Do you have evidence for that? The XLF still uses Focal W-cones in the bass. I suspect that the low tweeter X-over point (1khz) was the driver for a new supplier. But I could be wrong...
Both are Focal, but Focal doesn't sell them to Wilson, but to Orca in the US, who is Focal's car speaker distributor there. It is run by a frenchman. And indeed, these drivers are basically customized car subwoofers, both with W cones.
For £500 you can get a replacement Beryllium tweeter from Focal, the TI version cost probably a tenth of it. Focal never sold the Be tweeter to any other company but their own.
No I don't, but I know it from management people at Focal when I worked there as in engineer some time ago. And yes, the Focal dome couldn't handle 1kHz, but I'm sure the Scan tweeter couldn't do it either. On the paper, yes. No tweeter with 1" or 1"1/5 voice coil could handle it. Distorsions would be too high, and it wouldn't sound well. But that's another story.
The earlier Al/Mg Focal dome's could barely handle 2 kHz well. They were super-cheap motors. Under-damped and ragged. AFAIK, Wilson used them with changes to the back to reduce internal reflections. Made for impressive looking cases, but essentially inexpensive work.
For Focal to stop selling to Wilson probably was just about volume. Wilson was probably ordering too few and the cost was too low to make sense for Focal to keep a separate line item.
Focal continues to use severely under-sized motors in all of the Be tweeters I've seen so far. They may charge 500 British Pounds, but they are not anywhere near the construction quality of a ScanSpeak tweeter, at any level. The Sopra line's measurements for flatness and especially linearity are absolutely appalling for any speaker, let alone one with pretensions to the high-end. I'm sure switching from Focal to the Vifa D27 was a huge step up for Wilson.
Best,
Erik
For Focal to stop selling to Wilson probably was just about volume. Wilson was probably ordering too few and the cost was too low to make sense for Focal to keep a separate line item.
Focal continues to use severely under-sized motors in all of the Be tweeters I've seen so far. They may charge 500 British Pounds, but they are not anywhere near the construction quality of a ScanSpeak tweeter, at any level. The Sopra line's measurements for flatness and especially linearity are absolutely appalling for any speaker, let alone one with pretensions to the high-end. I'm sure switching from Focal to the Vifa D27 was a huge step up for Wilson.
Best,
Erik
Last edited:
Well Wilson 'claim' a 1.2kHz crossover and I have checked that on a couple of reviews, so it's not a mistype. So it's a crap speaker or they really did burn 3 years getting it to work.
Note: The XLF does have a big dip at 2.5kHz , possible to give good stage depth (known trick). will certainly also relieve pressure on the tweeter.
Last edited:
Looking at the impedance curves of the XLF, I call ********.
Sorry where I come from B***Sh** is an engineering term used to describe a vendor's halcion optimism of their specs. I meant to say "I call it lies."
Best,
Erik
Sorry, I don't agree. Focal have had huge motors, especially for the T120 tweeter (94mm against 72mm used by most tweeters incl. some Scan tweeters, the D2805 series). All the Be tweeters have N35 neodymium magnets, and they are strong. The tweeter used in the latest Utopia series, called the series III or EM, uses 5 circular neo magnets with a 2.2 Tesla force. The SPL reaches a real 94dB.
I agree that Scan-Speak designs real nice and sophisticated motor systems, Focal maybe not so noble but still powerfull and efficient.
Yes. The SS tweeters, as well as the Seas Be tweeters are certainly good tweeters, but the Focals are still the better ones. There are obvious reasons:
- the inverted dome technology obviously works
- due to a large emitting surface, all of these tweeters have a 27 to 28mm dome. The SS and Seas use 28mm voice coils, whereas Focal is using a 19mm VC - lighter.
- Focal, among Yamaha and T.A.D. is a pioneer in designing Be tweeters, the other just followed (I just read that SB Acoustic is also now offering a Be tweeter, maybe it's the one that can beat the Focals?).
- the inverted dome technology obviously works
- due to a large emitting surface, all of these tweeters have a 27 to 28mm dome. The SS and Seas use 28mm voice coils, whereas Focal is using a 19mm VC - lighter.
- Focal, among Yamaha and T.A.D. is a pioneer in designing Be tweeters, the other just followed (I just read that SB Acoustic is also now offering a Be tweeter, maybe it's the one that can beat the Focals?).
What are you two talking about? You couldn't tell a difference in
a blind test between a $50 Dayton Audio and a $500 Focal Be.
I could...
What do you mean by inverted dome's technology works? If they were so great, wouldn't we see more manufacturers using them? Lighter, but less power handling and cannot be crossed as low. So because something is newer, they're just a follower and can't be as good? Now you're really reaching.
- Status
- This old topic is closed. If you want to reopen this topic, contact a moderator using the "Report Post" button.