A very economical SWEET sounding setup is GM's CSS FR/WR BiPole MLTL. The bass and overall sound that comes out of that little job is phenomenal. My friend and I built a pair for less than $300 including drivers and materials. Only caveat is that they can't be driven to achieve super high SPLs. I'd say QUITE adequate for what normal people would consider loud and "normal listening levels" work fine and dandy.
I know that's a over $100 for drivers (somewhere around $250 I think?) but they're well worth the additional cost and can be built out of 1 sheet of *insert favorite wood*. Plus, once you can afford more speakers you can relegate those to a bedroom set or even rear surrounds.
I know that's a over $100 for drivers (somewhere around $250 I think?) but they're well worth the additional cost and can be built out of 1 sheet of *insert favorite wood*. Plus, once you can afford more speakers you can relegate those to a bedroom set or even rear surrounds.
Greets!
The majority of women from teeny-boppers to middle age I've done comparisons with preferred a 'Maggie' like presentation, i.e. smooth as a baby's bottom with high resolution and an F3 around 100 - 16 kHz, so unless she's shown a preference for boosted and/or 'sub' bass or extended highs, then I wouldn't bother. Remember, women are geared to a child's distress, so make sure it does at least the phone's BW (~250 - 3 kHz) very life-like, with no shrillness/'glare' higher up.
GM
The majority of women from teeny-boppers to middle age I've done comparisons with preferred a 'Maggie' like presentation, i.e. smooth as a baby's bottom with high resolution and an F3 around 100 - 16 kHz, so unless she's shown a preference for boosted and/or 'sub' bass or extended highs, then I wouldn't bother. Remember, women are geared to a child's distress, so make sure it does at least the phone's BW (~250 - 3 kHz) very life-like, with no shrillness/'glare' higher up.
GM
CSS FR Bipoles and BiB's
Hi, I've also built GM's CSS BiPoles, and very much agree w Alethos's comments. Iv'e also found that the CSS FR125's can be difficult drivers to control, tho. At one point I had them in an monopole aperiodic set-up (hardly optimized, as in "let's stick some resistance here and see what happens...") and the imaging, midrange clarity and the ability to capture the early transients that seem to be on of the keys to acoustic instruments sounding "acoustic", were startling and transporting. Short story -- I keep finding myself drawn back to messing around with these drivers. I just built a set using Planet10's small aperiodic plans as a starting point, and I hope to get pics and impressions of those posted soon to another thread. Dave, I can send plans of my variations for the library if you're interested.
SO, not meaning to get off on too much of a diversion, for all the reasons we might imagine, I've also been very intrigued by the idea of building a set of BiBs for FR125's. Seriously strapped for time at the moment, so want to get some idea of how others may have liked the FR125's in BiB's before I commit time to this proj as opposed to stuff on the "Honey-do" list.... I seem to recall that Lousymusician(??) built a set of FR125 BiB's, but I couldn't find any comments regarding his impressions of how they worked out, and have not been able to contact him directly.
Lousymusician -- you out there? How'd you like 'em?? Anyone else out there built FR125 BiB's? Thanks, John
Alethos said:
Hi, I've also built GM's CSS BiPoles, and very much agree w Alethos's comments. Iv'e also found that the CSS FR125's can be difficult drivers to control, tho. At one point I had them in an monopole aperiodic set-up (hardly optimized, as in "let's stick some resistance here and see what happens...") and the imaging, midrange clarity and the ability to capture the early transients that seem to be on of the keys to acoustic instruments sounding "acoustic", were startling and transporting. Short story -- I keep finding myself drawn back to messing around with these drivers. I just built a set using Planet10's small aperiodic plans as a starting point, and I hope to get pics and impressions of those posted soon to another thread. Dave, I can send plans of my variations for the library if you're interested.
SO, not meaning to get off on too much of a diversion, for all the reasons we might imagine, I've also been very intrigued by the idea of building a set of BiBs for FR125's. Seriously strapped for time at the moment, so want to get some idea of how others may have liked the FR125's in BiB's before I commit time to this proj as opposed to stuff on the "Honey-do" list.... I seem to recall that Lousymusician(??) built a set of FR125 BiB's, but I couldn't find any comments regarding his impressions of how they worked out, and have not been able to contact him directly.
