For a bit (or actually a lot) of line theory there's a new thread in town:
Infinite Line Source: analysis
I'm pretty sure it will be an interesting read for all of us interested in line array behaviour. Regular readers might have seen me mention the OP of that thread before (sourced from a different forum): Post #1992
This gentleman was the largest inspiration for me to start with my ambient project. I expect it will be an interesting and enlightening lecture..
(it already has been interesting so far...)
Infinite Line Source: analysis
I'm pretty sure it will be an interesting read for all of us interested in line array behaviour. Regular readers might have seen me mention the OP of that thread before (sourced from a different forum): Post #1992
This gentleman was the largest inspiration for me to start with my ambient project. I expect it will be an interesting and enlightening lecture..
(it already has been interesting so far...)
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Why did it take me so long to try this...
Inspired by recent threads I tried using my Haas kicker a little earlier. I set it to arrive about ~9 ms after the main peak. I never expected this much clarity, to be honest.
It sounds pretty good, pretty awesome actually. I play song after song and get drawn in... it's a full and close up experience but it makes me "believe".
The combination just seems to work. It combines some previous experiences for me.
I might be on this trip for quite a while...
Inspired by recent threads I tried using my Haas kicker a little earlier. I set it to arrive about ~9 ms after the main peak. I never expected this much clarity, to be honest.
It sounds pretty good, pretty awesome actually. I play song after song and get drawn in... it's a full and close up experience but it makes me "believe".
The combination just seems to work. It combines some previous experiences for me.
I might be on this trip for quite a while...
Just put my son on the spot and asked him to listen with eyes closed. I asked him: where does the sound come from.. he pointed straight ahead and said --> there!
I asked him, is that all you hear? He opened his eyes and went searching for the hidden ambient speakers (as he knows they are there)...
I said, no no no, don't look for the speakers, listen where the sound comes from.
He looked at me with a big smile and said, it comes from everywhere...
there, there and there... (pointing all around him)
That was my experience as well... engulfing, exiting and definitely entertaining.
My usual "girl and guitar" track (well not exactly, Steven Stills - Treetop Flyer) still works, but lot's of other songs now have (even) more space and a holographic clear sound to them. I can't say if it's better than I'm used to, it is different though... more up close and personal...
I asked him, is that all you hear? He opened his eyes and went searching for the hidden ambient speakers (as he knows they are there)...
I said, no no no, don't look for the speakers, listen where the sound comes from.
He looked at me with a big smile and said, it comes from everywhere...
there, there and there... (pointing all around him)
That was my experience as well... engulfing, exiting and definitely entertaining.
My usual "girl and guitar" track (well not exactly
, Steven Stills - Treetop Flyer) still works, but lot's of other songs now have (even) more space and a holographic clear sound to them. I can't say if it's better than I'm used to, it is different though... more up close and personal...
No, I'm using my regular ambient speakers, just timed differently.
These ambient speakers are behind the listening position aimed wide to the sides and reflect off of things to the side. It arrives at the listening position from lateral angles.
They are behind pillows.
My family took over the listening session in the late afternoon with both my son and girlfriend each taking turns, picking out songs to play. While they had the time of their lives I noticed some draw backs of this newly timed Haas kicker. It sounds great at the listening couch, but moving around and about the living room it's a bit too distracting for me. (I can't turn off listening for room queues, it's become a habit for me)
These ambient speakers are behind the listening position aimed wide to the sides and reflect off of things to the side. It arrives at the listening position from lateral angles.
They are behind pillows.
My family took over the listening session in the late afternoon with both my son and girlfriend each taking turns, picking out songs to play. While they had the time of their lives I noticed some draw backs of this newly timed Haas kicker. It sounds great at the listening couch, but moving around and about the living room it's a bit too distracting for me. (I can't turn off listening for room queues, it's become a habit for me)
Hi Don, when thinking about what to do for a stereo system I seriously considered going Omni, as well as OB. We all know what I ended up with, no regrets though, but its always interesting to read up on other ways and experiences to get to that audio nirvana.
I changed back to a longer delay between the main peak and the ambience again. This is the presentation that just works better for me.
However this experiment did allow me to re-adjust bits and pieces of the ambient curves. So I actually gained something by doing it.
Still wondering how I could "sell" a center channel after I had to make a promise not to add any more speakers in the room.
I could fix something temporary for experiments, but what if it works!
