, not for me.
I have used the A12 with tubes and Class D. The tube amps I have are a bit underpowered for the A12 (play loud enough for me though), and hopefully will be able to put together a Tubelab pp within the next 2 weeks - that will give me a nice reference point. My Hifimediy T4 sounds decent too, and can't wait to try out a Hypex.
-Zia
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You're welcome. I don't know how truly helpful my comments are as my observations don't have many actual reference points.
I will add that I now agree with you on your observations about how too much bass overwhelms midrange. I don't feel that I am lacking midrange now...but I have nothing to compare to! I still have strong bass so I'm happy with that. I am sure that these drivers have continued to open up since I started running them last year, and even since I put them into these cabinets .
One of these days I'm going to have to bring the Deathstars downstairs and do an A/B comparison with the Saburos again. Maybe when the university term is over and my son can breath again.
The drawing is close enough.
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