Lousymusician -- you out there? How'd you like 'em?? Anyone else out there built FR125 BiB's? Thanks, John
Re: CSS FR Bipoles and BiB's
Just to keep things straight -- did you guys build bipoles based on the numbers GM posted for a mono-pole ML-TL or did you build Jim Griffin's bipole? (where he took GMs monopole and without changing anything else added a rear driver)
That both work is a testament to how tolerant an ML-TL can be -- another example: i built a monopole FE127e ML-TL into a bipole box with good results.
yes please.
dave
Digeridoo said:
Just to keep things straight -- did you guys build bipoles based on the numbers GM posted for a mono-pole ML-TL or did you build Jim Griffin's bipole? (where he took GMs monopole and without changing anything else added a rear driver)
That both work is a testament to how tolerant an ML-TL can be -- another example: i built a monopole FE127e ML-TL into a bipole box with good results.
yes please.
dave
Hi Kristleifur,
depending on shipping costs the SPH60-X should be inside your budget range - and splendid value for its price.
As a starting point to smooth the midrange, try 2.0mH 8.2yF and 2x 22 ohms - be prepared to play with the resistor values though. Do this in your friend's presence and let her be the judge. Giving her the midrange she likes will make you 6" taller in her eyes - giving her a CD of Scottish bagpipes might result in murder. See GM's posting for an explanation.
Pit
depending on shipping costs the SPH60-X should be inside your budget range - and splendid value for its price.
As a starting point to smooth the midrange, try 2.0mH 8.2yF and 2x 22 ohms - be prepared to play with the resistor values though. Do this in your friend's presence and let her be the judge. Giving her the midrange she likes will make you 6" taller in her eyes - giving her a CD of Scottish bagpipes might result in murder. See GM's posting for an explanation.
Pit
Re: Re: Re: CSS FR Bipoles and BiB's
No need to be sorry... it is just a point of potential confusion... i know when i was talking with both GM and Jim Griffin to get things straight that Jim was confused on the issue and originally thot he was using GM's specs.
As it turned out, it ended up being serendipitous because his ML-TL worked just fine, and helped show the latitude and tolerance endemic of an ML-TL.
dave
Alethos said:
No need to be sorry... it is just a point of potential confusion... i know when i was talking with both GM and Jim Griffin to get things straight that Jim was confused on the issue and originally thot he was using GM's specs.
As it turned out, it ended up being serendipitous because his ML-TL worked just fine, and helped show the latitude and tolerance endemic of an ML-TL.
dave
Re: CSS FR Bipoles and BiB's
Present and accounted for!
My FR125 BIB's are alive and well, though now doing 3rd system bedroom duty driven by a Yamaha receiver. I wouldn't call them fully optimized (for starters, they are built of plain soft knotty pine boards, hardly the deadest material!), but I have a couple of other speaker projects going too (trying for higher efficiency, heading to SE tubes), so I haven't gone back to tweak them much. As they stand, they have some cork lining the lower front of the inner baffle and the bottom, and Dacron batting in the point, bottom and on the back at the mouth.
If a 4" driver can deliver a bass-heavy sound, it's the FR125 in a BIB! The 14 x 11 den they were intended for has a significant 40 Hz room resonance, and the BIBs took full advantage of it. Fun, but over the top. Even in bigger rooms they have no problem making 40 Hz. That works to my advantage in the master bedroom - they usually get used at low volume, so the full bottom end is kind of like an acoustic Loudness button.
Otherwise, if you like the basic FR125 sound, and crave BASS, the BIB is a lot of fun. They make a big sound that belies the size of the driver and the footprint of the speaker. And they're easy enough to build, so why not knock a pair together and see for yourself?
Bill
Digeridoo said:
Present and accounted for!
My FR125 BIB's are alive and well, though now doing 3rd system bedroom duty driven by a Yamaha receiver. I wouldn't call them fully optimized (for starters, they are built of plain soft knotty pine boards, hardly the deadest material!), but I have a couple of other speaker projects going too (trying for higher efficiency, heading to SE tubes), so I haven't gone back to tweak them much. As they stand, they have some cork lining the lower front of the inner baffle and the bottom, and Dacron batting in the point, bottom and on the back at the mouth.