I do believe an Omni or OB has advantages for the phantom center perception. The spread out (even timbre) reflections do fill in the stereo cross talk holes that the stereo concept has by design. The absence of reflections does highlight that cross talk problem. While my mid/side EQ works, together with the added ambience, I've heard so many different variations up till today that I'm sure if I can combine all the best parts of all that I heard into one working correction it could be mind blowing good!
If I never get there, it's not because I didn't try.
I changed back to a longer delay between the main peak and the ambience again. This is the presentation that just works better for me.
However this experiment did allow me to re-adjust bits and pieces of the ambient curves. So I actually gained something by doing it.
Still wondering how I could "sell" a center channel after I had to make a promise not to add any more speakers in the room
.I could fix something temporary for experiments, but what if it works!
I do believe an Omni or OB has advantages for the phantom center perception. The spread out (even timbre) reflections do fill in the stereo cross talk holes that the stereo concept has by design. The absence of reflections does highlight that cross talk problem. While my mid/side EQ works, together with the added ambience, I've heard so many different variations up till today that I'm sure if I can combine all the best parts of all that I heard into one working correction it could be mind blowing good!
If I never get there, it's not because I didn't try
.
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Ronald, sorry to ask - this may have been covered somewhere in the previous 400 pages, but do you have photos or sketches of room and placement of your towers?
I've mentioned in various threads and private messages that larger OBs, dipole panels and dominating line array towers are not likely to pass my DAF test -which, as I hope to have at least another couple of decades of connubial bliss is far more important to me than the moving target of ultimate audio " nirvana", so this is really just a question of curiosity.
I've mentioned in various threads and private messages that larger OBs, dipole panels and dominating line array towers are not likely to pass my DAF test -which, as I hope to have at least another couple of decades of connubial bliss is far more important to me than the moving target of ultimate audio " nirvana", so this is really just a question of curiosity.
I always wanted to draw a plan view but never got around to it. This room overview should show most of it though:
Front wall to back wall distance is 4.3 m.
Behind both curtains are damping panels to absorb early reflections. As well as the poster seen on the left behind the couch. This is one half of the living room, behind the camera position there's an equally sized space.
For me, the beauty of this concept is the small floor space needed for some pretty powerful and captivating sound. All tucked away against the wall leaving maximum floor space available for actual 'living' purposes.
The enclosures themselves fit on an A4 size paper. The feet are slightly larger to keep it stable. Maybe my girl is a special breed though, to allow me to have such huge towers in our living room.
Most people that walk in here for a first time, don't even seem to notice them at first glance, however hard that is to believe. While standing in the room they suddenly glance at those monsters and look up and down in wonder. It remains cute to see that reaction
.This post contains a view from the couch, as BYRTT and xrk971 were visiting.
Looking the other way would look like this:
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I fully agree on that TV, I wanted a bigger one to start with (when we bought it many moons ago). Now she is saying, maybe this TV should go to the bedroom (no TV there yet) and we could get a bigger one downstairs.
Everything I do or try, I better make sure I can get away with it first. She has been supportive in everything I do. I own 2 fun cars (another hobby) and get no grief there either. She owns our third car, the family sedan. Mine fall more in the toy category size wise...
Everything I do or try, I better make sure I can get away with it first. She has been supportive in everything I do. I own 2 fun cars (another hobby) and get no grief there either. She owns our third car, the family sedan
. Mine fall more in the toy category size wise...
Hi Wesayso,
I just recently started experimenting with 4 channels. I added 2 more channels to the side and slightly to the back. I have them playing a few db down with delay and with a LPF of 12 db/oct at 1000 Hz and HPF of 12 db/oct at 100 Hz. The rear left plays the front right signal and the rear right plays the front left signal. I just started last night. I'm not sure if I'm hearing a difference, whether I should change the delay, or raise the level. I haven't put a mic in yet to measure the exact delay and level relative to the mains.
I'm curious about your precise processing. What is the signal (L-R, polarity, filtering etc.), level, and delay? The ambient speakers are Jeff Bagby's Continuum's, so quite capable upwards of 70 Hz.
I just recently started experimenting with 4 channels. I added 2 more channels to the side and slightly to the back. I have them playing a few db down with delay and with a LPF of 12 db/oct at 1000 Hz and HPF of 12 db/oct at 100 Hz. The rear left plays the front right signal and the rear right plays the front left signal. I just started last night. I'm not sure if I'm hearing a difference, whether I should change the delay, or raise the level. I haven't put a mic in yet to measure the exact delay and level relative to the mains.
I'm curious about your precise processing. What is the signal (L-R, polarity, filtering etc.), level, and delay? The ambient speakers are Jeff Bagby's Continuum's, so quite capable upwards of 70 Hz.