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DSD Playback system, DSF Player + USB DDC + DSD Amplifier
DSD Playback system, DSF Player + USB DDC + DSD Amplifier
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Old 23rd November 2011, 09:59 PM   #21
SoNic_real_one is offline SoNic_real_one  United States
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I don't think power vacuum tubes would provide any advantage, sice you are using them as switches only. They are horrible when driven to saturation.

IMO, the DSD analog filter should be around 50kHz, slow slope... No need for 10GHz
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Old 23rd November 2011, 10:23 PM   #22
KOON3876 is offline KOON3876
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Hi Sonic, you noticed me that "Why it have to be Switch?". You are right.
I'm thinking dead_time control and I don't like dead_time control idea, it's not for the audio.

Maybe I can use good old analog circuit,
(a) logic out, volume(pulse height changed between 0V - 3.3V), DC cut C,
(b1) fixed gain 1Tr amp, diamond buffer Emitter Follower handles pulse, then + LPF.
(b2) Vacuum amp(no NFB) handles pulse, then it's output transformer is natural LPF.

By the way attached original 1kHz wav file "C:\TEMP\1KHz.wav"
and I converted to 1kHz.DSF by my program,
Then convert DSF back to WAV by KORG AudioGate. "C:\TEMP\KORG\1kHz.wav"
very little noise (below -110dB) was added, but should be OK.

and attached current source (dirty but anyway it works)
Attached Images
File Type: png 1kHz_Wav.png (29.0 KB, 406 views)
File Type: png 1kHz_Wav_DSF_KORG_WAV.png (30.1 KB, 404 views)
Attached Files
File Type: txt DSDConverter.cpp.txt (19.8 KB, 43 views)
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Old 23rd November 2011, 10:38 PM   #23
SoNic_real_one is offline SoNic_real_one  United States
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Analog power stage was my suggestion too...

But if you can switch MOS-FETs (and feed from power rails) at at least 2.8MHz, your aproach is valid.
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Old 24th November 2011, 03:17 AM   #24
KOON3876 is offline KOON3876
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Please forget Post #22. that is because of 16 bit limit. (final digit error)

I made 44.1/24bit 1kHz Wav file
converted it to DSF format by my program
converted back to 44.1/24 WAV by KORG AudioGate
and there are no noise over -140dB.

I wonder my mistake.. I checked final WAV, and there was KORG Tag. OK I'm not looking same file.
0079142c|4c 49 53 54 46 00 00 00 49 4e 46 4f 49 43 52 44 | LISTF...INFOICRD
0079143c|0c 00 00 00 32 30 31 31 2d 31 31 2d 32 33 00 00 | ....2011-11-23..
0079144c|49 53 46 54 26 00 00 00 4b 4f 52 47 20 41 75 64 | ISFT&...KORG Aud
0079145c|69 6f 47 61 74 65 20 76 65 72 2e 32 2e 32 2e 31 | ioGate ver.2.2.1
0079146c|20 28 57 69 6e 64 6f 77 73 20 37 29 00 00 | (Windows 7)..

now I have nice quality PCM to DSD converter, I can add this function to my another programs.
(VST for crossover, ASIO driver, etc)
Attached Images
File Type: png WAV-1kHz.png (66.4 KB, 403 views)
File Type: png WAV-DSF-KORG-WAV.png (65.5 KB, 394 views)
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Old 24th November 2011, 02:50 PM   #25
SoNic_real_one is offline SoNic_real_one  United States
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That's more like it! Try a wav file that is higher in frequency, since DSD it has less capability there. A 22kHz audio sampled with 48 or 96 would be sufficient.

PS: 144 dB is the theoretical limit of PCM 24 bit resolution. No audio DAC on market comes close of that.

Last edited by SoNic_real_one; 24th November 2011 at 02:53 PM.
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Old 24th November 2011, 04:38 PM   #26
KOON3876 is offline KOON3876
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So, now we have over 140dB (DAC - LPF)? DSD only needs LPF to get back to analog.
you just need low noise LPF
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Old 25th November 2011, 02:04 AM   #27
KOON3876 is offline KOON3876
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There are several DSD to WAV program already, but I made for myself to study.
Frustrating Slow... Noise Level = -135dB. Simple, below 500 lines.
Attached Images
File Type: png My_DSD_to_WAV.png (69.2 KB, 380 views)
Attached Files
File Type: txt DSDtoWAV01.cpp.txt (12.7 KB, 45 views)
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Old 25th November 2011, 04:00 PM   #28
KOON3876 is offline KOON3876
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SoNic_real_one View Post
Try a wav file that is higher in frequency, since DSD it has less capability there.
OK 20kHz 24bit WAV -(mine)> DSD -(KORG)> 24bit WAV, still there are no noise > -140dB.
48/96 is not natural for DSD.. I can not convert them linearly.
Attached Images
File Type: png 20khz44_24.WAV.dsf.44.wav.png (69.3 KB, 76 views)
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Old 26th November 2011, 12:40 AM   #29
SoNic_real_one is offline SoNic_real_one  United States
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Yes, but you will see them in "nature"
Can you extend the graph past 22kHz or is a brickwall there in the Korg?
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Old 26th November 2011, 02:39 AM   #30
KOON3876 is offline KOON3876
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Hi, I can not see over 22050, by WaveSpectra.
if I convert 88200/24bit wav, I will see noise curve attached "DSD_noise_Shaper.png".
(my program only handles 44100 now)
I set Zero point at 0.95, 0.74, 0.42 = 20947Hz, 16317Hz, 9261Hz.
These points and noise_floor are trade-off.
(noise lowered dB * lowered freq area) < (noise shaped dB * shaped freq area)

oh, KORG can handle 88/24. I tested 1kHz-88-24.wav to dsf to wav.
it shows -160dB range.
-101dB: 30000Hz
-88dB: 44000Hz
So, If I use LPF cutoff at 25000, 4th ButterWorth,
Then 44000Hz noise goes to -88dB - 10log(1+(44000/25000)^8) = -107dB.
maybe it's OK.
anyway I can not notice over 18500
Attached Images
File Type: png DSD_noise_Shaper.png (29.1 KB, 77 views)
File Type: png 1KHz88_24_wav_korg_dsf_wav.png (85.1 KB, 77 views)
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