If a 4" driver can deliver a bass-heavy sound, it's the FR125 in a BIB! The 14 x 11 den they were intended for has a significant 40 Hz room resonance, and the BIBs took full advantage of it. Fun, but over the top. Even in bigger rooms they have no problem making 40 Hz. That works to my advantage in the master bedroom - they usually get used at low volume, so the full bottom end is kind of like an acoustic Loudness button.
Otherwise, if you like the basic FR125 sound, and crave BASS, the BIB is a lot of fun. They make a big sound that belies the size of the driver and the footprint of the speaker. And they're easy enough to build, so why not knock a pair together and see for yourself?
Bill
CSS125 and BiBs, MLTL's .....
Hi, All -- thanks for the info and thoughtful responses, (and mea culpa on not having done my research properly, esp since I often critique my students for that! )
Lousymusician -- thanks for the encouragement.
Ditto mis-attribution on the ML-TL -- I actually built the Planet10 bipole variation of Tim Formans ML-TL. I too had originally started off with GM's basic design in my original noodlings, now that I think of it. A new kid and a new business (whose bright idea was that?) -- am I not distracted? Beg me to stay away from important calculations.
Dave at Planet10 -- I'll see what I can do to get pics and plans of the small aperiodic boxes this weekend,
Cheers and thanks again,
John
(BTW, Weren't there 23 "Johns" from Planet10??)
Hi, All -- thanks for the info and thoughtful responses, (and mea culpa on not having done my research properly, esp since I often critique my students for that!
)Lousymusician -- thanks for the encouragement.
Ditto mis-attribution on the ML-TL -- I actually built the Planet10 bipole variation of Tim Formans ML-TL. I too had originally started off with GM's basic design in my original noodlings, now that I think of it. A new kid and a new business (whose bright idea was that?) -- am I not distracted? Beg me to stay away from important calculations.
Dave at Planet10 -- I'll see what I can do to get pics and plans of the small aperiodic boxes this weekend,
Cheers and thanks again,
John
(BTW, Weren't there 23 "Johns" from Planet10??)
Re: CSS125 and BiBs, MLTL's .....
That would be an appropriate number since the number 23 is so special (the law of 5s says so -- note 2+3=5). I never actually counted (i will next time i watch the movie), but certainly all the white Lectroids were John somethingorother.
dave
Digeridoo said:
That would be an appropriate number since the number 23 is so special (the law of 5s says so -- note 2+3=5). I never actually counted (i will next time i watch the movie), but certainly all the white Lectroids were John somethingorother.
dave
Hi!
Take a listen to Kings of Leon's album, 'Because Of the times'
Excellent music and a really good recording. Drums have a good smack, small details occurs the more one listen and good separation between instruments.
Wish I had the vocabular talent to describe it more accurate!
Well worth to lend an ear or t(w)o!
Take a listen to Kings of Leon's album, 'Because Of the times'
Excellent music and a really good recording. Drums have a good smack, small details occurs the more one listen and good separation between instruments.
Wish I had the vocabular talent to describe it more accurate!
Well worth to lend an ear or t(w)o!
.. and John YaYa...
amongst a circle of friends we have many "Johns" so we were all assigned "John" Lectroid names ; I was - and still am -- John Yaya amongst that group of friends.... and lest we forget, that's John BigBooTAY, not BigBootie!
FYI, for those wondering "what the heck?", in the cult film "Buckaroo Bonzai", Lectroids are the nefarious space aliens from Planet10 who invaded earth, all assuming the name "John" so they would of course blend in.
Always glad to help with the useful information.
John Yaya
amongst a circle of friends we have many "Johns" so we were all assigned "John" Lectroid names ; I was - and still am -- John Yaya amongst that group of friends.... and lest we forget, that's John BigBooTAY, not BigBootie!
FYI, for those wondering "what the heck?", in the cult film "Buckaroo Bonzai", Lectroids are the nefarious space aliens from Planet10 who invaded earth, all assuming the name "John" so they would of course blend in.
Always glad to help with the useful information.
John Yaya
resident said:Is it called the "Buckaroo Banzai across the 8th dimension"?
I find it to download it from Demonoid! I've never seen this film! Or I don't remember it!
And I always wonder why "planet 10"?!
If you had seen it you would remember.
If they tried to assemble the cast of that movie today they would likely be on the order of a quarter-billion dollars before even getting out the gate.
dave